Life’s so funny…..

Kentucky9 said:
To think that since my son accepted his appointment at USMA…..I am eagerly anticipating the arrival of USNA’s “The White Envelope.” I will treasure it forever.
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Well, you what they say, right? The only thing in common between West Point cadets and USNA Midshipmen? They all applied to the Naval Academy! And...before anyone gets mad at me, this was (mostly) posted in jest. BUT...the OP posted on the USNA thread...so there's that.
 
Kentucky9 said:
To think that since my son accepted his appointment at USMA…..I am eagerly anticipating the arrival of USNA’s “The White Envelope.” I will treasure it forever.
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My DS is still waiting on USMA but got a TWE in both USAFA and USNA on the same day 4/17! After months of waiting and dead silence, then just plain TD on their portals. USMA on the other hand had a correspondence stating that DS is 3Q and now in NWL. I like USMA letting us know that he is competitive enough to be 3Q+NWL its just that our MOC decided to do a PNom + ranked slate. He was not PNom on the 3 SAs. Thus, USMA’s 3Q+NWL. At least not straight TD. So, i will print and treasure that correspondence from USMA whatever the end result is 😜😜. Funny thing on our end is that he won AFROTC Type 1 last Oct thats why our hopes for the SAs were so high then MOC slate process was the curve ball we didnt foresee. Later on, some kids who had appointment/s were posting AFROTC rejection. Made me even wonder more why some AFROTC winners are not SA winners and vice versa. Guess the SAs are far more complex than ROTC scholarships because of the “charging” mechanism. Anyway, DS is totally happy with plan B that he told me to move on! I am not yet moving on until we hear from USMA 😂😂😂
 
hopefulmama1218 said:
My DS is still waiting on USMA but got a TWE in both USAFA and USNA on the same day 4/17! After months of waiting and dead silence, then just plain TD on their portals. USMA on the other hand had a correspondence stating that DS is 3Q and now in NWL. I like USMA letting us know that he is competitive enough to be 3Q+NWL its just that our MOC decided to do a PNom + ranked slate. He was not PNom on the 3 SAs. Thus, USMA’s 3Q+NWL. At least not straight TD. So, i will print and treasure that correspondence from USMA whatever the end result is 😜😜. Funny thing on our end is that he won AFROTC Type 1 last Oct thats why our hopes for the SAs were so high then MOC slate process was the curve ball we didnt foresee. Later on, some kids who had appointment/s were posting AFROTC rejection. Made me even wonder more why some AFROTC winners are not SA winners and vice versa. Guess the SAs are far more complex than ROTC scholarships because of the “charging” mechanism. Anyway, DS is totally happy with plan B that he told me to move on! I am not yet moving on until we hear from USMA 😂😂😂
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My sons FFO was far more proactive than his BGO! DS had 3 opportunities to meet with cadets and former cadets locally, plus the interview. BGO was just the interview, and no follow up whatsoever. In the end it couldn’t have worked out better!
 
Kentucky9 said:
To think that since my son accepted his appointment at USMA…..I am eagerly anticipating the arrival of USNA’s “The White Envelope.” I will treasure it forever.
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Dude! Sorry I am from California. We are in the same boat. He got an offer three weeks ago for USNA and respectfully declined. Do you think he will get any envelope?
 
