Hoping for the best while fearing the worst

[The Commissioner]

My son's USCGA application process is complete. Everything the Academy requests was delivered. The waiting game begins now.

The process started last spring with the successful application to AIM. He told his parents that he had a great experience in New London. He did well on his physical test. His company finished second in the honor competition and first in the drill competition. He got along well with the cadre. Most important, he felt at home at the Academy and hated to leave. His desire to attend a military academy soared through the roof after AIM.

Despite a long list of legitimate and value-added community service work including being elected president of the county 4-H junior leaders, despite being elected president of the student council, despite earning 10 varsity letters in team and individual sports, despite being in the top 10% of his class and taking all the college level courses he can fit in, I am very worried about his chances of acceptance at Coast Guard, much less any academy.

For whatever reason, he hasn't scored well on the standardized tests. He's taken the SAT twice and his best score of 640 in math is weakened by a 540 in verbal. He recently scored a 22 on the ACT. Looking at the scores alone, he appears to be non-competitive.

While we wait, we will be investigating 'safety schools', particularly ones with strong ROTC programs. He's always said that he wants to be a military officer.

I'd like to hear from other parents who've been in the same situation, particularly about applying for a 4-year ROTC scholarship while waiting for news from the academies.

[bossf51]

First, let me say I think your son is a very strong candidate. The SAT's are a factor but not a deal-breaker, IMHO. Did he take them again earlier this month? They will always take the highest scores he gets.

Did he apply early action? He may not be taken for EA, but he could still get an appointment. My son was in that group. He did have higher SAT's but some of his other stats did not measure up to your son's.

It has been said before, but I repeat:the CGA, as with all of the academies, looks at the whole picture.

As far as ROTC, my son went that route as well as a backup. A lot of it depends on which college he applies to, how many kids are looking at that particular school.

My advice to the Commish and Son, relax, take a few deep breaths. If your son accrues additional honors as the year goes on, let his admissions officer know. Good luck!:thumb:

[WAMom68]

My son only applied to USMA but some of this may be applicable to USCGA.

Like your son, my son did not do as well on the standardized tests as he should have. On the SAT he got a 540 on both the math and the verbal. He took the ACT twice and got composite scores of 26 and 27. Based on his 3.86 GPA and the classes he took (almost all honors and AP) we would have expected him to do better on the tests. For some reason he is just not good at these, not sure why, maybe nerves. I was concerned for his chances of getting into USMA because of these scores. In the end he was offered civil prep for a year and then a place at USMA next year, if he does well in college this year. He also had to retake the SAT and ACT. (We don't know his scores yet since he just took the SAT two weeks ago and the ACT this past weekend.) I strongly believe if he had scored better on these tests he would have been in the class of 2010.

At the same time he was applying for USMA he applied for an Army ROTC scholarship. He was awarded a 4 year scholarship at Washington State University and had accepted it because he had not heard from USMA at the time. After he found out he got into the civil prep program, he decided to turn down the ROTC scholarship. If things had not worked out the way they did, I know he would have done well in ROTC. There is absolutely nothing wrong with becoming an officer through ROTC. When he called the ROTC program at WSU to tell them he was not going to be coming there after all, he was given a hard time by the officer he spoke to. Basically the Capt. told him "you can do civil prep and be an officer in 5 years, or come here and be an officer in 4 years." For my son, it was not about the fastest route to becoming an officer, but about pursuing his dream of graduating from West Point, so he chose civil prep. I am not telling you about this to discourage your son from accepting an ROTC scholarship while waiting to hear from the academy. I am only telling you so he can be prepared for this possibility. I am sure the Capt. at WSU was disappointed and that is why he was harsh with my son, but in the end the Army will still get a good man and officer.

My opinion is that your son should definitely apply for ROTC scholarships in addition to the academy. If he does not get into USCGA the first time around he could go to college, do ROTC, and reapply to the academy. By the way, there are some "coasties" in the prep program at NMMI with my son.

Good luck!

[The Commissioner]

Thanks to bossf51 and WAMom68 for your frank and encouraging responses. It's always nice to hear from others who've blazed the application process trail.

