Awarded 3 year scholarship..what if I fail the PT?

Discussion in 'ROTC' started by yiyh19, Aug 5, 2009.

  1. yiyh19

    yiyh19 New Member

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    I was awarded the three year scholarship from Army ROTC, but my major concern now is regarding the PT test.
    I'm having trouble with the push up and the 2 mile run.. What do you think will happen to me if I fail?
    I am also worried about my weight. I am 5'9 and weigh 190pounds..while the army weight standard says maximum is 175. Any ideas what would happen? Too afraid to call PMS, in the case they take away my scholarship...
     
  2. Just_A_Mom

    Just_A_Mom Member

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    Failing any one of those will cause your scholarship to be revoked. If you really want this scholarship, you need to go talk to your PMS.
    He can help you figure out a plan to lose a few pounds and get in shape. If you are overweight, you will be taped; if your body fat is still too high then you are done.

    The last thing you need is to be stuck with a bill you or your parents can't pay.
    Good Luck.
     
  3. Sedrider

    Sedrider Member

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    physical standards

    you wouldn't want to go through all that time and effort just to be DQed for physical standards right? i suggest PTing and watching ur diet/routines.
     
  4. bruno

    bruno Retired Staff Member

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    Son: that's a bad combination- you really need to change a couple of these dynamics- or really all of them. What will happen is that you will get put on probabation , given a certain amount of time (I thin a semester) and then you either pass or you will lose the scholarship. My first advice is to contact the unit SGM and talk with him/ her. They should have a good feel for how to get an overweight underperforming soldier in shape fast and they will work with you because that is what their career has been focused on- improving and mentoring individual soldiers. If you can't count on the NCOs to do this then you can't count on anybody!
    The good news is you can improve all of these numbers pretty fast IF YOU WORK at it starting today.
    Cutting weight fast- there are a million diets out there that work short term- I understand that modified SouthBeach is pretty effective at chopping a lot of pounds relatively quickly and is relatively sustainable- (just an opinion though and of course it's coming from a 53 year old guy who needs to lose weight himself these days!) As with all diets- they are only worth doing if you make some fundamental nutrition changes long term.
    There are loads of PT programs that you can download that will take you to significantly better scores quickly- if you are religious about them. Here is a link to one of them from the Army itself:
    http://www.ncsu.edu/army_rotc/APFT_Conditioning_Program.doc

    My thoughts: if you did nothing else- Pushups are easiest to improve:- you need zero space and zero help to do them. Basically as a minimum Do multiple (3) sets of pushups to failure every other day. Failure means literally arm trembling collapse on the floor on the last rep of the last (3rd) set. You can add Wide Arm and Elevated push ups to that work out- again 3 sets of each. You should be able to increase by about 10% /week.

    Running. The key to running is running. Get your cheeks out on the road for at least 3 miles and do not stop. (There is nothing magic about 3 miles- it's just that if you want to improve your 2 mile time you need to exceed it. 3 miles you can do pretty much everyday- it's long enough to improve you for the test and short enough that it's not really breaking you down to do it every day.
    If you never run at all initially concentrate on not stopping at all.
    If you are past that point- you have two different types of runs that you need to do and I would do these on alternate days- but at your age I WOULD RUN EVERY DAY!
    1. Minimum of 3 miles focusing on the best pace that you can achieve for the whole 3 miles.
    2. Interval running- again at least 3 miles but not at a constant pace. Add fartleks into the run ( ie- every mile put a quarter mile of lung burning pace, then the other 3/4 of a mile at a quick jog about half your 1/4 mile pace that you just ran. This will increase your wind a lot quickly. Again- you should be focusing on your times and look at about a 10% improvement weekly. If you increase the mileage - make sure you keep the same pace at the new longer distance- then focus on improving the pace at the new longer distance (ie don't add miles and slow down to compensate- remember you are trying to improve your 2 mile test times.
    These are basic standards- I think all you have to do to pass is 42 pushups and a 15:50 2 mile run- which you should be able to get to pretty easily if you are working at it. This is important not only because you have to pass to keep your scholarship but afterwords- Soldiers do not respect leaders who can't lead and exceed in something as fundamental as a PT test. Now is definitely the time to get serious and dedicated and fix this deficiency.
    Good luck and get going:thumb:

     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2009
  5. Just_A_Mom

    Just_A_Mom Member

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    Worth repeating. Excellent advice.
     
  6. goaliedad

    goaliedad Parent

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    The only thing I would add to Bruno's excellent advice is before you start out on a running program, make sure you have new, correct fitting shoes. Spend a few bucks and go to a running store (not Foot Locker) and get fitted for your specific foot shape by a professional.

    The consequences of running in ill-fitting or worn out shoes (especially in people needing to lose weight) are typically plantar facitis (that pain in your arch) that sets you back a month in your training when the only cure is rest.

    You can do it!
     
  7. tucker92

    tucker92 Member

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    FWIW, I don't know whether this would change your advice, but based on the given height and weight statistics, I imagine the poster is a young lady.
     
  8. goaliedad

    goaliedad Parent

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    Actually, the OP would be over regardless of gender, but it would be a greater overage for a female.

    And being the father of a ROTC candidate who will have to be taped (and may just barely pass that), I am sensitive to the issue.

    In goaliegirl's case, taping is also unkind to her as the proscribed exercise regimen for an ice hockey goalie (a lot of lower body work) is particularly unkind to the taping methodology of body fat content.

