108 Billion Forgiven......

[forumjunkie]

I've had this conversation before with Jcleppe.
FWIW, I'm borderline boomer/genx. born in '65

Your a Tweener! A small, often unrecognized, demographic segment between the Boomers and the X'ers. Usually shoved into one generational group or the other, but not really a part of either.

"The Lucky Few" there is a book by this name, are again a small demographic segment after the "Greatest Generation" and before the "Boomers". Demand for workers, and opportunities were at an amazing High when they came of age, they couldn't get it wrong. Reminds me of the saying "you could send a dog out with a contract around his neck and he would come back with it signed". Hence the name.

Listened to an interesting book on tape this last road trip. "Outliers" by Malcom Gladwell, the premise of the book being that what we like to refer to as the "Self made man" is often a product of timing and back round.

 

[scoutpilot]

Good. That was my intention. It wasn't meant to engage in an intergenerational blame game like you are doing. It was to mock from the bleachers.

I have always enjoyed your posts. They challenge folks to consider the points of view of those whom they criticize, often on the grounds of historical context. Usually, I agree with you and generally let you do the writing, because you're so damned literate and eloquent. But, this shrill attack on the boomer generation sounds like the rantings of a kid in his mom's basement. What must the "Greatest Generation" have thought of the indulgent prosperity of post WWI America, when farmers couldn't rip up native prairie or Wall Street run up stock prices fast enough?

I'm not going to catalogue the achievements of the boomer generation, from technology to civil rights to fighting an extremely unpopular war, because most of us boomers had absolutely nothing to do with those events. Nor will I bow to anyone, not even you, in criticism of the self-indulgence and consumerism of the boomer generation that pervades American Society. Trust me, it didn't start with us although we did help nurture it to full flower.

I won't put words in your mouth, but the sentiments you express are disturbing. It comes across as pure unadulterated blame. Change the word "boomers" to "millionaires and billionaires" and you could address a Bernie Sanders rally. Change it to "Mexicans, Chinese and Muslims" and you could speak at a Trump rally. It is the opposite of the message that needs to be sent to young people.

With some exceptions, I thought posters were sharing examples of how different parents and kids from different kinds of homes are dealing with the changed landscape of today's job market and system of higher ed. This is what matters now. Things have changed quicker than most folks could have prepared for. Maybe you could contribute by recalling how an Enlisted Soldier or even a Officer improved his/her prospects either through hard knocks or happenstance, when he/she found there was no job waiting after separation.

Let's hear from folks who are dealing with the challenges of a modern post-industrial economy rather than b****ing about self-indulgent baby boomers bloated universities.

BTW. Newsflash! Young people don't vote.

View attachment 757

That was the sound of the mic hitting the floor. Thanks to all Gen Xers and millennials and their culture memes.

Phew. You should've quit while you were behind.

 

[eljay60]

"The Lucky Few" there is a book by this name, are again a small demographic segment after the "Greatest Generation" and before the "Boomers". Demand for workers, and opportunities were at an amazing High when they came of age, they couldn't get it wrong. Reminds me of the saying "you could send a dog out with a contract around his neck and he would come back with it signed". Hence the name.

My parents were part of this generation - born in 1935. (Also have to add the caveat - they were white. I'm sure employment opportunity was very different for people of color when they had different toilets and drinking fountains.) Every 'adult' job my parents had came with a pension and health care, you were hired for life, a college degree in history or English Literature qualified you to be a VP at the local bank. My mom still can't wrap her head around the fact that the economy of the 50s, 60s and early 70s was not 'normal', and my brother and I weren't going to get the same stuff handed to us.

 

[eljay60]

interesting but irrelevant, in our part of the country there has been wanted ads in the paper every week for the last 2 years. They are for Mig Welders. Not the greatest of work, but obviously in high demand.

