Naval Academy Prep School under fire

Luigi59

Luigi59

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Naval Academy Prep School under fire

Academy grad asks senator to investigate 'red shirting' recruited athletes

By EARL KELLY, Staff Writer
Annapolis Capital
Published 02/12/11

A Naval Academy graduate has asked Congress to investigate - and possibly abolish - the academy's prep school.

According to Alfred W. Tate, Class of 1964, the Naval Academy Preparatory School (NAPS) has become a way to "red shirt" recruited athletes and give unqualified minority students a back door into the Naval Academy.

In an e-mail on Thursday to U.S. Sen. James Webb, Tate called NAPS, and similar programs run by the U.S. Military Academy and the Air Force Academy, a misuse of federal funds.

"I simply didn't know of any other way to sort this out, and I feel this needs sorting out," Tate said yesterday in a phone interview.

"NAPS and its sister prep schools appear to have become places for parking what only can be described as red-shirt freshmen for the service academies which are themselves increasingly indistinguishable from the football factories most of our major universities have become," Tate wrote to Webb. "At a time of huge and growing federal deficits, the expenditure of taxpayer money for such a purpose is indefensible, particularly when funding for fleet and Marine Corps combat readiness may be in jeopardy."

Read the rest of the article HERE
 
Thread already started in Prep School forum, but since more traffic here , I'll comment:

First, the headline is misleading as Tate has all SA Prep Schools as his targets.

Next, Tate spent 24 years as a congressional staffer and couldn't "sort this out". I know 50+
legislative staffer types that could "sort this out" in 3-4 weeks. I do, however applaud the former congressional aide
for e-mailing a U.S. Sen. with his concerns.

Lastly, I hope Sen. Webb investigates all the prep schools, if he deems it necessary.
 
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MakeItHappen said:
I know 50+
legislative staffer types that could "sort this out" in 3-4 weeks. I do, however applaud the former congressional aide
for e-mailing a U.S. Sen. with his concerns.
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Well maybe you can call your staffer friends and have them fix the countless issues they're ignoring...

Of course, how dare someone contact his elected officials...its only tax dollars at work.
 
LineInTheSand said:
Well maybe you can call your staffer friends and have them fix the countless issues they're ignoring...

Of course, how dare someone contact his elected officials...its only tax dollars at work.
Click to expand...

This would be the countless non-academy issues they're ignoring. Turn on the news for an hour to see what I'm talking about...believe me, the gentleman is not alone in calling his elected officials.
 
MakeItHappen said:
First, the headline is misleading as Tate has all SA Prep Schools as his targets.
Click to expand...

I think the story makes that clear.

MakeItHappen said:
Lastly, I hope Sen. Webb investigates all the prep schools, if he deems it necessary.
Click to expand...

I concur.

IMHO, the 3 taxpayer-funded Prep schools should exist for one reason only - to prepare enlisted personnel (who have been out of school for while) to enter the academy.

There is no other valid reason for them. Period.
 
What's tough about the prep schools is that some really great people go there, including some who are recruited athletes. I doubled the SAT score of one of the NAPSters in my plebe summer squad, but he (deservedly) ended up as the top ranked plebe by the end of the summer.
One of the firsties in my company, a four-striper who's Supe's list in an honors major and a really great guy who goes out of his way to help out the underclass, is a NAPSter (and not a recruited athlete or prior). But then again, so is the kid who failed the PRT, got a 1.1 GPA last semester, and has two conduct offenses on his plate. I could go on with more anecdotal evidence that could prove either side.
It does seem kind of odd to reject hundreds of (qualified) applicants only to backdoor-accept for the next class a couple hundred who are admittedly deficient in one way or another. What I'm trying to get at is that it's a mixed bag. I don't think wholesale eliminating the prep schools is the best call, but some more scrutiny is healthy and probably necessary/
 
I think the prep schools should return to their original mission and be available solely to prepare enlisted people for the academies. I absolutely think they should not be used to create a de facto two-tier admission system for the academies. Unfortunately, my Senator does not share my beliefs as evidenced by their response to me:

I strongly believe in equality of opportunity for everyone, regardless of race, creed, or gender. Everyone should have the same equal chance to get an education or a job, or to own a home or live in the neighborhood of their choice. In other words, we all deserve a place at the starting line so that we can then use our own abilities, hard work and dedication to succeed in life.