Kentucky9 said:
My sons FFO was far more proactive than his BGO! DS had 3 opportunities to meet with cadets and former cadets locally, plus the interview. BGO was just the interview, and no follow up whatsoever. In the end it couldn’t have worked out better!
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Did DS ever reach out to the BGO and ask to speak to MIDN or former MIDN or ask any other questions?
Some BGOs and admissions staffers might have the ability or nature to be proactive, but that depends on a lot of things -- as a reminder, BGOs are volunteers -- and the admissions office isn't typically staffed to reach out to everyone (possibly in the summer and fall when there are more recent grads/TAD officers assigned to admissions). However, at the end of the day, it is the candidate's application -- not the BGO's or admission's -- they need to take ownership if they truly desire to attend a SA -- the expectation/default shouldn't be that any SA is going to be proactive. If the BGO or admissions isn't answering the candidate's questions, that is one thing (reminder to not just rely on one communication medium), but if it isn't because they are reaching out, then that is another. I don't want to speak for any other service, but when it comes to many different facets of the Department of the Navy, there are very few times someone will be holding one’s hand through a process -- particularly when it comes to their own career and promotion. If a MIDN/cadet isn't asking for help when they start struggling academically, I'm certain we don't paint the professors in negative light for not being proactive; I'm fairly certain the chain of command gets on the MIDN/cadet for not being proactive and taking ownership in seeking assistance earlier on.
I understand the customer service aspect of being proactive, but I don't think that should be the expectation for SAs.
I view OWNERSHIP as a key trait (if not the nucleus) in outstanding leaders.
 
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usnabgo08 said:
Did DS ever reach out to the BGO and ask to speak to MIDN or former MIDN or ask any other questions?
Some BGOs and admissions staffers might have the ability or nature to be proactive, but that depends on a lot of things -- as a reminder, BGOs are volunteers -- and the admissions office isn't typically staffed to reach out to everyone (possibly in the summer and fall when there are more recent grads/TAD officers assigned to admissions). However, at the end of the day, it is the candidate's application -- not the BGO's or admission's -- they need to take ownership if they truly desire to attend a SA -- the expectation/default shouldn't be that any SA is going to be proactive. If the BGO or admissions isn't answering the candidate's questions, that is one thing (reminder to not just rely on one communication medium), but if it isn't because they are reaching out, then that is another. I don't want to speak for any other service, but when it comes to many different facets of the Department of the Navy, there are very few times someone will be holding ones hand through a process -- particularly when it comes to their own career and promotion. If a MIDN/cadet isn't asking for help when they start struggling academically, I'm certain we don't paint the professors in negative light for not being proactive; I'm fairly certain the chain of command gets on the MIDN/cadet for not being proactive and taking ownership in seeking assistance earlier on.
I understand the customer service aspect of being proactive, but I don't think that should be the expectation for SAs.
I view OWNERSHIP as a key trait (if not the nucleus) in outstanding leaders.
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Was emphasizing the quality of the ffo. Wasn’t necessarily criticizing the bgo. Hell my ds and the bgo weren’t assigned to each other to late in the process, since he was a reapllicant. I know naval admissions is impeccable and never make a mistake, as so many on this board will agree.

Ownership….giving 2 weeks advance, and three days advance, and arrival to USNA AO….and deprived a meeting that day. Drop off day for youngest son at summer stem last year. Information we got was his application was perfect
From an AO at sign in from another AO. Well besides the lacking of a couple of classes that oldest pointed out were on his transcript.

It’s all good, the whole process was worth it. I may have one at West Point, and one at Annapolis or Colorado Springs. Youngest may end up at MIT, or under the jail 😜. Onward upward
 
Kentucky9 said:
Was emphasizing the quality of the ffo. Wasn’t necessarily criticizing the bgo. Hell my ds and the bgo weren’t assigned to each other to late in the process, since he was a reapllicant. I know naval admissions is impeccable and never make a mistake, as so many on this board will agree.

Ownership….giving 2 weeks advance, and three days advance, and arrival to USNA AO….and deprived a meeting that day. Drop off day for youngest son at summer stem last year. Information we got was his application was perfect
From an AO at sign in from another AO. Well besides the lacking of a couple of classes that oldest pointed out were on his transcript.

It’s all good, the whole process was worth it. I may have one at West Point, and one at Annapolis or Colorado Springs. Youngest may end up at MIT, or under the jail 😜. Onward upward
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Certainly USNA admissions isn’t perfect. There definitely have some been some challenges lately, with the portal debacles being at the forefront. On the missed meeting, it’s possible something pressing came up…not necessarily an excuse for better or follow up (after the fact) communications on what happened, but possibly a good lesson learned for DS to keep in the back pocket as a future officer.
 
