When could I find out?

I am currently a high school senior. I have an MOC and JROTC nomination to USNA.

I learned that another individual who was nominated through my MOC was offered an appointment to USNA. My MOC did not give out principle nominations. Do I still have a shot at receiving an appointment at USNA, even though another candidate received an appointment from the same MOC?

Also, could I potentially receive an appointment to USNA through my JROTC nomination? Or are JROTC nominations worthless as far as securing an appointment is concerned?
 
Sail103 said:
I am currently a high school senior. I have an MOC and JROTC nomination to USNA.

I learned that another individual who was nominated through my MOC was offered an appointment to USNA. My MOC did not give out principle nominations. Do I still have a shot at receiving an appointment at USNA, even though another candidate received an appointment from the same MOC?

Also, could I potentially receive an appointment to USNA through my JROTC nomination? Or are JROTC nominations worthless as far as securing an appointment is concerned?
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I don't know much about JROTC nominations, but I know with your MOC, even though another from your slate received an appointment, you can still get an appointment to USNA too.

Assuming the individual that received the appointment filled your MOC's last slot, you will go to the national pool and there is still a chance for you.
 
Could you elaborate on this "National Pool"? The Academy mentions it often but I don't understand what it is exactly.......
 
Try searching on the forum or on a search engine...there is plenty of information out there on it. Then after doing some research, if you still have questions post what you don't understand...but a lot of this information is covered in redundant posts on this forum and is available by searching the web.
 
I am unable to locate an answer to the following question in the forum but thought somebody might have some insight. I have read often that a majority of appointment notifications will be in Feb-Mar and perhaps as late as April 15. Is the order of notification based upon an appointment being filled from a MOC slot verses from the national pool, i.e. would those appointed to fill an MOC slot be notified in say February and early March while those appointed through the national pool be notified later say in March and April?
 
I don't think anyone can answer because I don't think anyone knows. What you describe may make some sense because presumably the MOC slots have to be filled before USNA can know who is being considered in the national pool. However, your speculation also leaves out several other nominating sources. It also leaves out NAPS and foundation candidates potentially as well as athletes, diversity candidates, geographical diversity considerations, etc. I'm afraid the answer is probably that USNA can and will do whatever they want based on what they determine is best for them, including determining that someone will be appointed but waiting to notify them until they figure out what nominating source to charge them to. Waiting sucks, but you'll drive yourself crazy trying to second-guess any institution like the government.
 
Sail103 said:
Could you elaborate on this "National Pool"? The Academy mentions it often but I don't understand what it is exactly.......
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A short answer is that there are appointments based on the specific vacancies. Your nomination determine which vacancy you can compete for. If you don't win the vacancy, then you go into the "National Pool" to compete for vacancies reserved for the "National Pool."
 
My DS was in the national pool a few years back. He didn't hear anything until May 15th. Some will not ever leave the pool as well as it is always a numbers game. Yes, the MOC slots will hear back first and the national pool is usually there to fill up the remaining slots if needed.
 
CAmom2015 said:
My DS was in the national pool a few years back. He didn't hear anything until May 15th. Some will not ever leave the pool as well as it is always a numbers game. Yes, the MOC slots will hear back first and the national pool is usually there to fill up the remaining slots if needed.
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Is there a difference between MOC Noms (House of Reps?) and Senatorial Noms in terms of slotting or are they lumped into the MOC pool?
 
Sail103 said:
Could you elaborate on this "National Pool"? The Academy mentions it often but I don't understand what it is exactly.......
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Google US Code Title 10 Subtitle C Part III Chapter 603. 6956 describes the national pool.

If you don't want to do that little bit of work, here is the section.
"... the Secretary may fill the vacancies by nominating additional midshipmen from qualified candidates designated as alternates and from other qualified candidates who competed for nomination and are recommended and found qualified by the Academic Board. At least three-fourths of those nominated under this subsection shall be from qualified alternates under paragraphs (2) through (8) of section 6954(a) of this title, and the remainder shall be from qualified candidates who competed for appointment under any other provision of law"

Here are 2 previous posts that may add some clarification:
Falcon A said:
Your ACT is very good. The question is how does the rest of your record rack and stack against others in your state and Congressional district. Here is why. Each year about 4000 of the 8000-12000 applicants to each SA end up with a nomination and about 2400 end up being qualified academically and in physical aptitude. Each year USMA, USNA, and USAFA each have about 1200 slots for an entering class. Approximately 500 of those slots go to the Principal Noms. Approximately 200 go to recruited athletes, prep school and those with LOAs. If you aren't in one of those 2 groups (Principal Nom or recruit/LOA) you are competing across the country for one of the remaining 500 slots, and the Service Academies will pick those qualified candidates that meet their needs (I.e., geographic diversity, ethnic/gender diversity, and other goals), in order to best represent the make up of the country and the military. Everyone selected will be "qualified" but that doesn't mean everyone selected is the "most qualified". Just the way it works . . .
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Christcorp said:
Just a little clarification. Falcon A is pretty much correct. Just don't confuse the word "PRINCIPAL Nomination". Very few representatives and senators RANK their nominees. In other words, have a PRINCIPAL Nominee. The vast majority simply present the academy with their SLATE of 10 names, and tell the academy "PICK ONE". The reps and senators do have the OPTION of ranking their nominees and having a PRINCIPAL nominee. In which case, assuming the nominee is qualified, the academy has no choice. They MUST take that individual.

