Athletes getting in easier

Discussion in 'Merchant Marine Academy - USMMA' started by laker7745, Jul 27, 2014.

  1. laker7745

    laker7745 Member

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    I have heard from a few guys at my school who have gone on to play football and baseball at West Point and USNA that they got in with subpar academic credentials compared to the rest of he corps of cadets owing to them being recruited athletes, for example the now West Point baseball was accepted with a cumulative 3.5GPA and a 22 on his ACT, is this true that this is common?
     
  2. Heyriddle

    Heyriddle Member

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    That may be the case but they still have to survive academics at the academies.


    Sent using the Service Academy Forums® mobile app
     
  3. jasperdog

    jasperdog Member

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    Simple, straight answer - no they too must meet the minimums for the incoming class.
     
  4. pointguard

    pointguard Member

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    No one gets in with a 22. They may get in with a ~26 and the qualities the SA's view as accelerated due to high level sports participation and expertise. And yes, they will take the same curriculum and do their best as all will.
     
  5. MemberLG

    MemberLG Member

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    If you are "special," you are going to get in with a 22 on ACT

    According to the USMA 2017 profile,

    http://www.usma.edu/oir/class profiles/class of 2017.pdf

    1% was in 16-20 Eng, Soce Reas, and Reading

    If you look at the SAT scores, there were some appointed cadets that scored in 400-499 ranges.
     
  6. pointguard

    pointguard Member

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    I'll retract my qualifier and add that the Stat doesn't indicate if athletics is the only demographic that I can see. Might be also include something else. My DS was told in person, with me standing right there, that a 26 was necessary for him, and he was considered a special athlete by all SA's. We have no other diversity qualifiers, to be candid about it. I'll go with the Stat, but Athletics may not be the only component of an App imo. Good luck to all as they have to graduate to not become that other stat.
     
  7. powderhorngreen

    powderhorngreen Member

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    Incoming class day zero of Indoc for Class of 2018 was comprised of 252 Candidates, of which 123/128 (can't remember the number given) were recruited athletes. Average sat for incoming class CR-632 and Math-652. Average sats for classes of 2007-2017 were CR-600 and Math-626. Hard to believe that many of the recruited athletes had sub 500 SAT scores. Also, USMMA does NOT offer liberal art majors - every one is either a deckie and an engineer. Also, everyone must pass USCG licensing requirements to graduate. No incentive to bring in "just an athlete" only to lose them because they can't ultimately matriculate. IMHO, at USMA, USNA and USAFA, there is more wiggle room given the flexibility in majors, lack of a sea year, and incentives to recruit at a D1 level.
     
  8. MemberLG

    MemberLG Member

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    Perhaps a FOIA request to USMMA might anwer this question definitely, but at this point we are just speculating. It's has been a while, but I would think sub 500 SAT might be within oneto three standard deviation from the average test scores, which makes it proabable, not highly unlikely.

    Also, the confusing part is that the question was posted on the USMMA forum, but gave other SA situations as examples.
     
  9. powderhorngreen

    powderhorngreen Member

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    FYI, I recited the current class statistics from the UMMA site at

    http://www.usmma.edu/admissions/class-profile


    The fact that approximately half of the incoming class were recruited athletes came from comments made during Indoc by Capt. Kennedy, the Commandant of USMMA.

    Not confirming or denying the assertion about recruited athletes, just sharing facts.

    ETA: I agree that sub 500 is not out of the realm of reason for an applicant to be successful, just saying that for every sub 500, there has to be an over 700 to balance it out to get to that average. Therefore, it seems to me that a recruited athlete with sub 500 scores would be in the minority of an admitted class. Personal experience dictates that being a recruited athlete is a very valuable plus in the equation - having an SAT score of 2100 coupled with that can lead to a very early decision and a nice senior year of high school.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2014
  10. Basketballdad

    Basketballdad Member

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    As a dad of a recruited athlete to the USMMA I figured I should give some perspective. Our plebe cadidate scores were SAT 740 math, 650 verbal, HS GPA 4.2 (had 22 hours of college credit because of dual enrolled and AP classes). The main difference between the USMMA and the other 4 service academies is that USMMA is a NCAA Div. 3 school while the other 4 are NCAA Div. 1 or 2. A division 3 school does not have atheltic scholarships and what makes them a division 3 school is that they are supposed to have the same admission requirements for both athletes and non-athletes. Div. 1&2 schools do not have this same requirement and in fact offer athletic scholarships and can have different admissions standards for athletes vesuses non-athletes. Our plebe candidate was also being recruited by the USNA and he did not talk to the normal Blue and Gold Officer for our area but to an athletic recruiter who told him the requirements were eased to a small degree for recruited athletes who the academy wanted. The coaches at the USMMA said they had no influence in the admissions process other than to have admissions review the application as soon as it was complete versuses the normal review cycle.

    Hope this perspective helps but based on our experience a recruited athlete got no advantage at USMMA. In fact there were some earlier posts ablout recruited football players who did not get in and are now at NMMI hoping to get in next year.
     
  11. jasperdog

    jasperdog Member

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    I'm pretty confused as to why Laker, Pointgaurd and MemberLG seem to want to cite what looks like a specific example or couple of specific examples of US Military Academy (USMA) appointee(s) to a much larger entering Class at WEST POINT - an NCAA Division I school when it comes to Athletics in response to information, including several specific examples that back up what I posted in general terms as regards "recruited athletes" in the entering classes of generally 250 - 300 plebe candidates in entering classes at the US Merchant Marine Academy (USMMA) - an NCAA Division III school when it comes to Athletics.

    I stand by my original statement as a long time active Alumni and Admissions Field Representative certainly as applies to the general population. As you would expect in a group - USMMA entering "Freshman Classes" where generally ~ 40+% participate actively in Varsity Athletics and generally 60+% end up being Engineering Majors who have to squeeze 4 years of Classes into 3 years on campus it simply doesn't "pay" for coaches to recruit or go to bat for athletes who don't meet the minimums coming in the door. Why? Because before their freshman season is even half over they are usually Academically Ineligible and have to spend the rest of their time at KP working their butts off keeping themselves from being academically dis-enrolled. That's why as noted by basketballdad:

    The competition for nominations, etc and what the Superintendent uses his discretionary nominations/appointments/latitude for at an institution with fewer available spots than members of Congress/Nominating Authorities is handled very differently than at the large Academies - as far as "athletic recruits" it also is much different at the two DIII schools vs. the three SA's with DI programs.

    You don't need a "FOIA Request" to see the facts and data you only have to read the CFR and the annual reports that USMMA issues in a lightly distributed manner each fall on the prior years entering class.

    Why one would think the process and approach that West Point handles admissions would be even close to similar for "recruited athletes" which in the true nature of that phrase there are very, very few to USMMA and indeed under DIII rules there ought to be since as noted even at "civilian state/public or private DIII schools" there are no "Athletic Scholarships would be data that one could extrapolate to a what those talking about here seem to want to think of as a likely similar data set for USMMA is beyond me. The characteristics of the data points as well as the size of the overall population of any likely sample size is so different when one looks at the real facts it seems apparent to me that assumption is quite a stretch even from a pure "statistical analysis" perspective.

    So I'll just reiterate:

    and add if someone is in the incoming class at least at USMMA with test scores, etc below the minimums it isn't because some coach or similar lobbied for them. Not saying it can't ever happen just it's not done these days for "athletic recruits". USMMA doesn't need the next "David Robinson" to be competitive in the Liberty League....
     
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2014

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