I feel for you, our DS had a pretty poor experience overall, but it's not something we dwell on. The only thing I can chalk it up to is that if you look at the candidate numbers from West Point, and AFA, the Naval Academy certainly has more people to pick from. So just like anything else in life, the more options you have, the less you have to work for it. The unfortunate thing, is that Annapolis (and many grads,etc.) seem to revel in this as some sort of proof that they are "better" or the harder academy to gain entrance to. That may be true from a pure numbers perspective, but the reality is probably a little different than some would like to let on. West Point was all over my DS, and while he didn't apply this cycle, he will be completing an application for c/o 2029. The field force officer told him straight up that WP already had about 15% less applicants than Annapolis, and too many promising candidates just couldn't cut the mustard physically and get the CFA scores needed. (and it only gets worse each year) I was actually shocked to look up the numbers where something around the area of 2100 +/- candidates out of 13k applicants were actually 3Q for West Point. I couldn't believe that only about 16% made it to 3Q. I don't know the exact number for Annapolis, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was double that. Then you have Air Force that only gets about 8k applications. That's almost half of USNA...again, was blown away especially when you consider that the incoming class size is mostly the same size for all 3 academies.
 
I think SA families like to joke around about their academy is tougher to get in, etc.

But USNA graduates will also tell you that the NAVY is filled with officers that came from several sources, and not one source is better than another when an officer. They all have the same playing field.

I also don’t think people should spend so much time on studying applicants, 3Q, between the SAs. We can’t possibly know all the variables, differences, military needs, etc. that went into the decisions.

For instance, how many of the 11k applicants to WP would have been 3Q if they completed their application?

BGOs get knocked around by candidates at times. But I am not sure the role of the BGO is to answer any question an applicant has that could have been googled, hold hands, give gouge about other candidates, or read tea leaves about admissions.

Humans at all SA make mistakes.
 
A1Janitor said:
I think SA families like to joke around about their academy is tougher to get in, etc.

But USNA graduates will also tell you that the NAVY is filled with officers that came from several sources, and not one source is better than another when an officer. They all have the same playing field.

I also don’t think people should spend so much time on studying applicants, 3Q, between the SAs. We can’t possibly know all the variables, differences, military needs, etc. that went into the decisions.

For instance, how many of the 11k applicants to WP would have been 3Q if they completed their application?

BGOs get knocked around by candidates at times. But I am not sure the role of the BGO is to answer any question an applicant has that could have been googled, hold hands, give gouge about other candidates, or read tea leaves about admissions.

Humans at all SA make mistakes.
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Being a candidates personal Google is not the BGO's job, however that is not the issue many parents of candidates (and candidates have). The issue is that what Annapolis is telling you a BGO does and what really happens for many candidates is not matching up for many people trying to apply. Yes, it's volunteer and yes, those BGO's have lives, etc but ghosting candidates, not responding to emails in a timely manner (or ever in our case with an AC) puts Annapolis and The Naval Service in a bad light. We were lucky in that we ran into a BGO in November at a congressional event and he was able to get my DS assigned to him after chasing after the AC for months. It literally was just luck that we even ran into somebody that could help us. That's a bad look and it is totally unsat. To be a candidate with everything completed except the interview and you can't get a BGO assigned to you, much less get the interview scheduled is not satisfactory, full stop. We're in a very competitive district, and I know they get to cherry pick...but they could at least act like they have a little interest in candidates from our area.
 
