Appointments by state?

Discussion in 'Merchant Marine Academy - USMMA' started by Lynpar, Oct 15, 2010.

  1. Lynpar

    Lynpar Member

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    Am I understanding this? Indiana only can have 3 appointments each year to Kings Point? 3?
     
  2. KPDD2014MOM

    KPDD2014MOM Member

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    I don't know anything about a limit on the numnber of nominations but you must obtain a nomination from your US Representative or Senator. There is information on the academy website with information about nominations and links to help you. I do know for a fact that our state had almost 20 Plebes this year so I don't think the number 3 is accurate. Check out the website for more information.
     
  3. Lynpar

    Lynpar Member

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    Thanks, got notification of nomination yesterday, YaY! But with each new step comes further specific questions. As per gov. Info online each state receives slots based on number of representation in congress. That is why I don't understand the "3" number. Wouldn't our representation be our two US Senators plus the number of congress(people)? Just wanted to know how big the new competitive pool is,,,,way more nervous then kid is. Thankfully he is out at high school football game enjoying his senior year.
     
  4. KP2010

    KP2010 Member

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    I was under the impression that each congressman and senator has 5 mishipmen they can pick every year. However I could be wrong. If you apply for a nomination I believe you can apply to your Senators (2 of them) and the Congressman in your district.
     
  5. NCDSDad

    NCDSDad DS in class of 2014

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    Yes KP2010, that is correct. Additionally, each of those (your 2 senators and your local congressman) can have up to 5 kids at each academy at any one time (i.e. you have a total of 15 available slots for KP for your area). So, if you want to go to KP next year and your congressman already has 4 mids at KP and none of them will graduate this year, he has one available slot for the class of 2015. Same goes for your senators.
     
  6. Lynpar

    Lynpar Member

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    Okay, I am dense! My state has 2 senators and 9 memebers of the house. So 11 nomination sources throughout the state. Luckily ds has already received a letter from one that he has received nomination (jumping for joy icon here)! Assuming all choose to nominate, and fill their slate, there could be 110 nominations for my state? Now assuming all previous years are full we are only thinking of this years spots, are the 110 competing against all or just the other 9 on their slate? And for 11'new spaces available or 3 which I have
    found as the number on a government document source? Or if 5 can nominated per source total number would be 55. Are those 55 competeing against the 54 other of just the other 4 on their nom. slate? I know, I know, I have been told I could complicate a crow-bar!
     
  7. dpt135

    dpt135 Member

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    Along this same idea, is it confidential information or is there anyway to know how many your MOC already has in any particular SA and how many nominations they have to offer? Am I correct to say that if my Congresswoman has 5 attending USNA(none graduating) she has no nominations to offer there? Then I'd have to get a nom from one of the Senators?
     
  8. kpmom2013

    kpmom2013 Member

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    Way More Complicated

    It is way more complicated than you realize. In addition to the MOC (members of Congress) nominations, remember that you also have presidential and vice-presidential nominations. The MOC nominations can also be ranked if the nomination source chooses. The nominees may decide to turn down their appointment and may even receive appointments to more than one academy. You can make yourself crazy with all the permutations. Suffice it to say that if your DS/DD is qualified, has a nomination, and is wanted by USMMA, they will find a spot for him or her. Make sure he/she continues to update his/her admissions file with new accomplishments, grades, and anything you can think of. You are not just competing within your state, you are competing nationwide. Some states may have a ton of great nominees and others may have very few. Sometimes several kids nominated by the same source will get offers of admission, but may not be "charged" against the same MOC. This waiting was one of the most difficult experiences of my life. If it helps to know you are not alone, try to take some comfort in that. Congratulations on raising such fine young men/women, and try not to lose sight of that accomplishment. Treasure every minute you can spend with your DS/DD. They will be gone in the blink of an eye, and you will never get to experience this year again!
     
  9. KPMum2012

    KPMum2012 Parent

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    Actually, that's not true. USMMA has a completely different nominating system than the Dept. of Defense Academies:

    N.B. There are no Presidential, Vice-Presidential, military-affiliated, JROTC-honor unit, ROTC or Unit Commander, or Medal of Honor nominations permitted to the Academy.