But Falcon A is correct in the numbers. Approximately 500 appointments will come from the representative's and senator's SLATES of 10 names. There are also the 200 others he mentioned. But, there are also others too. Up to 100 more appointments come from Presidential Nomination and a number of others that are military related; e.g. ROTC. But after all of these are appointed; around 800-850, the remaining 350-400 will be from the NATIONAL POOL, which are all of the remaining individuals with nominations that haven't received an appointment. So you'll be competing with approximately 2000 for the remaining 350-400 slots. Best of luck.
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They each have a total number of appointees that are charged to them that can be at the academy at any given year. Some years the MOC will have an extra slot because 2 of their charged appointees are commissioning and thus opening 2 vacancies. They each can have 5 appointees at each academy. So some would have a plebe, a 3rd classman, a 2nd classman and a 1st classman and one additional for one of those 4 class groups. The pool is just the National Pool, as far as I have heard. Everyone who is has a nom but didn't get appointed by their Congressman or Senator will go into the National Pool. From there, it is up to the academy to pick the candidate they desire for any openings.
 
ForGod&Country said:
Is there a difference between MOC Noms (House of Reps?) and Senatorial Noms in terms of slotting or are they lumped into the MOC pool?
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I haven't heard it called a "MOC pool" before ;)

The same rules for nominations and slots apply for both Representatives and Senators. CAmom2015 explained it pretty well up above.

Oh. . . and one more clarification . . it really isn't a "MOC pool" since you are only competing against the folks on the particular Congressional slate from which you are being nominated for the 1 slot associated with that particular Congressman or Senator . . . 10 noms on the slate for each available slot . . . If you aren't the #1 for that slot (as determined by the Congressional Member, or by the SA), then you go into the "National Pool", not the "MOC Pool". Hope that makes sense.
 
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To add more complexity...DS ('19) got one MOC nomination and received his appointment in December (on the early side because he had received an LOA earlier that month?). You could reasonably conclude that he got his MOC's slot...but after I-Day another entry showed up under Nominations on his portal (which I checked to confirm some information before posting an answer here) that led us to believe he was actually appointed out of (charged to) the national pool. So - although I presume he initially got the appointment via the MOC's vacancy, that's not how he was charged, and there are at least 5 current plebes from our congressional district. What does this say to me? Don't worry if someone else in your district got an LOA or appointment...that doesn't mean your candidate won't as well. Things get switched around until they have the people they want in the class, and this process takes about 6 months. The waiting is agonizing, and once you have a BFE there may be more twists and turns to the story (medical DQ after appointment due to sports injury...survived that).

Hang in there , everyone. After January 31 notifications will start rolling out regularly. Good luck to all on these boards.
 
Where a NOM is issued can be different from where it is eventually charged. Many candidates never know where it gets charged and once you get your appointment, it really doesn't matter.
 
I don't think it is as simple as the academy simply selecting the candidate who has the best score in each MOC slate, and then all the rest go to the waiting list. Clearly there is some maneuvering going on. Overall, I do get the strong impression that they try to get the most worthy and deserving candidates in, one way or another, but each Academy seems to wait until each of the senator nomination slates are in for a particular candidate before they determine if that candidate is selected on a traditional MOC appointment; not counting those candidates who receive LOA's for one reason or another. They may use a senator's slot for the eight best candidate nominated by that senator, for one reason or another.

We were told that generally, after the LOA's go out, the MOC slot appointments are made first, and then nwl appointments thereafter.
 
Didn't mean to imply it was "simple" . . . however the numbers are the numbers.

As I was quoted up above, there are only around 1200 slots at USNA, USAFA and USMA each year. From the "class profile" sheets that you can find on line you can see that about 4000 candidates gain a Congressional Nomination each year to each school, but the SA only considers about 2400 of those 4000 to be "qualified academically and in physical aptitude." They then select the 1200 from those 2400. The 1200 that are picked are not necessarily the "top" 1200 of the 2400. The 1200 picked are all "qualified", and there are a lot of very stellar candidates with some amazing records and accomplishments in the 1200 selected, but the SA doesn't "rank order" the 2400 and go down the list in an "order of merit" process. The SA selects in accordance with the rules related to the Nomination process, and then selects from the National Pool to meet the SA's needs, such as recruited athlete and diversity goals (geographic diversity, gender, ethnicity, etc.) in order to try and create a student body that reflects our country's society and our military service make up. So you are right, there is a lot of "maneuvering" going on, but it's not "to get the most worthy and deserving candidates in" -- who is to say what that criteria would be? My guess is all 2400 deemed qualified are "most worthy and deserving" -- but there are only 1200 slots. In the end, the SAs try and select not necessarily all "the best" candidates, but the best total grouping that meets the SA's needs. There will be kids that get into an SA that have "lesser" records than some of the kids that don't get in. For instance, there will be kids that applied to both an SA and to ROTC -- they get appointed to an SA, but get notified they didn't qualify for a ROTC National Scholarship. As Pima educated me last year, that is because the ROTCs typically rank order all the applications and award based on an order of merit score. The SAs have more flexibility. That is why the opposite also happens. A kid applies to both an SA and ROTC. Wins a 4-yr national ROTC scholarship to a prestigious university, but isn't selected by the SA. This happens every year. That is why it is really important to have a great Plan B!
 
I think the "1200" is also impacted by prior enlisted slots, other sources of noms such as SECNAV, Presidential, VP, incoming prepsters with non-MOC noms, Superintendent's discretionary. If the class size is usually around 1100-1200, some handful is also going to be foreign cadets and mids, so any class size appointment analysis based on Sen/Rep noms has to be net of all other nom sources and foreign mids/cadets. But the general flow of events is as discussed above.
 
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