    For example, she regularly works out on the hip abductor machines (the ones where you squeeze together or spread out 2 pads with your knees). She'll stack 150 lbs (most of the machines max out at 180 lbs) and do multiple sets of 20 to 30 reps. These muscles are critical for butterfly goalies. She also does a lot of hamstring, glute, and quad exercises. None of these help her maintain a small hip measurement (you are penalized for large hips in taping).

    Right now she is having to alter her workout and diet regimen to reduce her bulk, so she can make tape. It is a shame, though as we have one of those expensive scales that you hold handles on and it sends current through you to determine body fat composition (overall and by section of body no less). Using such a device would certify her as being well under the body fat standard. However, they are not approved for military certification.
     
  9. kgrmom

    kgrmom Member

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    Something else that may help you feel a little better-

    I can pretty much guarantee you that you are not the only one coming into this that is going to be in this situation :) Don't be discouraged right off. Get a really good pair of running shoes - that is something we didn't do and I had to replace my D's shoes after a month. Map out your route so you know what 2 miles REALLY is (don't guess) and run/walk it at first.

    For my daughter's unit the kid's that didn't pass were not kicked on the first try (she is NROTC). They were put on remedial for the semester and had several "practice" PT tests before taking the actual final one later in the semester. I'm not sure but I'm just taking a guess that Army would give similar opportunities??
     
  10. NROTCDAD55

    NROTCDAD55 Member

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    What about the weight part of her question?

    I can anticipate the negative responses to this suggestion, but here goes anyway.

    After recently losing two friend to heart attacks in the same week (they were age 52 and 57 males), I made a friend of mine a project who was heading down the same path (overweight and diabetic), I did Atkins years ago and lost 35 pounds and have kept it off ever since following some simple rules (see below).

    Anyway, got my friend on Atkins and he lost about 24 lbs in a month (ok, he had more to lose than you, but the weight flew off), and we only WALK 4 miles daily for about 1:15 (not too fast, I'd admit.). Sometimes carrying hand weights. He has cut his insulin in half and his numbers are the best in 10 years.

    The American Medical Association has commissioned two studies to determine the long term effects of Atkins. I know that there are many detractors and critics - but at least in the short term it works.

    Now, after the first year all I did to maintain my weight was a very simple diet:
    1. No whites (pasta, bread, potatoes, rice)(I ate whole wheat wraps/bread/pasta when I wanted something like that)
    2. No fried foods
    3. Very limited fruits
    4. Very limited sweets/ice cream
    5. Try to keep sugar-based condiments (like ketchup and BBQ sauce) to a minimum. Use mustard and vinegar-based BBQ sauce. And some spaghetti sauces are lots better than others (which are often laden with sugar).
    6. No chips or buttered popcorn
    Other than that, I eat normally and don't count calories. 5"7" and 163 at 55 years old and very fit.

    Now you still get a lot of carbs from various vegetables, salad dressing, even whole wheat wraps - so those who immediately state that you need your carbs, believe me: it is virtually impossible to create any diet without carbs. Even olives and broccholi have carbs. But even Atkins maintenance allows for 80 carbs daily (after 20 in induction phase, so that is plenty). (BTW, there is a new book entitled the "No White Diet" in which a doctor essentially adopts this plan. Heard it last week on John Tesh!)

    I see two problems/difficulties in your situation:

    1. You are trying to run while losing weight, and you need a certain amount of carbs for that, although it is not long distance so that should not be too bad; and
    2. The Freshman 15 (which is often more like the Freshman 25), so next year even if you are exercizing with the "optional" pt, you may still not be losing weight (or even gaining it) if you eat 1/2 of a Dominos pizza at midnight.

    As I said - maybe not for everyone, but you can make weight in a short period of time and have your body draw its energy from itself which prompts weight and inch loss. [Conversely, those who say "Eat sensibly" need to look at what people are putting in their mouths at Applebees and Burger King and figure out nutritionally the calories and carbs in that stuff. No wonder America is in the shape it is in!] And doing push ups and running when you are 20 lbs lighter is easier, so there is some immediate positive feedback.
     
  11. goaliedad

    goaliedad Parent

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    Yes, changing eating behavior like the above mentioned diet method is critical in losing weight.

    It is very easy to chart exercise at a gym or on a track, but we often fail at charting our overall (24 hour) calorie burn when monitoring our diet.

    So you go and run 3 miles a day and do 200 pushups and situps. Does that mean you are burning more calories than you did as a "normal" civilian?

    Not necessarily so.

    Buried deep within this article

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/20090806/hl_time/08599191485700

    is a mention of a study of a group of women who were assigned to different excercise groups with different groups assigned to different levels of training time (personal trainer). They didn't vary much in weight loss - even the ones who did not get any training time. They also mention a study of school children who had different levels of PE activity. They monitored their overall activity level with some device and found the ones with longer PE didn't have overall higher activity levels, indicating that often intense excercise is "made up for" by lower activity levels the rest of the day.

    I think reading such an article for someone who is clear headed about changing their body composition will give them a better mindset to attack their issue. Beware the compensatory actions you take when dieting and exercising - they could be sabatoging your effort.
     
  12. singaporemom

    singaporemom Member

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    As a woman I can confirm that it IS much harder for us girls to lose weight. But, you are young, which does help. #1 drink tons of water....1 oz for every pound you weigh. It's alot, but it helped regulate my water retention and increase my metabolism.

    I would suggest visiting Quick Weight Loss centers for a nutrition plan, but skip the supplements they offer. You are too young and healthy to worry about that stuff. You cna even register online with them and get a plab written up.

    GOOD LUCK and keep us informed of your progress. WE WANT YOU TO SUCCEED!!!!
     

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