CFA

[Just_A_Mom]

Application kit came Saturday--- finally!

Interesting Stats in the CFA instructions - WP published the Average score for each event by gender. I don't know whether it is safe to assume that these scores are of all of those who took the test or those who passed the test. Here goes:

Average Performance scores by event and gender

Event------- Male --------Female
BB Throw----- 67 ft --------41 ft
Pull-Ups -------9 ----------- 3
Flex Arm hang n/a ----------19.8 sec Note: 1 pullup gives a higher score than any flex arm hang
Shuttle Run --9.1 sec ------10 sec
Crunches ------72 ----------68
Push-ups ------54 ----------33
1 Mile run -----6:43 --------8:06


Maximum Performance scores by event and gender

Event-------- Male --------Female
BB Throw -----102 ft --------66 ft
Pull-Ups -------18 ------------7
Shuttle Run---- 7.8 sec ------8.6 sec
Crunches -------95----------- 95
Push-ups -------75 -----------50
1 Mile run -----5:20 ----------6:00

[BR2011]

I would assume that those are the averages for all that took the test.


BTW how is the average amount of pullups 9, but pushups is only 54? i can barely do 7-8 pullups but can easily do 70-80 pushups. they use similar muscles. are these the results of the tests that were used to get in? because if so, i would guess that some people didnt quite go all the way down on their pullups...

[Just_A_Mom]

One reason maybe that push-ups actually are a function of your core strength. You can have great bicep, shoulder strength but if you core is not strong I doubt you can do a lot of pushups.

One more thing--- these are the Averages from West Point. The Averages from USAFA and USNA are probably lower............:shake: :biggrin: :yllol:

Anyone out there with a sense of humor??? Anyone??

[USNA69]

I've spent all morning trying to narrow my list of responses to below 10. When i can get it down to two or three, I'll let you know.

[Just_A_Mom]

You're stalling ...I doubt you have any response at all.

[USNA69]

Yea but give me a day or so and I will come up with something.

[Harrison]

BTW how is the average amount of pullups 9, but pushups is only 54? i can barely do 7-8 pullups but can easily do 70-80 pushups. they use similar muscles. are these the results of the tests that were used to get in? because if so, i would guess that some people didnt quite go all the way down on their pullups...

I bet it's because of all us cross country runners! If you can do 80 pushups, you've probably got a lot of muscle on you and are heavier, and so pull-ups are that much harder. I can't even do 54 push-ups but I can do a few pullups above average. It seems like pullups really depend on your weight as much as your strength.

And I'm hoping those averages are for the admitted kids! But 80% of applicants are physically qualified so who nkows. Either way I have a lot of work to do :)

[BR2011]

then i guess i'm weird because i weight about 150 pounds. its probably because ive never done pullups the way you do in the military (i used to do them with my knuckles facing away from me). and if what just a mom says is true about pushups using core, then i guess that explains it. my baseball workouts were about 75% core stuff, so im pretty strong there.

[Just_A_Mom]

It is not only how much you weigh but how your weight is distributed. If you are built lean like a long distance runner then you have less weight to pull up on the bar and more muscle (and less body fat) to pull up your body.
My daughter complains about this all the time. She has seen girls who are not particularly athletic, who are built tiny be able to do pullups. She is an athlete with a very well developed core and has very strong upper leg muscles. She has difficulty doing one pullup but can do pushups all day long.

All this can be overcome with upper body weight training and practicing. A good way to practice is to do reverse pullups. Have someone help you up on the bar and then slowly lower yourself to hang.

[USNA69]

Quote:
"One more thing--- these are the Averages from West Point. The Averages from USAFA and USNA are probably lower............"
"You're stalling ...I doubt you have any response at all."


Good observation. You are quick to note what the Academies have been dealing with forever. No candidate can be perfect in everything and the academies do have to compromise. WP goes for the "brawn" over "brain" and USNA is just the opposite.