Flip side to that, one of my son's went to a Lincoln College branch and paid ALOT of money for a 2 year Auto Diesel degree. He has been working for 2 years as A technician (The guys that keep em running) first in John Deere, AG equipt. Now in John Deere heavy construction equipment, some units which I am sure must cost 1/2 to a million dollars. Everything requires Computer diagnostician skills, he was out working in the 100 degree weather on equipment that had to be 110 degrees to the touch. He is so good that companies are trying to steel him from each other....Sounds great Huh! ....... Think again, because the dealerships want or have to have a certain return, His salary is Maxed out at $21 an hour. Try raising a family on that. while paying back Student loans. He did everything right, and just this past couple months got to where he could cash flow one payday to the next without running into the red.

His Grandpa (From the "Lucky Few Generation") was a DuPont factory worker, doing Maintenance and equipment repairs, He was making $45. an hour plus overtime, and retirement benefits, when he retired 20 years ago. He was back filled with young men and women getting $15. an hour. Oh yeah, did I mention that Dupont paid him to take training, he didn't have to pay for Tech school or anything. Oh yeah check out the latest News on Dupont. Cutting all retirement programs and health insurance for future retires as of a couple weeks ago.

My Husband and I Are tweeners, but our heart and battle is for the Younger generations.......My someday book title "One Played , The Rest Payed" One generation that is.

I agree with this post 100%. Yes, jobs are available in SOME parts of the country for SOME skill sets. Take a look at the 2016 presidential election map to find where those jobs are - it's the blue areas. And your point about Grandpa topping out at $45/hr + decent benefits, and current workers topping out about $20-25/hr (and good luck with those benefits) is so true. Our school system was designed to put out a Victorian/Edwardian era worker - basic literacy, a smattering of context, and you teach your worker specific skills in 4-6 weeks, then let him work through the apprentice/journeyman system for a couple of years.

Employers now want very specific credentials for very specific jobs. If you are fortunate enough to have been in the right place at the right time to get the experience and training you are offered decent money at some point in your career. Of course, there is no longer loyalty from employers. Once your skill set isn't needed, they'll let you go, and rehire if necessary in 6 months or 6 years. And we are asking 17 and 18 year olds to make a decision as to whether they want to spend $100k at a state university for a degree they may be uninterested in 20 years from now.

 

[cb7893]

Listened to an interesting book on tape this last road trip. "Outliers" by Malcom Gladwell, the premise of the book being that what we like to refer to as the "Self made man" is often a product of timing and back round.

Re-listen to the 10,000 hour rule chapter. It's a product of timing, background AND the 10,000 hour rule.

For everyone else as well: Find Gladwell's list of Nobel Prize Winners in the Sciences and see the list of Universities and Colleges where they received their undergraduate degrees. It's not what one would think.

 

[forumjunkie]

Re-listen to the 10,000 hour rule chapter. It's a product of timing, background AND the 10,000 hour rule.

For everyone else as well: Find Gladwell's list of Nobel Prize Winners in the Sciences and see the list of Universities and Colleges where they received their undergraduate degrees. It's not what one would think.

Actually that was my favorite part, I was just trying to keep my post short (For a Change) . I would say that was probably the most important part, but in some cases it is tied into the opportunity, as in a Vietnam era pilot might get 10,000 hours flying a chopper, but the average citizen cannot afford that.

For the record, I Agree with many of Gladwell's points, but not his total reasoning. For example the key is, what does a person chose to do with an opportunity when it presents its self. Given the same set of circumstances only one it what? 10,000 will chose to capitalize on it, there in comes the self made man/woman.

 

[cb7893]

as in a Vietnam era pilot might get 10,000 hours flying a chopper, but the average citizen cannot afford that.

My brother to a T, though it was a lot less than 10k hours and it was a very slow airplane.

There is no way on God's green earth he would have qualified for pilot training today, given his "life experience". It took him a lot of summer school to graduate college in 1966, the absolute height of the War. He was excellent at math, however. Wasn't enough for the Navy , but was enough for the AF.

He left at the exact time that WW2 pilots retiring from the airlines. The retirement of the Korean War pilots boosted his seniority to withstand the Airline turmoil of the 1990's.

He would tell you it's all timing.

 

[scoutpilot]

The fact that anyone here is taking Gladwell seriously speaks volumes.

 

[forumjunkie]

The fact that anyone here is taking Gladwell seriously speaks volumes.

Please enlighten us? Not being argumentative, willing to read and learn.