AROTC/AFROTC/NROTC Chances

Discussion in 'ROTC' started by awindmiller14, Nov 13, 2013.

  1. awindmiller14

    awindmiller14 Member

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    Hi all. I recently applied to scholarships to A/AF/N ROTC (NROTC was navy option) and I was wondering if you could chance me.
    GPA: Weighted/Unweighted 4.05/3.66 (I go to a really hard school and take the hardest classes offered, my school does not rank but they do histograms and I am roughly the 10th percentile)
    SAT: Single score (same as super score) Reading (770) Math (710) Writing (720) Cumulative (1480/2200)
    AP's: I take Chemistry and Math, however, my school only offers limited AP's and only in Math, Science, and FL (Foreign language), so the only other I could possibly take would be FL.
    PFA/PFT: For the army I did 56 pushups, 49 situps, and a 7:14 mile run. For AF I did 51 pushups, 51 situps, and a 12:39 1.5 mile
    Sports: Baseball and Football freshman year, ultimate frisbee other years, trap and skeet throughout high school (Including a silver medal at the MA state schoot and 4th in division at MA Junior Olympic championships)
    Leadership/EC's: Held a 15 hr/week job as lifeguard/swim teacher for Junior year, CIT and counselor in summers of 2012 and 2013. President of 2 school clubs and member of 2 more.
    Misc: High honor roll every quarter except for 2 when I got honor roll instead, Excellence in social studies and English, and graduating with an engineering certificate (taking extra science/applied tech courses)

    For navy, my selected major was tier 2 (engineering psychology). I am aiming for something similar with the army and AF. I applied to and got into Tulane w/ honors program and 25k/year (It says it is not compatible with an ROTC scholarship but should I tell the services about that anyways?) I applied ED to Washington University in St Louis and have about a 50/50 shot at getting in. Unfortunately, there is no NROTC at WASHU. I am a white male. Basically I'm wondering if my academics can overcome my lousy PT scores and arguably limited sport involvement. Thanks!
     
  2. kinnem

    kinnem Moderator

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    Your PT scores, while not great, are not bad either. Keep working on them. You have a fair chance, but not stellar chances. Re: Tulane.... AROTC allows you to use the scholarship for room and board which may be compatible with the Tulane scholarship. Look into it. NROTC and I believe AFROTC only apply to tuition and would be incompatible with the Tulane scholarship.
     
  3. usmawebb

    usmawebb Member

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    Your SAT's are probably the strongest part of your file, and they're pretty good. Your PT score is not as bad as you think, although I do believe you are lacking in sport and leadership participation. I agree with kinnem, you have a fair chance. I think the fact that you applied for all branches helps, you could get AF but not Army or Navy or some type of combo like that. Good luck.
     
  4. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    As others have said your PFA is low for AFROTC, especially the run because you want that to be cut down by at least @2 mins. Our DS always aimed for 10 mins. (He is not a runner).

    Although you don't have a lot of official athletics, being a lifeguard could help in that aspect. Our DS was a guard for 2 1/2 yrs and he had 23 saves, which he placed on his resume so they knew it was not just sitting in a chair.

    Overall you have strong academics, but depending how your PFA score works out for points, you could find yourself being offered only a Type 7. I have never heard of a major known as engineering psychology, but I am assuming it is not a tech major because psychology isn't, which means it is that more difficult to get a scholarship. 80% of all AFROTC scholarships go to Tech majors, of the 5% that get a Type 1, only 5% of that 5% go to non-tech or iows @2 or 3 per yr.

    I don't understand why Tulane is saying you can't use a ROTC scholarship with theirs, especially if the cost of tuition alone is over 25K. I would double check with them because remember every yr. tuition costs typically increase by 5-10%. IOWs 25K may cover you for this school yr., but by the time you arrive next yr., you may already be in the hole, and that is when the ROTC scholarship could kick in to pick up the remaining balance.