Unfortunately, our country has yet to fully live up to the promise of equal opportunity for all. The improvements have been great, generations of Americans have worked hard and succeeded, but inequities persist - our public school system remains unequal in some areas of the country and many people who want to work to support their families cannot find jobs because of discrimination.

In my view, this means that in some cases we should help people get to the point where they can compete on a level playing field for jobs and opportunities. I understand the frustrations of those who question why they work and study so hard when in the end decisions seem to be made according to factors beyond their control.

Again, thank you for contacting me. I appreciate knowing your thoughts on this issue.
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:confused1:
 
SAMom said:
Well I can say that my daughter would not be able to attend the academy if it wasn't for NAPS. She has good grades, but terrible SAT scores. She is an awesome athlete and her sport is not offered at NAPS so we believe that she was picked for her leadership ability.

There are some problems with NAPS one being that it is mostly an academic year and not enough military training as my daughter says its nothing like the academy. Another reason is that many of the recruited athletes do not fully understand what they are getting into and they have no idea the magnitude of the sacrifice they will endure in the 5 years. Now we are a college and we do want to be able to compete with other great colleges, so yes we do need away to help some awesome athletes have an opportunity to lead us into athletic completions as well as leading our great country.

A solution would be in the way we recruit the athlete. First and foremost they must understand how hard it will be and what kind of sacrifice they will be making. From talking to some athletes I have learned that they some of the things they are told are a little sugar coated so when reality hits they end up leaving and wasting our tax payer dollars because they cant handle it. Many recruits have never had any type of military background and are pretty shocked.

It would really be sad to see NAPS and other Preparatory schools taken away from some great kids such as my daughter who have worked their butts off and will run circles around many high achieving scholars don't discount these kids lets fix the problems with the program, but don't take away the opportunities. Diversity is a great thing and it makes us a stronger country.
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The counter argument is "Why should the taxpayers fund a prep year for unqualified students?" Why can't these unqualified students "self-prep" and re-apply next year when they are qualified?

Yes, according to the USNA, NAPS only accepts unqualified students. NAPS is used to "qualify" them.

IMHO, NAPS should only be used to prepare enlisted personnel who have received appointments.

The football and lacrosse rosters (for former NAPSters) are all the evidence that is needed to prove it's a red-shirt factory for D-1 athletics.

The "diversity-shaping/racial balancing" argument? Again, why should the taxpayers fund a prep year that discriminates against qualified candidates who were rejected? I'm sure the USNA can find qualified diversity candidates who don't need to be sponsored at NAPS. If they are qualified right out of high school, great. If not, they can certainly go to "Vine-Covered U" or "State U" or "Community College of X" for a year and get themselves qualified.
 
IMHO, NAPS should only be used to prepare enlisted personnel who have received appointments.
Click to expand...

I agree. A great way to improve diversity (in the macro sense) would be to bring in more prior-enlisted personnel. They bring something to USNA that all bright, high school kids simply don't have, especially in time of war. And, if those folks need some additional academic prep to be ready, I'm all for it.
 
Luigi59 said:
The counter argument is "Why should the taxpayers fund a prep year for unqualified students?" Why can't these unqualified students "self-prep" and re-apply next year when they are qualified?

Yes, according to the USNA, NAPS only accepts unqualified students. NAPS is used to "qualify" them.
Click to expand...

The term qualified is both objective and subjective

- academic, leadership, and physical

vs

- a strong desire to serve your country, with some deficiencies that can be fixed.