[ChipAyten]

Well USNA69 its pretty obvious... WP grads go on to do the grunt work and stick it out fighting the enemy from 5 feet away, ya know the important stuff,:thumb: the stuff most other units of the military exist soley to support. While USNA grads go on to fly their pretty little jets or sit comfortably in their cute boats. :shake: :biggrin:

Except for the USNA marines... good job to them, but not the marine pilots... shame on you.:thumbdown: And shame on the armys 15 MOS's bad choice, dont do that again. :thumbdown:

JK good job to everybody, we all have our pourpose and job :cool:

[sylvan]

Quote:
"One more thing--- these are the Averages from West Point. The Averages from USAFA and USNA are probably lower............"
"You're stalling ...I doubt you have any response at all."


Good observation. You are quick to note what the Academies have been dealing with forever. No candidate can be perfect in everything and the academies do have to compromise. WP goes for the "brawn" over "brain" and USNA is just the opposite.
Excellent point.
We had Eisenhower, you had Carter.:redface:

[USNA69]

Excellent point.
We had Eisenhower, you had Carter.:redface:
Ouch. Touche. Hopefully we will have McCain to even up things a bit.

[cgarcia]

Yeah... pullups. I can pump out 100 pushups no sweat but I can do 6-7 pushups (crappy ones at that) before my fingers rip off. Unfortunately, I was "blessed" with gigantic legs. Oh, they're ripped and I can fireman's carry a 300 pounder, but my melon-sized calves are nothing but deadweight for those pullups. No problem hauling myself up a rapelling wall or net, but something about hefting that dead weight over a bar gets to me.

[concernedmom]

The CFA is the last piece of my son's packet that needs to be received at West Point. He took his test, but he is wondering if he should retake it before submitting it because he had a low score on the basketball throw or is it better to go ahead and send it now so that his file is actually complete? Thanks in advance for any advice that you can offer.
Here are his results:

Basketball Throw: 54 ft.
Pull ups: 8
Sit ups: 94
Push ups: 59
Shuttle run: 8.9 seconds
One mile run: 6:33

[TXDAD]

My son was told to treat the published averages as minimum scores. You might be able to get away with being a little under in one exercise, if you do exceptionally well in another. The pull ups seem to be the problem area for lots of kids. Usually, but not always, those kids are a little heavier and not of cross country variety. If there score is low in pull ups, the score needs to be high in push ups according to one field rep. Good luck. BEAT NAVY.

[raimius]

Except for the throw, those are respectable numbers. If your son has high grades/test scores and good EC's, I would complete the file.

If he knows he can do significantly better, he could do it again. It could also boost his score by improving on other events to.
I guess it depends on how well his other areas support his "whole person score."

[radawsonco]

I would assume that those are the averages for all that took the test.


BTW how is the average amount of pullups 9, but pushups is only 54? i can barely do 7-8 pullups but can easily do 70-80 pushups. they use similar muscles. are these the results of the tests that were used to get in? because if so, i would guess that some people didnt quite go all the way down on their pullups...

you said it. ive seen kids wiggle and do all sorts of things to get up

[raimius]

Actually, pull-ups should use the lats, more than anything, while push-ups tend to use the pectorals mostly...if done correctly!

A lot of people tend to use their shoulders and biceps for pull-ups, and triceps for push-ups.

[Texas Dad]

Are there minimum requirements to the physical fitness tests? If so, anyone know them for each event?

Are candidates ranked by the physical fitness results? Is there an advantage to scoring well or is the goal just to hit the minimum number or at least the averages?

[TXDAD]

In my earlier post I said that my son was told that he should treat the averages as the minimum scores. There have been, however, a number of posts on this and other web sites from kids that got in that had a bad event, eg., one in which their result in a specific event was below the published average.


The CFA is a component of every candidate's "total candidate score" which the Admissions Office calculates as part of the admissions process. My recollection is that the CFA accounts for ten percent of the "total candidate score." As a result, every candidate should try to maximize his or her score on each CFA event as it will directly effect his or her "total candidate score." A MALO told us that in the spring the difference in the "total candidate score" of a candiate that gets into West Point and one that does not may be a point or two. So don't leave any points on the table!

[WAMom68]

I have never seen a list of minimum scores. I don’t think there is one. Physical fitness is 10% of the whole candidate score, so the candidate should do their very best on every event.

Check out this link, on page 2 there are maximums and averages for the CFA:
http://www.dhs.wash.k12.ut.us/~gwhicker/index_files/JROTC/New%20Admissions%20Bulletin2006.pdf