I contacted the Army ROTC recruiting officer at my alma mater and learned from him that the deadline for the 4-year scholarship application is 1 DEC. He said my son can apply even though he hasn't chosen a civilian school yet. That appears to be the next step. I'll be happy for my son (and relieved) when he knows where he will be at this time next year!

[Just_A_Mom]

If your son's primary goal is to serve his country then a ROTC scholarship is a great alternative to a service academy. It is always good to have a plan B and a plan C. My daughter's approach was Service Academy is plan A, then ROTC scholarship, then Plan C is she is not qualfied medically.
Fortunately, she would like to attend the college that offered her a ROTC scholarship even if it doesn't work out. So she is pretty set with her civilian school.
The AROTC scholarship can be done all online and is pretty simple and easy to do. If he is willing to become an officer in the US Army then go for it. When she was offered her scholarship at the interview she explained to the Prof of Military Science that she didn't think she could commit yet because of her service academy applications. He told her that is would be no problem for her to get out of the scholarship and that last year he lost his #1 applicant to West Point.
No doubt the senior year is a long one and full of stressors for both parents and kids. A reasonable goal is to have something in place that he can live with when he graduates.
Best of luck to him and hopefully his first choice - USCGA will come through for him.

[USNA69]

As a BGO, a viable backup plan is an indicator to me that the candidate does indeed want to serve his country. Whether or not the candidate is pursuing a ROTC scholarship is a mandatory question on our interviews.

Additionally, there are Coast Guard billets at the Naval Academy Prep School. Someone correct me please, but I think there are a half dozen or so Coast Guard midshipmen candidates there annually.

[Zaphod]

Many more than that unless they've changed things, which I doubt in this case.

I'm giving estimates based on memory, but of my NAPS class of approximately 220 (at the beginning) a good 50 or so were USCGA candidates. At an absolute minimum there were 30.

USCGA offered me a slot at NAPS, but they were beaten by USNA by three days. Of course, USNA was my first choice, so some other lucky USCGA hopeful got that slot. :thumb:

[USNA69]

You are correct. Found it the second time I went to the NAPS website. Coast Guard annually sends 35-40 and USMMA 20-25. Had no idea it was that many. A great opportunity.

[Zaphod]

You are correct.

Can I quote you on that? :yllol:

35-40 would make sense seeing as the classes don't seem to be as big anymore.

[USNA69]

Can I quote you on that? .

You had better. It will probably be one of the very few times that I will say it.:shake:

[Zaphod]

Once is enough!

:yllol:

[kwyjibo247]

Does it look bad in an interview, if you don't apply to a ROTC?

[bossf51]

I don't think so. You generally stand on your own merits and qualifications. Applying for ROTC might help you a bit but not applying will not hurt you. It's a good plan B option but not a deal-breaker.

[USNA69]

Does it look bad in an interview, if you don't apply to a ROTC?
Let's fast forward to your interview, kwyjibo247. You will be asked why you want to go to an Academy. If your response is a variation of the statement that you want to serve your country, what will you answer when the interviewer asks the follow up question of what your plans will be if you are not accepted at the Academy? Going to a civilian school, majoring in basket weaving, and backpacking around the world to "find" yourself after graduation doesn't cut it. You should demonstrate a backup plan that will allow you to serve your country.

[kwyjibo247]

I would say I would go to civilian college for a year than re-apply. Which is what I would plan to do.

If you plan on re-applying the next year to the academy, can you be in ROTC? Cause if you can I woujld, but I'm not sure how you could.

[USNA69]

If you plan on re-applying the next year to the academy, can you be in ROTC? Cause if you can I woujld, but I'm not sure how you could.

Yes, ROTC units are able to nominate directly to the academies.

[radawsonco]

Did the USCGA notify you that his file is complete?

[vmaguire]

My son is primarily interested in a Coast Guard career, not necessarily a career in the Army, Navy, Air Force or Marine Corps. This last week he had me travel to The Citadel since they have a Coast Guard Auxiliary unit. The Citadel has many ROTC options. Since his primary interest is the Coast Guard he has decided that he doesn't want to pursue ROTC appointments but would rather seek grants, scholarships and loans to reach his goal of earning a commission in the Coast Guard.