Shouldn't we as a society, give second chances and help people when we can. Of course, this is different from SA prep schools being abused.
 
To me the real question is how in these economic times can we afford to keep them at the size they are currently at? The DOD budget is being slashed and burned, even the AD world will feel the hit. Can we afford with trillions of debt to keep this part going at the current level?

I also agree I think it should be for prior enlisted. Many have been out of the academic arena for a few yrs., and are a little rusty on things like Calc or Chemistry since their career was not related to graphing sin or co-sin.

Yes, there are great kids who are academically strong, but poor test takers (SAT/ACT), yet the fact is they always have next yr as a college freshman to re-apply. If they truly want the Academy, they will try again and again until they have passed that age req. Just like candidates who get the thin envelope from the SA's. This forum is filled with candidates saying this my 2nd or 3rd time trying.

I am sure I will be slammed for that comment, but that is my opinion. There are candidates who have the exact same grades, EC's etc, but were just avg or slightly above avg test takers and never given the option of NAPs. They made the cut to be 3 Q. Ironical, they weren't smart enough to get into the SA directly, but too smart for NAPS.

NAPS doesn't take the top 100 who didn't get an apptmt from the NWL. If you truly believe it should exist for students who need a little more time academically, shouldn't they take off the NWL who were not given apptmts before anyone else?
 
That silly Annapolis paper. They need to learn they can't have it both ways.....

First they post a prominent article claiming NAPS is under fire and should be 'investigated' for red-shirting athletes.
Today's prominent article (not even in the sports section!!!) is:
http://www.hometownannapolis.com/ne...-propel-Mids-to-opening-lacrosse-victory.html

"Plebes Propel Mids to Opening Lacrosse Victory"

Lovely write up - then you read this:

If yesterday's contest was any indication, fans are going to know the names of Sam Jones, Taylor Reynolds, Tucker Hull and Harrison Chaires quite well by season's end. Those four attackmen, three of which are freshmen, combined to produce 14 points
Click to expand...
and this:
It was a particularly special afternoon for Jones, a third generation Navy lacrosse player. Grandfather Jack Jones is one of the greatest goalies in program history, a first team All-American and winner of the C. Markland Kelly Award in 1954. Father David Jones was captain of the 1982 Navy team.
"I've been dreaming about this since I was 5 years old. I never thought it would happen until sophomore year in high school so this was pretty cool for me," Jones said. "My father and grandfather never pressured me. This was always something I wanted to do."
Jones' five goals were the most by a Navy player since Taylor Harris scored six in March, 2006. The former Capital-Gazette Communications first team All-County selection credited the chemistry he developed with Hull and Chaires at the Naval Academy Prep School and cited the midfielders for creating scoring chances.
Click to expand...
According to Reynolds' biography he also attended NAPS. I guess "The Capital" needs to learn you can't have your cake and eat it too! :wink:

Oh and the victory was against VMI. Not exactly a lax powerhouse.
 
Pima said:
I am sure I will be slammed for that comment, but that is my opinion. There are candidates who have the exact same grades, EC's etc, but were just avg or slightly above avg test takers and never given the option of NAPs. They made the cut to be 3 Q. Ironical, they weren't smart enough to get into the SA directly, but too smart for NAPS.

QUOTE]
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We need to discuss the nomination requirement (I know an old discussion).

I like to add something to your last sentence,

"Ironical, they weren't smart enough to get into SA directly [or their Congressional District was very competitive] . . . ."

It will be very interesting if all SA admit candidates based on strict OML, instead of filling MOC vacancies per MOC than using the national waiting list.

I know several candidates from MD that would have been the primary for their MOC is they lived in a difference Congressional district.
Click to expand...
 
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Just_A_Mom said:
That silly Annapolis paper. They need to learn they can't have it both ways.....

