Nom question

I pulled up son's WP file site...and saw the nom is already posted!! I had assumed the senator's office had just called and would submit slate and it would be a while...but it's already posted! Does that mean he was their primary nom?

Your son has an LOA and a nomination to USMA so it is a moot point whether he has a primary nomination or not. It is my understanding that the candidates with LOAs and nominations are not included in the ranking of a MOC's nomination slate. I am sure someone will be along shortly to explain more lucidly than me!

Each nomination is posted to the prospective candidate's admissions page as soon as USMA receives the notification. In the "nominations received" box the state is listed with the Senator's or Congressman's district number next to it. For example, GA09 in the "nominations received" box means the nomination came from Georgia Congressional District 9. Each USMA nomination received will be listed in this box. I do not know the code for the Vice Presidential, Presidential, or ROTC nominations. I do think that the USMA admissions process is wonderfully efficient.

Here is a recent thread from our own amazing USNA69 that may answer some of your questions. http://www.serviceacademyforums.com/showthread.php?t=1757&highlight=nominations .

Typically the MOC will not grant a principal slot to a candidate with an LOA.

MOC's submit their nominations electronically through an online system so it is highly probable that a nomination will be reflected on the system very quickly.

nom

It's all very confusing. But like Antoinette said, moot...because it's there: yipee!! Now, if I can just hijack the appointment when it comes and put it under the Christmas tree....

Antoinette said:

It is my understanding that the candidates with LOAs and nominations are not included in the ranking of a MOC's nomination slate.

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A common misconception which I attempted to explain earlier this week in my It’s That Time of the Year thread.

A popular misconception is that LOAs do not require nominations. Not true. They are treated just like everyone else above. If they receive their MOCs primary nomination, it will be charged against that MOCs annual allotment. If they do not receive a primary nomination, they will be placed in the national pool with all the others. USNA, and AFA, I think, only offer less than 10% of the class, around 100, LOAs, and by nature of their selectivity, should the LOA not receive a primary nomination, an at large appointment is assured. Bottom line, even with an LOA, pursue all nominations available.

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The vast majority of the MOCs, according to the USNA CGA, submit competitive slates. This means they only submit the names and let the academies select the primary nomination. If this is the case, the appointment may not be granted until as late as April when all the candidates’ packages are complete and evaluated. A few play games. Should a MOC not give an LOA, his best candidate, his primary nomination, that LOA will enter the national pool and only be given an appointment after all the primary appointments are filled.

As far as how each MOC submits his slate, some leave it up to the selection committee to decide.

This is where I take issue with USNA69 - (watch for fireworks!)

For USMA and LOA's ONLY---

If you have an LOA - seek a nomination from all sources - but you only need to get "a nomination". You don't have to be the top candidate on the slate or get more than one nomination.

If you are not the top candidate the appointment that goes to the top candidate will be charged to that MOC - you will still get an appointment and they will probably take it from the national pool. This scenario will not delay your appointment. Even if your nomination ends up coming from the national pool - they work that out later in the process.

Most congressmen will not rank - they prefer to allow the academy to make the selection - the academy prefers this and really this is the way for them to get the best incoming class.
If the congressman doesn't rank and submits 10 names - those with LOA's will often rank highest in total points but not always. The academy makes the offer to the candidate who is triple qualified with the most total number of points. If the candidate with the LOA is not highest ranking they still get their appointment.

A candidate with an LOA could have an appointment that is charged to the MOC - esp in a weaker district where all candidates are not 3 q'd or where some choose other schools.
Remember - not every candidate with a nom will choose the academy, some will not be medically qualified or there may be other problems hindering an appointment. So it is common to see some attrition in that list of 10 names.