I'm impressed as I watch him work the situation. He has been accepted to The Citadel and Norwich University. His first choice among them is The Citadel. He also is a freshman in college now and applied for a non military alternative as plan C. He is wait listed with the Coast Guard Academy so he sent an email to The Citadel informing them he was wait listed at the Coast Guard Academy, which is his first choice. The precess and stress have helped him mature over the past year. He is focused and has never panicked. This weekend he ditched plan C and is focusing on Plan A - he is fully organized for either but is really holding out for the USCGA. WHatever happens most of the candidates I believe will have learned a little and grown through the process.

[LineInTheSand]

Check www.gocoastguard.com too for the various commissioning sources for the Coast Guard. There are a few (obviously, ROTC is not one of them).

[vmaguire]

When speaking to my son Bobby about plan B he has mentioned Prep school. He told me that the two schools used by the USCGA are Marion in Alabama and the New Mexico Military Institute. He never mentioned NAPS. He has been very complete in his research so I'm not really confident about NAPS.

My son went as far as to apply for and be accepted to Marion, just in case. I suspect the USCGA has to "send" you to MArion or NMMI - just going on your own probably wouldn't help.

[LineInTheSand]

Correct. Also, NAPS is not longer used by the U.S. Coast Guard Academy as a prep school.

Check out the gocoastguard website though, under the officer section there are some great things, even for straight civilian colleges. I work with a woman who took advantage of one of the programs.

[vmaguire]

Thanks - I'll ask him if he has checked out this site yet. RIght now if he doesn't receive an appointment, and doesn't get one pf the prep school slots he plans on going the Citadel and pursuing (a rather expensive) path to a Coast Guard commission b ygoingroughe Citadel and going OCS afterwards.

[LineInTheSand]

Great, and with that option, there is a way to have the Coast Guard pay for two years of that undergrad education, and then attend OCS after graduation,

[Luigi59]

Great, and with that option, there is a way to have the Coast Guard pay for two years of that undergrad education, and then attend OCS after graduation,

But I don't think The Citadel qualifies as a Historically Black College under the CSPI program.

[bruno]

I thought that you might find this interesting - it's from the March 2009 VMI "Institute Report" about commissioning opportunities in the USCG. I believe that Citadel is also a participant in the Coast Guard DCSS program. No money involved during schooling but it is an option to get commissioned into the USCG without having to go thru the 4 month OCS program.

Cadets Explore Coast Guard Commissioning Opportunity
By Bob Holland

In addition to the Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines, VMI cadets now have a fifth branch of service as a commissioning opportunity: the U.S. Coast Guard. On Feb. 23, two Coast Guard representatives visited the Career Services Office after Lt. Col. Gary Bissell, associate registrar, had e-mailed an open invitation to interested cadets. Sixteen showed up, and others have expressed interest. There will be follow-up visits.
Petty Officer Luke D’Lima noted that the cadets “seemed extremely interested in this program and had some excellent questions regarding the DCSS [Direct Commission Selected School] graduate program.” “The great thing,” he added, “is that a majority of the students were graduating in May and December of 2010, which gives them the time to research and get more information about DCSS and see whether this might be something they would be interested in.”

Although their decision-making must be on a faster track, some 1st Class cadets were also looking into what the Coast Guard offers. “I think that this is a great opportunity for cadets who have not been on a commissioning track while at the Institute, but are now seriously considering it,” said Cadet Jose Andueza’ 09. “As of right now, I am highly considering this program and will probably go through the application process.”
As Andueza noted, the program is tailor-made for those who have lived the military lifestyle throughout college. VMI is one of only six colleges in the nation that qualify for
DCSS as a result of the high-quality military training offered by their ROTC programs.

The key advantage for graduates of VMI and the other five schools is that the DCSS training last only four weeks, as opposed to the 17 weeks of the regular Officer Candidate School. “Until last month,” commented Cadet Alexa Tarbona ’09, “I really didn’t know what I wanted to do after graduation. I didn’t have a job lined up, nor had I ever considered commissioning. Lieutenant Colonel Bissell’s e-mail caught my attention
and something clicked.“At this point, I can only say that I am extremely excited to have such a tremendous opportunity placed at my feet and am very thankful for the flexibility and ease of this new program with the Coast Guard.”
In 2003, administrative control of the Coast Guard shifted from the Department of Transportation to the newly created Department of Homeland Security. Bissell said the commissioning opportunity provides cadets “another option for serving their country.”
In addition to completing four years of ROTC, a cadet must have a minimum GPA of 2.5 at graduation and pass a physical in order to qualify.

http://www.vmi.edu/WorkArea/showcontent.aspx?id=21043

[LineInTheSand]

DCOs go through a nice quick and dirty 2 week course. The training centers on CG specific indoc.