It was a particularly special afternoon for Jones, a third generation Navy lacrosse player. Grandfather Jack Jones is one of the greatest goalies in program history, a first team All-American and winner of the C. Markland Kelly Award in 1954. Father David Jones was captain of the 1982 Navy team.
"I've been dreaming about this since I was 5 years old. I never thought it would happen until sophomore year in high school so this was pretty cool for me," Jones said. "My father and grandfather never pressured me. This was always something I wanted to do."
Jones' five goals were the most by a Navy player since Taylor Harris scored six in March, 2006. The former Capital-Gazette Communications first team All-County selection credited the chemistry he developed with Hull and Chaires at the Naval Academy Prep School and cited the midfielders for creating scoring chances.
Click to expand...

QUOTE]

I wonder what kind of military career Jack Jones and David Jones had?
Click to expand...
 
Just_A_Mom said:
That silly Annapolis paper. They need to learn they can't have it both ways.....
Click to expand...

Not really sure they are looking to have it "both ways."

In fact, the second article confirms the problems that were exposed in the first.

They published a story about NAPS being used as a red-shirt factory for football and lacrosse.

And the next day, they basically confirm that fact with a quote from a plebe, who states that his year (a taxpayer-funded red-shirt year) at NAPS allowed him and his 3 red-shirted teammates to work on their lacrosse skills together without any of them losing a year of eligibility.

Silly? More of an indictment IMHO.
 
We need to discuss the nomination requirement (I know an old discussion).

I like to add something to your last sentence,

"Ironical, they weren't smart enough to get into SA directly [or their Congressional District was very competitive] . . . ."

It will be very interesting if all SA admit candidates based on strict OML, instead of filling MOC vacancies per MOC than using the national waiting list.

I know several candidates from MD that would have been the primary for their MOC is they lived in a difference Congressional district.
Click to expand...

This would be muddying the waters re: even the SA's. That is is the system...every district would be represented for ea SA...I agree with that.

However, what I don't agree with is that to the best of my knowledge the foundation schools do not use this method. In other words, let's say they have 100 slots, they don't one of the 2 options:

1. 2 per state with the highest WCS
2. Top 100 who missed the SA NWL cut off list.

Even on this site, there is a mystery of how someone can get a NAPs back in Sept, with the last update Dec...no insult to anyone who has received one, yet it begs the question, how this system actually works.

How on Sept 27th 2010, before the majority of MOC boards closed for noms, that apptmts to NAPS were given out already? You can't meet an SA board without a nom, and 3 yrs on here I have yet to see anyone, except Presidential to receive one before Oct 1.


Look at SA threads regarding acceptances and they are usually OCT dated.

To me, NAPS already decided candidates that "needed" one more yr of academic guidance. I respect that. However, how fair is it that as taxpayers we pay for that and select them over the other candidates who had the same gpa and a higher SAT?

LET ME MAKE THIS CLEAR: I have no bone in this fight. Our DS opted for personal reasons to go ROTC, and he is AFROTC, not NROTC..again no bone in this fight.

I am saying to those who defend the current program explain to me why they don't take the remaining off the NWL before giving apptmts 6 months prior to the mass mailing? Explain to me why they don't do MOC's...2 per state? Explain to me why we shouldn't give more slots to AD enlisted service members over recruiting athletes? Explain to me why when the DOD budget is being slashed by 10% we, as taxpayers should continue this cost?

Remove personal opinions, approach it from a cost benefit analysis.

I have 2 great friends that did Falcon (NAPS) back in the 80's. Honestly, the military ROI was more than ROI for ROTC.

We are all taxpayers, We will all fight for what impacts us personally, yet in these economic times we need to be realistic and accept we will all be hurt.

I am sure NAPS candidates, cadets and parents will say OCS/OTS/ROTC should be hit first and give legitimate reasons. I am sure OCS/OTS/ROTC can throw their own reasons in as a defense.

The fact is cuts are coming and if you truly care about this country you will acknowledge both sides have a point. You will also acknowledge that the best thing for the military is to remove your emotions and address it from a fiscally sound POV.
 
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