    This is a direct quote from the USMMA website here: http://www.usmma.edu/admissions/facts/nominations.shtml

    The document available here: http://digital.library.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metacrs8480/ gives more details on nominations to all of the Service Academies. Page 6 has specifics on USMMA which does indicate that Indiana get 3 spots per year.

    Caveat: Your best source of information is your admissions officer at KP. Our experience was that the folks in the Admissions Office were fantastic!
     
  10. jasperdog

    jasperdog Member

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    It Is Complicated AND There Is Misinformation In This Thread...

    So first off in direct answer to Lynpar's first question: "Am I understanding this? Indiana only can have 3 appointments each year to Kings Point? 3? "

    No, you are mixing and matching the information that is on the website and in the catalog, etc. It is basically true that Indiana currently has an allotment of 3 slots in each years entering class. That's based on the current authorized entering class size. However that does NOT mean that Indiana, or any State for that matter, is limited to only those allocated slots.

    As noted a Nomination from a Member of Congress is required. There are NO Presidential or Vice Presidential Nominees to the USMMA. As noted on the Academy website, you may be nominated by ANY member who represents your State. However, unlike the other Academies where a nomination is required, neither the President or Vice President nominates candidates for Admission to Kings Point. From the current website:
    Reference: http://www.usmma.edu/admissions/facts/nominations.shtml


    Each nominating authority may nominate up to ten (10) candidates for the USMMA. Those nominees then compete first for the spots in the entering class for their State. After those appointments are made, all remaining nominees are placed into a National Pool and they compete for the remaining available slots - basically those that are not used by the States that historically do not use their spots; and those spots that the admissions office has historically seen not taken/filled by those offered appointments.

    Much of the confusion comes from the fact that basically on average 450 appointments are granted/offered (sorry I don't have my latest data to the recent entering classes. These come from a pool of fully completed applications with nominations, the maximum number of unique nominees is basically limited to the total Membership of Congress (435 Representatives + 100 Senators X 10) which means there theoretically could be as many as 5,350 young men or woman competing for the available spots in each class. Again I don't have the latest data in front of me but I recall looking at it and believe that the number of completed full applications with nominations generally is between 1,250 and 1,500 nation-wide. Of course while 350 out of 1250 is probably more welcome news to you than 400 out of 5350, it is still a very competitive admissions process. (Note - the actual numbers I have for the entering class of 2013 were: Applications: 1823; Nominations 1345; Incomplete Applications: 1075; Met Selection Criteria: 494; Not Academically Qualified: 218; Not Physically Qualified: 31; Declined Appointment: 159; Appointments Offered: 450; Plebes Reporting In: 291 - the 291 includes International Students.)

    In the case of the Indiana, the latest data I have on hand is as of September 1, 2009 - for the Classes of 2009 there were 5 graduates, likewise in the Class of 2010 - 5 graduates. My understanding is there are/were as of that date 4 Hoosiers in the Class of 2011, 2 in the Class of 2012 and 4 in the Class of 2013.


    Some misunderstandings in prior posts worth mentioning are:

    * Allotment of available appointments at USMMA is NOT by individual Member of Congress, that is something people seem to get wrong or confused with the USMA, USNA, and USAFA process where the concept of "Principle Nominee" has meaning and standing. For the USMMA process the "allotment" is by the entire State, and as noted that only applies to States that fill 100% of their allotted spots which is usually the top 10 States which are sources of USMMA Midshipmen.

    * Also in response to dpt135's posted question, at the USNA, USMA, and USAFA, even if your nominating authority has "filled their spots" - it's my understanding that means his or her nominees are treated like everyone else's first through ninth alternates. However, that question is best asked at the Academy Forum where he/she is most interested and that process applies, it does not apply to USMMA, where basically all of the Nominees from a particular state have the same standing and starting position in competition for that State's available allotted spots.

    * A nomination may be given to any qualified applicant who is domiciled within a Member of Congress' State by a nominating authority. They may nominate up to 10 annually. You do NOT have to be a resident within the nominating authorities district, just his or her State.