    You would need a Type 1 or 2, because I am betting Tulane tuition is not equivalent to your IS college if they are giving you 25K for tuition. Type 2 unless you can use it with Tulane's scholarship it is not worth it for you because it is up to 18K. Thus, you really need to get a Type 1 from a fiscal aspect if they will not allow you to combine their scholarship and ROTC.

    One thing I always say to ROTC, but especially AFROTC candidates make sure you can afford to attend the college without the scholarship. AFROTC scholarship is truly only guaranteed for 2 yrs., because as a sophomore you will compete for an SFT spot. The SFT selection boards are like scholarship boards, you will compete nationally and the fact that you are on scholarship will not be seen by the board, thus it is not a safety net. If not selected chances are high that you will be dis-enrolled and lose your scholarship.

    Good luck.
     
  5. CM11

    CM11 Member

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    awindmiller14, I also am looking at Wash U,

    Have you interviewed with the Wash U PMS? Have you heard back ED from Wash U?
     
  6. USMCGrunt

    USMCGrunt Member

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    awindmiller14: St. Louis University which is very close to Washington University has both Army and Air Force ROTC units. From what I understand, they have a very strong Engineering program at SLU (certain disciplines). You might want to check them out.
     
  7. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    One thing to think about regarding ROTC is host campus or not?

    When a college is not the host, it comes with unique aspects.
    ~ How will you get there? IOWs, will you need a car? Do cadets carpool?
    ~ How long will it take to commute, especially during traffic? How will that impact class scheduling at your campus.
    ~ Do cadets socialize at your campus, or is it more like once back on campus you are just a typical college kid from a socialization circle perspective?

    Some kids want a ROTC experience that includes more than just PT and LLAB. Some kids want to be in military fraternities, such as Arnie Air, Silver Wings, etc. They typically meet at night and on the weekends at the host college, which brings it back to the questions you should ask at the det. level.

    College is a balancing act between academics and social life for the avg kid. For ROTC cadets it is a balancing act between academics, social life and ROTC. You will need to juggle all 3 at the same time.
     
  8. awindmiller14

    awindmiller14 Member

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    I have visited WashU twice but I have only been there on the weekends and I haven't had time to visit the Army detachment, which, btw, is hosted at WashU. I have emailed the PMS and introduced myself, because apparently they select whether or not cadets get scholarships to their schools. I am going to hear back when everyone else does on the 15th of december (probably actually the 13th because the 15th is a sunday).
     
  9. awindmiller14

    awindmiller14 Member

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    USMC, thanks for the idea but I basically have my heart set on WashU. However I find myself in a predicament because the navy officer I interviewed with yesterday said he was positive I would receive a navy scholarship. That was great news but it makes my process more difficult. Operating on the (naive?) assumption that I get an NROTC scholarship (I don't know if they have different levels of scholarship) I could be walking away from a lot of money (NROTC + Merit scholarship) at Tulane by applying ED to WashU, especially if I don't get anything from AF or Army at WashU. My current plan is to wait until around December 1st when my Army decision is released. If I am offered a scholarship to WashU, I will stay on my current course. If I am not offered an Army scholarship or offered one to a different school I might consider withdrawing my application to WashU (assuming that is possible). I am caught between the prospect of ROTC at Tulane and my dream school at WashU. It is worth noting that I am fortunate enough to be able to afford an education at either institute without financial assistance. Thanks all for the continuing advice.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2013
  10. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    awindmiller14,

    Please remember college is 4 yrs of your life, and as you have pointed out, rightly so, this is a chance to attend your DREAM college in your chosen major.

    However, college is 30 weeks a yr. and it is not 40 hrs or 7 days a week. If you go AF/NROTC it is 52 weeks, 24/7 AD. Your career will be what they decide it will be, you will live where they say you will be stationed at for at least 4 yrs.

    Want to be a pilot, but they decide you will be Intel, you will be Intel. Request to be stationed in Florida, but they only have an opening in Texas, you will live in Texas.
    ~~~ Yes you get to request both the career field and base choices, but it is their decision in the end, and mission needs will always come 1st. If Florida does not have an O1 opening than you go where there is an O1 opening. The running joke in the AF is about the rhymes for bases that exist where you can go.
    ~ Why not Minot? Freezin is the Reason
    ~ Del Rio = He!! Rio
    ~ Oh My God NO Alamogordo

    I did not place Army in the equation because for AROTC you can go Guard or Reserves, you don't have to go AD. AF/NROTC you WILL go AD.