IF the MOC ranks his candidates - they will either rank them 1-10 or names the primary and makes the rest "alternates".
Most saavy MOC's who have a candidate with an LOA will actually rank or name a primary. This ensures that he will have another candidate from his district get an appointment. Remember with an LOA you only need to be on the slate you do not need to be the primary. If the MOC names another candidate as the primary then he is getting two for the price of one -so to speak. In other words he doesn't want the academy to name his LOA as primary - since the LOA winner is an academy pick already - and he will name another candidate.
This is called playing the game.......

Is everyone sufficiently confused? I hope so!

nom

No, actually, that makes it clear! Thanks!

Just_A_Mom said:

you will still get an appointment and they will probably take it from the national pool. This scenario will not delay your appointment. Even if your nomination ends up coming from the national pool - they work that out later in the process.

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Federal Code Title 10 does not address LOAs. They have been created by the SAs for their own gains. The Code specifically states that all primary nominations must be completed prior to filling the national pool. USNA follows the letter of the law. I don't know about the rest.

You are correct in that my responses have been pretty much USNA specific.

I wonder what the wording is on an LOA from USNA - does it say you have to secure a primary nomination?

Let's say you have an LOA winner who gets a nomination from Joe Congressman. Joe dutifully submits his slate of 10 on Dec 1st. Joe has a problem - his sister's husband's cousin's niece also applied for the nomination. She has been told since she was 12 that she would get it. Since blood is thicker that water and Joe needs to take care of family he designates the relative as the principle. This is legal (not right but legal) and the academy must appoint her if she is 3 q'd.

So, are you going to tell me that the LOA winner has to wait until March for his appointment from the national pool? The academy hand picked this kid and he has met all the requirements of the LOA - he IS going to get an appointment but making him wait 4 more months would not only be cruel but the academy would risk losing him to another really good school. like West Point .

In any case - I think there is a lot of shuffling that goes on. Compared to the total number of appointments the academy gives the number of LOA's is not all that big. Most probably do rank the highest on the MOC's slate - for the few who do not then I would think they would give them a Supe's nom, VP nom (if they applied for it) or one out of the pool. They can give the appointment under one nomination then shuffle them around later to build the best class possible.

Just_A_Mom said:

I wonder what the wording is on an LOA from USNA - does it say you have to secure a primary nomination?

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Of course not. Even though it would be a great idea. It would prevent MOCs from playing their little games.

Just_A_Mom said:

So, are you going to tell me that the LOA winner has to wait until March for his appointment from the national pool? The academy hand picked this kid and he has met all the requirements of the LOA - he IS going to get an appointment but making him wait 4 more months would not only be cruel but the academy would risk losing him to another really good school. like West Point.

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The vast majority, around 80% of candidates who come to USNA, select it as their only SA choice. USNA does not have to resort to used-car salesman tactics to fill their quotas. The candidates who apply, want solely to be there.

Just_A_Mom said:

They can give the appointment under one nomination then shuffle them around later to build the best class possible.

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The thing that you are ignoring here is the fact that the MOC should announce the appointments of successful candidates in his district. How can a future draft choice to be named later be announced before the primary appointment? It would put the MOC in an uncomfortable position.

Sorry to interrupt, but is it unusual if I haven't heard anything from my congressman or senator. I have heard nothing after I sent my stuff to them, and never got a scheduled interview. Should I call them and ask them...?

All MOCs march to their own individual drums. I don't know if a "usual" statement can be made. Phone calls or emails never hurt. Let us know what you hear.

Just_A_Mom said:

I wonder what the wording is on an LOA from USNA .

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"Dear XXX
We are pleased to advise you that the Admissions Board has found you qualified to compete for admission to the U.S. Naval Academy with the class of 2012. You are guaranteed an offer of appointment if your remaining admissions requirements are completed. . . You must complete the following marked requirements by 1 March 2008. . .
Nomination You should apply to your two U.S. Senators and Representative for a Congressional nomination to the Naval Academy as soon as possible. . .
XXX, we wish you success in the prompt completion of your remining requirements for admission and look forward to welcoming you as a member of the Brigade of Midshipmen."