    * The maximum number of nominations from a single nominating authority in any given year is ten (10) not five (5). Further ALL nominees to USMMA have the same standing in the admissions process - there are no "principle nominees" etc. though often Members of Congress use that language in the letters they send out as it applies to USMA, USNA, and USAFA.

    Finally, in summary answer to Lynpar's second post:
    - You are correct there could be as many as 110 unique individuals competing for the 3 spots allotted to Indiana for the next entering class.
    - Each nominating authority could indeed nominate as many as ten, however I'd expect a landlocked state like Indiana to not use all 110 available nominations, though given the Class of 2012 also had a "quota" of 3 and only currently has two members from Indiana, I'd be surprised if all the Nominating Authorities use all their available nominations to USMMA for 110 separate and distinct individuals.
    -Bottom line is that first your child is competing with the other nominees from Indiana for the quota of three (3) spots and if he/she doesn't get an appointment that way, they will then be placed in the National Pool and be competing for the remaining available spots in the authorized number of appointments which I believe is again 450.

    Hope this helps... good luck to your child.
     
  11. Luigi59

    Luigi59 Banned

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    Nice post, jasperdog. :thumb:

    There was so much misinformation this thread (more than I have seen in any thread here in 3 years) I am glad to see it corrected.

    Key points for USMMA:

    • ONLY MoC nominations (no POTUS, VP, ROTC)
    • MoC nominations are statewide for all MoC, not just Senators.
    • Each MoC gets 10 nominations per year
    • Appointment slots are in proportion to the state's representation in Congress.
     
  12. KPMum2012

    KPMum2012 Parent

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    Jasperdog's explanation is MUCH better than mine. In fact, it is the best I've ever seen. There are so many misunderstandings about the KP nominations.

    Still, worrying about exactly how many spots there are and how many competitors there might be is not productive. Do your best. Apply to all available nomination sources. Let the admissions officers know how badly you want to attend KP. That's all you can control. Then it's time to learn the Serenity Prayer.
     
  13. Lynpar

    Lynpar Member

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    Jasperdog, Luigi, You guys rock. I was kind of waiting for you all to show up and set it straight. Some of the info I received I knew was inaccurate and I knew it wouldn't be too long before you guys appeared lol! The algebra of how 11 members of congress equals "proportionally 3 slots" isn't clear BUT unimportant since more than 3 can be appointed. Also good to know about national pool. I am still wondering about applying to other nom sources when ds has received one. Seems the honorable ( if not smart thing) to do is notify the others already to applied to and not to apply to others with later deadline. Thoughts? Admissions said the misconception about more than one nom being helpful is based on DOD academies. Where the kid stands is: nomination received, dodmerb qualified, app still waiting on one LOR from last years math teacher ( has taken longer than getting the nomination has ). Ds is also a recruited athlete, for what that is worth. Really hoping for LOA just to relax (me) a little. Kid is in charge of all his work and contacts. Learning all I can via this forum is really all that I can do for him, it is in his hands. I come off as a hover-Mom. Thanks to all who have responded and best of luck to all on this exciting journey.
     
  14. dpt135

    dpt135 Member

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    So...from what I just read,as a candidate for the USMMA I need to apply to all the representatives in my state and not just my district?
     
  15. Luigi59

    Luigi59 Banned

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    You don't need to, but you are legally allowed to.

    As previously posted by jasperdog, the locality boundary for a USMMA nomination by a Representative (MoC) is the State in which the District lies, rather than just the District itself.
     
  16. Lynpar

    Lynpar Member

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    Ds informed me today he called his still-pending nomination source (congressman) and told them of his notification of nomination from another source (senator) applied to. Both the senator and congressman are retiring so their deadlines to complete these activiteis is a little earlier than most other nominating members of congress. Ds said he thanked them and his application was pulled. I sure hope that was the right thing to do. I think it was the honorable thing to do, however it may be of no matter from here in a (almost) landlocked state, as was explained by Jasperdog, not all of the nominations slots are used.
     

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