    Before you go any further, especially since you can afford college, think about life from 22-26.
    ~~~ I will also say as much as you think you can bolt at 4 yrs and a day, many times that doesn't work out because of other factors.
    ~ I.E. Some career field schools will require a concurrent commitment, but their clock will not start ticking until you graduate from the school. If the school takes 6-9 months, than you are at @ 5 yrs.
    ~ AFROTC grads typically wait 6-9 months prior to attending the school.
    ~~~ Commission in May 2018. Report to school in March 2019, no additional time owed. You don't leave May 2018, you are eligible to leave March 2023, because it is not 4 yrs commission, but 4 yrs ADAF.
    ~~~~~ 1st assignment is overseas, PCS in 2021 back stateside, that assignment is 3 yrs. You are now in until 2024.
    ~~~~~~ Take TA for grad school (concurrent) finish in 2022, you are in until 2025. They PCS you again in 2024 for another 3 yr assignment. You are at 2027.
    ~~~~~~~ You are now 9 yrs in and up for O4. You are married, with a mtg, and 2 little ones. You accept O4., and PCS again because like 2007 the economy tanks, unemployment rate is high.
    ~~~~~~~~ Now you have 13 yrs. 2 more tours, and you can retire 50% of your base pay for the rest of your life starting at the ripe old age of 42. Do you leave now? 13 yrs in, cars and mtgs are higher, braces for the kids are right around the corner, and your current assignment has you living in Washington State, but you want to retire in Missouri, which means interviewing is a lot of air travel and hotels coming out of your monthly budget. If you go Navy, you can be on a cruise deployment the last 6 months prior to leaving....no interviewing.

    ~ LITS dived as a USCGA grad at the 5 yr. marker. He will tell you, that it took about 6 months to get a job, and he had his grad degree from GWU, worked in the DC area and had networking in place. He planned it out, and saved accordingly to survive, but also ate through his savings during that time.
    Something at 18, people don't think about when they see that they get 100's of thousands of dollars for education and in their mind owe only 4 yrs.

    My point is this is very common in the AF because life keeps getting in the way. I am guessing the same will be true for Navy too. Think long and hard if the scholarship from another branch is worth it if it is not the branch you truly want to serve in as an officer.

    Think SERVICE BEFORE SELF, because in the end they will own you for yrs after graduation once you commission.

    Just my opinion.
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2013
  11. awindmiller14

    awindmiller14 Member

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    Pima, thanks for helping to focus my decision. In the end I decided that I will apply ED to WashU and I sent out the agreement form. The money was never really the draw to ROTC, I just saw it as the best way to do what I wanted, which is to become a military officer. I want to go AD very badly with any of the branches (I think Army and Navy are my favorites but AF is not far behind) and I think I understand at least part of the commitment that that entails. Worst case scenario, I walk on Army at WashU. Fingers crossed.
     
  12. CM11

    CM11 Member

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    Is that different from how other schools do this?
     
  13. Jcleppe

    Jcleppe Member

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    The PMS for Army ROTC has no say in who gets a scholarship to their school. other then the box they check for all applicants that have listed the school. The PMS can check either 4yr, 3yr, or no. Once this info is submitted the PMS has no control over who gets the scholarship to their school.

    I have no idea how the other services handle this.
     