[mwbluebeard]

does not qualify to my understanding as a HBCU.

I think the school's minority population (not including foreign students) must be at least 20%.

The 17% number was reported at the parents' meeting I was at there during Pre-Knob visit last week.

[vmaguire]

I was also at the Pre-Knob visit last week. If you went to the ROTC discussion on Friday morning I was the guy that asked about Coast Guard options.

I left with a much better appreciation for the CITADEL. My son spent some time with the Coast Guard Warrant officer. Apparently there are two "paths" cadets take right now at The Citadel. One is to join the Coast Guard Auxiliary. THis costs just $45 a year. With this they get the opportunity to train with the Coast Guard on some "field" exercises. The other is the Coast Guard Reserve - some number of Cadets join the reserves. The Citadel is pursuing a Direct Commission option for the Coast Guard. No guarantees but they hope to have one in place by 2012 or 2013. At any rate there are post graduation options for the Coast Guard.

We also visited Norwich University. He was attracted to Norwich since the Commandant is a former CG Admiral. I don't remember his name off hand.

[go-n-nuts]

I was also at the Pre-Knob visit last week. If you went to the ROTC discussion on Friday morning I was the guy that asked about Coast Guard options.

I left with a much better appreciation for the CITADEL. My son spent some time with the Coast Guard Warrant officer. Apparently there are two "paths" cadets take right now at The Citadel. One is to join the Coast Guard Auxiliary. THis costs just $45 a year. With this they get the opportunity to train with the Coast Guard on some "field" exercises. The other is the Coast Guard Reserve - some number of Cadets join the reserves. The Citadel is pursuing a Direct Commission option for the Coast Guard. No guarantees but they hope to have one in place by 2012 or 2013. At any rate there are post graduation options for the Coast Guard.

We also visited Norwich University. He was attracted to Norwich since the Commandant is a former CG Admiral. I don't remember his name off hand.


http://www.norwich.edu/about/president2.html

Here is a link with the info on Admiral Schneider

[J Collins]

Cal Maritime has a great CG commissioning program.. that was my dd's choice after the Academies

[Just_A_Mom]

But I don't think The Citadel qualifies as a Historically Black College under the CSPI program.

Luigi - The Citadel might not qualify under the CSPI program but I don't think being a HBCU is a requirement. There are a number of colleges that are Hispanic serving and qualify as well, from my understanding.

[Just_A_Mom]

My son went as far as to apply for and be accepted to Marion, just in case. I suspect the USCGA has to "send" you to MArion or NMMI - just going on your own probably wouldn't help.

I just saw this.... my daughter has a good friend who was not sponsored by the CG but went to Marion. The academy did not work out for her but she is graduating with her associates and will move on in the CSPI program.
Marion was very supportive and helpful in her achieving this goal.
I might be worth speaking with the folks down there. The CSPI program is a very good deal, anyone who doesn't get into the Academy should check into it.

[Luigi59]

Luigi - The Citadel might not qualify under the CSPI program but I don't think being a HBCU is a requirement. There are a number of colleges that are Hispanic serving and qualify as well, from my understanding.

To get the USCG to pay for two years of undergraduate education under the College Student Pre-Commissioning Initiative, you must be a sophomore or junior undergraduate student enrolled or accepted for enrollment in a bachelor degree program at an accredited college or university designated as:


Historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCU) click here for accredited universities (http://www.ed.gov/about/inits/list/whhbcu/edlite-list.html)
Hispanic Association of Colleges and Universities (HACU) click here for accredited universities (http://hacu.net/)
Tribal Colleges and Universities (TCU) click here for accredited universities (http://www.ed.gov/about/inits/list/whtc/edlite-tclist.html)
Colleges and Universities located in Guam, Puerto Rico and the U.S. Virgin Islands


My advice about CSPI, Blue21, OCS, or any of the Direct Entry programs is to speak with a Coast Guard Recruiter, not an Academy Admissions Partner or anyone from the USCGA.