USMC Crayons said:
Being a candidates personal Google is not the BGO's job, however that is not the issue many parents of candidates (and candidates have). The issue is that what Annapolis is telling you a BGO does and what really happens for many candidates is not matching up for many people trying to apply. Yes, it's volunteer and yes, those BGO's have lives, etc but ghosting candidates, not responding to emails in a timely manner (or ever in our case with an AC) puts Annapolis and The Naval Service in a bad light. We were lucky in that we ran into a BGO in November at a congressional event and he was able to get my DS assigned to him after chasing after the AC for months. It literally was just luck that we even ran into somebody that could help us. That's a bad look and it is totally unsat. To be a candidate with everything completed except the interview and you can't get a BGO assigned to you, much less get the interview scheduled is not satisfactory, full stop. We're in a very competitive district, and I know they get to cherry pick...but they could at least act like they have a little interest in candidates from our area.
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My experience was different.

My son met his BGO at an MOC event. They communicated once to set up interview, they had their interview, my son sent a thank you email … and he sent an email the day after correcting himself over a disagreement he had with my son.

Truthfully - I stayed out of everything. I can’t imagine why any parent would need to contact a BGO. Nor can I think of any question my son couldn’t research on his own regarding the application. (My son wouldn’t want me involved - he thinks he is smarter than me.)

I would love to see the questions being asked.

I would also point out that a few bad experiences (and only knowing one side) - doesn’t necessarily mean it’s a problem, rather extrapolating isolated experiences and assuming overall USNA is bad, or worse than the other SA.

How many people aren’t happy with AF and WP - but we don’t see it?

The truth is they could fill USNA twice with the candidates they have. Do you think Navy suffers in the long term by these incidents?
 
USMC Crayons said:
To be a candidate with everything completed except the interview and you can't get a BGO assigned to you, much less get the interview scheduled is not satisfactory, full stop.
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Not having the interview done while everything else is done will not stop a candidate from going before the admissions board and no, it is not held against the candidate. What's more, Admissions tracks this pretty closely and will hound the AC about it. Of course, there are people who experience the downside of using unpaid volunteers but again, this does not keep someone out of USNA
 
OldRetSWO said:
Not having the interview done while everything else is done will not stop a candidate from going before the admissions board and no, it is not held against the candidate. What's more, Admissions tracks this pretty closely and will hound the AC about it. Of course, there are people who experience the downside of using unpaid volunteers but again, this does not keep someone out of USNA
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I think the point you are missing is that you know that, and USNA knows that, but candidates don’t.
 
A1Janitor said:
My experience was different.

My son met his BGO at an MOC event. They communicated once to set up interview, they had their interview, my son sent a thank you email … and he sent an email the day after correcting himself over a disagreement he had with my son.

Truthfully - I stayed out of everything. I can’t imagine why any parent would need to contact a BGO. Nor can I think of any question my son couldn’t research on his own regarding the application. (My son wouldn’t want me involved - he thinks he is smarter than me.)

I would love to see the questions being asked.

I would also point out that a few bad experiences (and only knowing one side) - doesn’t necessarily mean it’s a problem, rather extrapolating isolated experiences and assuming overall USNA is bad, or worse than the other SA.

How many people aren’t happy with AF and WP - but we don’t see it?

The truth is they could fill USNA twice with the candidates they have. Do you think Navy suffers in the long term by these incidents?
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Of all the people in this forum, you certainly take the prize for minimizing anyone’s ideas simply because of you and your kids experience. You’re the kind of person that just has to be right. Well, I will do you a favor, I hereby deem you to be in possession of every right answer in this forum. If you weren’t a senior naval officer or politician, you sure missed your calling.
 
USMC Crayons said:
Of all the people in this forum, you certainly take the prize for minimizing anyone’s ideas simply because of you and your kids experience. You’re the kind of person that just has to be right. Well, I will do you a favor, I hereby deem you to be in possession of every right answer in this forum. If you weren’t a senior naval officer or politician, you sure missed your calling.
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I am not minimizing your ideas. I disagree with your conclusions.

I appreciate your acknowledgment.

Is it better to leave future candidates with false information?
 
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