  14. awindmiller14

    awindmiller14 Member

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    On the subject of combining scholarships at Tulane, I found a fairly comprehensive web page that outlines this. "Students who are offered both a Tulane merit scholarship and an ROTC scholarship must choose which scholarship is most advantageous to them." HOWEVER, "students receiving an ROTC scholarship can receive the Tulane Cooperative Room and Board Scholarship in some cases (see more details below). In addition, students receiving a partial ROTC tuition scholarship may receive Tulane ROTC Supplemental Tuition Scholarship in the amount of 20 percent tuition or the amount of forfeit Tulane merit tuition scholarship minus the ROTC tuition scholarship, whichever is greater." So in theory a partial ROTC scholarship could be combined with a merit scholarship AND Tulane's Room and Board scholarship. I'm still confused as to exactly how this would work and if it's possible, but it sounds like people have gone through this before.

    can't post full URLs but plugging this into a browser should work : tulane.edu/financialaid/grants/rotc.cfm

    tulane.edu/financialaid/my-aid/upload/ROTC-sheet-2013-2014-for-Web.pdf
     
  15. Trackswagggg

    Trackswagggg Member

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    What are my chances?

    Hey! What are my chances of getting a 4 year AROTC scholarship or NROTC scholarship? I didn't make the first board but I improved my ACT and GPA!

    GPA: 3.7 (Un-weighted)

    ACT: 25 Composite

    Class Rank: 64/330 (top 20%)

    Course Type: All AP and Honors. Dual Enrollment Senior Yr w/ a 4.0 college GPA

    Future Major: Biology

    School of Intent: The Citadel (accepted)

    Athletics: Three Varsity Letters in Track and Team Capt.; Varsity Letter in Cross Country and Team Capt; Black belt in Tae-Kwon-Do; Many athletic awards. All state for Tae-Kwon-Do

    Leadership & Activities:
    ROTC Corps of Cadets Commander
    Club President
    Student Government Treasurer
    Service Club Member
    Church Leader
    Team Capt
    Pool Manager
    Boy's State Delegate
    Beta Club
    Drama Actor and Competition
    Drill Team
    Yearbook Photo Editor
    ROTC Academic Bowl
    Leadership Conference

    Awards & Honors:
    Presidential Volunteer Service Award (300+ Hours)
    Three letters in Community Service
    American Legion Scholastic ROTC Medal
    SARS and DARS Medal
    Letter in Academics

    Had a good interview with the PMS.

    Mile Time: 5:47
    Crunches in Min: 49
    Pushups in Min: 51

    What are my chances? :confused:
     
  16. kinnem

    kinnem Moderator

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    ^^^ Did you really need to post this to three different threads? One would have been sufficient.

    EDIT: Excuse me.... make that 4 threads.
     
  17. Strength and Honor

    Strength and Honor Member

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    Trackswag: I understand wanting others opinions. But we arent on the biard, and what we think means nothing. People told me I MIGHT get a 3 year in state, and I got a 4 year to 3 expensive schools. My opinion:

    For NROTC, without a technical major it'll be a reach. For the Army though, you've got a good résumé. A lot will come down to stuff that sets you apart from other borderline applicants. Where did you interview? How did it go? If you could raise the ACT score you'd be a lock.
     
  18. Coltron

    Coltron Candidate

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    +1 to everything Strength and Honor said... :thumb:
     
  19. VMI82

    VMI82 Room 131

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    no working crystal ball Kid

    Amen Kinnem!

    Enthusiasm and excitement is good. Anxious and over-doing ... not as good.

    We, none of us can give you a real answer as none of us sat in the room on those boards.

    What I can tell you is developing patience is vital to a career in the Military as we perpetually 'hurry up & wait'

    I cannot begin to tell you how many times you have planned, prepped and practiced and then .... all of that stops, you hold ... and then you wait.

    And wait. And wait. .... you get the idea.

    So, consider this good practice for future service.

    My best advice is to focus on the things you can control (like the old serenity prayer) like: 1st semester finals; Christmas shopping; enjoying your Holidays ... and so on.

    You/we will all know the outcomes to your/our DS/DD applications soon enough.

    Good luck!
     
  20. Mandyj34

    Mandyj34 Member

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    +1 to the Hurry up and Wait

    Gosh, if anything, applying for an NROTC scholarship has taught me an impressive amount of patience. Yes, we all want to find out how we did but like others have said, nobody but the board can tell you if you receive one or not. Good luck, anyhow!

    Merry Christmas
     

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