BFE Just Arrived

JJawsFoss said:
tsband,

That sounds very similar to what happened to my son, but his was only for the University of Minnesota (Carlson School of Mgmt). They called him on Tuesday and asked him to decide by Thursday. We bought some additional time until the following Monday. We had to think and pray, as well as do a lot of research before deciding which way to go. He has been preparing for USAFA since 7th grade and in the end, we decided he couldn't just give up that dream and never know if he would have received an appointment.

You are correct in that the scholarship was not legally binding, but if it is accepted and later rejected, it can no longer be offered to another recipient. The moral thing to do was to respectfully decline the scholarship.

All the best and hope to join you in June!

Jill
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I would not have done that Jill.

Like your DS, mine got a great offer to the UofMN CSOM. He was recruited into the "Gopher Business" summer program in 11th grade which had special $$'s set aside for those who later attended CSOM. He went back and forth between CSOM and the CBS honors program so he got to know both department heads pretty well. Each was trying to "sell" their department over the other. It was flattering.

In the end, he chose the College of Biological Sciences and was accepted into their Honors program. His scholarship package paid all of his tuition for 4 years. CBS is rated 16th in the nation for biology. You cannot just walk away from that and 100% paid tuition. I wondered what would happens if he got hurt before or during Basic? What would the plan for Fall of 2012 be without the AFA?

We were upfront with their department head. We said the USAFA was honestly his #1 choice. But we explained unlike other colleges, his "full ride" at the AFA won't happen until he passes basic training. Too many basic cadets before him didn't make it. I explained to the UofMN that even if he broke a bone before Basic begins, we would be turned back. In other words in the Spring of 2012, he did not have a garantee offer in hand by the AFA for a "free ride". So his situation was different than hanging on to another college.

My son wanted to do "the right thing" and not sign up for classes for fear of taking someone's spot. That's an honorable way of looking at this. But I explained to him that if someone doesn't get into the program, that's the colleges problem for not ironing out the logistics when situations like this happen. He was not the 1st recipient nor the last to switch horses in the 11th hour. So it really isn't a moral decision. It's a business decision. :) The school should have a contingency plan in place to make sure another student could take that spot.

So our approach was to talk with the head adviser at the University and explain why we had to continue sending in the deposit, registering for classes, etc. I did not want to lose that UofMN slot (nor the $$'s). He earned it. My son was really torn by this so I offered to talk with the UofMN. The conversation was professional and cordial. I asked the head of admissions what she would do? After a long pause she said "I understand it's your decision".:wink:

So IMHO, the right approach is to tell the school of choice what you honestly feel and you have to explain why you really don't have a garantee. Now if the USAFA honestly had a 100% garantee that he was in, now that would be a moral decision. But for those who are reading this, have a (great) plan B firmly in place. Praying for the best won't prevent a separated shoulder or a broken leg before or during August 6th. Don't give up a coveted scholarship from another school especially if the AFA has not selected you. If your son or daughter gets hurt and you gave up that other fantastic offer, that's not looking out for their best interests. :)

Other peoples mileage may vary but I for one did not see this as a moral decision. Plan B knew what his desire was upfront which takes any gray area. Even if the UofMN disagreed, I still would have pushed forward with keeping plan B in place. I also believe that my son offer to serve his country should give him extra leeway. It's the right thing to do from their perspective to allow plan B to be in place.:wink: He earned it and he wants to help protect this great nation. Like your son and daughter, he had plenty of other opportunities. But he wanted to serve. He felt the obligation and desire to make a sacrifice. There are hundreds of military courtesies and policy exceptions put in place. And they should be in place. :) I for one didn't feel I pushed the boundaries or ethics. If someone who is in charge of a college disagrees, I'd be happy to explain my logical point of view. If you present it property rational folks will understand. If they don't, I say still keep plan B in place!:)
 
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To MN-Dad-2016: There's probably no one's opinion I respect more than my Dad's because I have a deep respect for his intelligence. That was exactly his position when I explained about my DD's situation (described earlier in this thread). I'm glad you shared your views because on an intellectual level, I really do totally agree with you, but it's hard when you're facing decisions like this to not second guess yourself about what's right and ethical. Sometimes just having someone like you spell it out as plainly as that is necessary to hear.
 
MNDad,

I assume you are trying to be helpful, but you are making assumptions and we are talking about two different types of scholarships.

The Commander's Leadership Scholarship was offered by the AFROTC Det 415. It was not offered by the Carlson School of Management. The CLS is used to lock in talent to that AF Detachment early. Believe me, if there had been a moral way to accept the CLS while making our intention known that he would decline if offered a USAFA appointment we would have taken that route. However, they would not be able to offer the CLS to anyone else if he accepted and later declined. I believe there is a February 1st deadline for the Detachment to lock in their CLS scholarship. We talked to several ALOs, former AF officers, parents with USAFA Grads, and other military officers. It was not a decision taken lightly or foolishly.

My son does not have an appointment, so we knew we were taking a huge gamble. He wants to attend USAFA so badly and has been working towards it since 7th grade. If he accepted the CLS, he would have withdrawn his name from USAFA and then would never have known if he would have received an appointment. He has nominations from Congressman John Kline and Senator Franken to USAFA. However, we do have plans A, B, C, and D lined up. He has applied for an AFROTC Scholarship at either St Thomas or the U of MN/Carlson School. He has been accepted to St Thomas, Carlson, UND, and Purdue and has received other scholarships. While waiting for news from USAFA, we are taking tours, attending seminars, making housing deposits, and he's filling out additional scholarship applications. I am a graduate of the Carlson School and my degree has served me well, so we have a pretty good understanding about that path.

My point to all of this is that there are different types of AFROTC scholarships. I couldn't find very much information regarding the CLS and I hope my posting helps if someone finds their family in a similar situation. You do not have until May 31st to decide about the CLS and morally, if you accept the CLS they ask that you would decline an Academy Appointment.

Best of luck to all. We hope to see you in June!

Jill
 
Hi Jill,
You are correct. I assumed you were talking about a decision closer to my sons. My bad. :)

That all said, I think it is out of line for the CLS to limit your DS's dreams. Nothing is a given and certainly not in MN considering students have the highest ACT scores in the nation. So personally I would not have any ethical problems with ignoring that request to turn down a better opportunity. It wouldn't be fun having to make that call to back out of ANY offer. But at the end of the day, your DS would be serving his country. That's honorable. The key is not to agree to their terms and say "I promise, I will turn down the AFA". Say nothing after they lecture you about how they want you to stick with it. I'd say, "I understand your position." and leave it at that.

Therefore I just don't see the problem with taking a spot and not having another person fill it. After all, if you decided to take the CLS and later pass on the AFA because you felt an obligation to turn it down, the number #2 person still would not have gotten that CLS program.

If it's legally binding, that is one thing. I personally question the integrity of someone who can question your sons desire to serve in any capacity. While others would not sleep well at night, I would have to make the decision to take the EXCEPTIONAL plan B opportunity until plan A was a reality. So in summary, I still don't think its a moral decision to lock in on plan B until plan A comes to fruition. But I understand why that tugs on you. I do my best to take the emotion out of tough decisions like these.

That said, I wish your son the very best and I hope his dreams come true! :)
 
The other key thing about the AFROTC Commander's Leadership Scholarship is that accepting it removes you from consideration from regular national scholarships. Aside from holding out for USAFA, the other main reason I turned down a CLS offer last year was because it wasn't for one of my top choice schools.
 
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