[vmaguire]

My son actually applied to these two schools and was accepted. His logic was that if he was awarded the option of going to either school he would be all set. I have convince him that these schools are great options if awarded under the CGAS program but it would be risky to hope for an appointment to the CGA from there without being a CGAS student. Right now his backup plan is the Citadel.
He has not applied to any other Service Academy nor for an ROTC scholarship. From the research he has done he has come to the conclusion that going to another Service Academy or accepting a ROTC scholarship would equate to forfeiting his goal of being a commissioned officer in the Coast Guard. I explained to him that we would have to split the Citadel cost and he is willing to do that - and he understands what that means. This last year he took all the money he saved since birth and paid for his first year of college!!! He had a 3.5 first semester and is on track for a 4.0 this semester.
I'm - as you can see - very proud of where he is in life and how he is handling his CGA dream. I am confident that whatever path he takes to the Coast Guard he will make it.

[Just_A_Mom]

Luigi - thanks for posting the link. CSPI can be a great option for the right person.

vmaguire - best of luck to your son!

[Luigi59]

Luigi - thanks for posting the link. CSPI can be a great option for the right person.


Yes, it can be.

But let's not overlook what bruno was posting about earlier either - direct commission (DCSS) programs where graduates of specific colleges (below) can bypass OCS and all basic training to commission as an O-1 or O-2.

Norwich University
Prairie View A&M University
Texas A&M University
Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University
Virginia Military Institute
Mary Baldwin College, Virginia Women’s Institute for Leadership

Graduates from State or Federal Maritime Academies who hold a Third Mate or Third Assistant Engineer license, or a degree major in Marine Environmental Protection are also eligible.

As posted before, my advice about CSPI, Blue21, OCS, or any of the Direct Entry programs is to speak with a Coast Guard Recruiter for more information.

[officer]

Luigi,

I don't know if you have time to do this or not, but check out the Greystone program at Schreiner College in Kerrville, TX and tell me what you think. I live 30 minutes from this school. Thanks -officer

[vmaguire]

Yes, it can be.

But let's not overlook what bruno was posting about earlier either - direct commission (DCSS) programs where graduates of specific colleges (below) can bypass OCS and all basic training to commission as an O-1 or O-2.

Norwich University
Prairie View A&M University
Texas A&M University
Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University
Virginia Military Institute
Mary Baldwin College, Virginia Women’s Institute for Leadership

Graduates from State or Federal Maritime Academies who hold a Third Mate or Third Assistant Engineer license, or a degree major in Marine Environmental Protection are also eligible.

As posted before, my advice about CSPI, Blue21, OCS, or any of the Direct Entry programs is to speak with a Coast Guard Recruiter for more information.

I'm surprised that The Citadel is not on this list. I will contact them to find out. My son has also been selected to Norwich - thats Plan C. And yes if you are wondering he has a plan D and E. Let me know if Citadel was left out on purpose - they told us they are working towards a direct commissioning program.

Thanks.

[Texmom]

If you search this forum, you will find some very interesting reading about Greystone.

[Eagle]

What are the benefits of Direct Commission and OCS as compared to the Academy?

[officer]

If you search this forum, you will find some very interesting reading about Greystone.

Texmom: WOW, Did I get an eye full after I searched the forum on Greystone. I had no idea it was such a hot button. Anyway, thanks for suggesting the "search" feature. I need to use it more often. I'm enjoying this forum so much and learning alot each time I read. I'm still pretty green however. I was wondering, what is the difference between NROTC and ROTC. My greeness is showing:biggrin: -officer

[Luigi59]

Texmom: WOW, Did I get an eye full after I searched the forum on Greystone. I had no idea it was such a hot button. Anyway, thanks for suggesting the "search" feature. I need to use it more often. I'm enjoying this forum so much and learning alot each time I read. I'm still pretty green however. I was wondering, what is the difference between NROTC and ROTC. My greeness is showing:biggrin: -officer

ROTC is generic.

NROTC is Navy ROTC.

AROTC is Army ROTC.

Guess what AFROTC is? :wink:

[officer]

Sheepish Grin:redface: I don't even read any board except the CGuard. We are sold out USCGA fans, so it didn't even register. Thanks as always Luigi!:smile: