CFA at NASS

Discussion in 'Naval Academy - USNA' started by MWmom, Mar 9, 2013.

  1. MWmom

    MWmom New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2013
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
    My DS was selected to attend NASS this year and we have been reading through the materials we were sent. Can anyone tell me if the CFA they take at NASS is the score that is used for their USNA application or if they will be allowed/required to retake it for an "official" score?

    Thanks!
     
  2. esu8

    esu8 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2013
    Messages:
    43
    Likes Received:
    0
    CFA

    It will be their official score. They will have the opportunity to take it again if they don't do well.
     
  3. Vista123

    Vista123 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2011
    Messages:
    1,180
    Likes Received:
    105
    No reason your son shouldn't start working on this now.
     
  4. MWmom

    MWmom New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2013
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
    Absolutely! He has already started working to prepare, but he knows that he will probably not max out by NASS and was hoping to be able to keep working through the summer and retake it.

    Thanks for the replies.
     
  5. GoBlue1984

    GoBlue1984 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2012
    Messages:
    284
    Likes Received:
    3
    It is important to remember that the CFA is ultimately a pass/fail test. Once you meet the minimums, you physically qualify. It only weights 10% against the overall candidate score. So maxing it out will only have a minor impact on admissibility. In contrast, an improvement in ACT or SAT will have a significantly greater impact.

    Also remember that it is not super scored. When you take it a second time, your original scores are "erased" and you start over. If you end up with a bad retest day, lower scores could actually hurt. So on a retake, you might do better on the mile run, but if push-ups or sit-ups are lower the overall score could be worse. You can also only take it twice and if you pass at NASS, that will count as one (I think).

    Just food for thought.
     
  6. Blue Skies

    Blue Skies Member

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2010
    Messages:
    54
    Likes Received:
    0
    NASS CFA

    And don't forget- NASS CFA scores can be shared between academies. Both the USMA and the USAFA accepted my daughter's NASS scores. I believe they are evaluated a bit differently, however. If they are good- use them!
     
  7. usnabgo08

    usnabgo08 USNA 2008/BGO

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2007
    Messages:
    1,829
    Likes Received:
    595
    Yes and no. Candidates sometimes are not reviewed by the Admissions Board until their CFA is complete. Going in with the attitude of just meeting the minimums (and actually doing so) could actually gain negative attention. Likewise, a very remarkable performance could gain favorable attention, all else being equal.

    Never heard of this two time CFA limit. Any other BGOs aware of this? I know it is the latest CFA is the only one to count, but this is the first I have heard that only two attempts are allowed. I'm pretty sure a candidate could take it 10 times if they wanted.

    Excellent point and this applies to any CFA taken -- contact the Service Academy to which the original CFA paperwork was submitted and request distribution to the other SA's you are applying to.
     
  8. usna1985

    usna1985 USNA Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2006
    Messages:
    4,511
    Likes Received:
    461
    To my knowledge, you can take the CFA as many times as you want but only the most recent scores count. It's not like the SAT/ACT where USNA will take your highest CFA or the highest scores in each event from among your CFAs.
     
  9. riveranduin

    riveranduin row well and live

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2012
    Messages:
    62
    Likes Received:
    1
    I took the CFA at NASS this past summer, and honestly the way they did it, the odds of you getting your best score there are fairly high (the huge numbers at once led to slightly longer waits between events). I don't think I maxed anything (maybe sit-ups, I can't recall), but when I went I talk to my BGO in September, he said what I had done was fine.
    Part of what you want to look at is when you will be in the best shape. I had just finished my spring sport season and was two weeks into summer swim, when I took it at NASS. If I had done it later in the summer, my scores would have been hurt by the couple weeks I was in situations where I had no workout opportunity.
    With regards to taking it multiple times, my impression was that Navy allowed as many re-takes as you want, but at least one of the other SAs did have a limit. And yeah, no super scoring.
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2013
  10. Whistle Pig

    Whistle Pig Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2006
    Messages:
    1,634
    Likes Received:
    1
    Thanks! Yours are particularly notable insights on the NASS CFA experience. Both relative to your conditioning AND to the NASS procedure. Candidates looking for an edge for their application would do well to note your excellent insights!:thumb:
     
  11. GoBlue1984

    GoBlue1984 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2012
    Messages:
    284
    Likes Received:
    3
    I took this from my DS who attended SLS last year (he was invited but had a conflict for NASS). He took the CFA at SLS and "failed" on two of the areas. Since he failed at SLS, he stated he was told he could attempt it up to two more times once the portal opened. He made one additional attempt and scored at or slightly above average on all parts. He only did it one additional time and whether WP would have allowed him more than two attempts I can't say; I was under the impression they would not.

    It is interesting that the academies differ in this regard.

    Also, I didn't mean to imply that maxing out the CFA isn't desirable - but just wanted to point out to the OP that a max CFA score will have less impact on admissibility than a high class rank or maxed SAT score. Obviously the better your CFA, the more prepared you show yourself to be physically for the rigors of Annapolis (or one of the other academies) and it does improve your score and chances of admission.
     
  12. Whistle Pig

    Whistle Pig Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2006
    Messages:
    1,634
    Likes Received:
    1
    Having watched and read this CFA discussion for many seasons, let me offer a broadbrush on my take. And I'll assure that there are no doubt exceptions, perhaps many over the years. Here goes.

    1. As noted, CFA is pass/fail. If one passes barely, it's not too much less than if one maxes it all. Some, not much.

    2. So there is some slight variation possible in the WP score among those who pass. Those who don't, of course, it matters not. They're out. None, to my recollection, have ever been able to indicate that the variation is significant. Minimal, at best.

    3. And the bottomline is generally this. A failed CFA will prevent any further consideration. A passed CFA will allow for further consideration. A highly passed CFA will allow for further consideration, with but a few bonus points.

    So the issue is simple. Pass it and move on. Rarely, fretting about a few more CFA points will not get an otherwise unappointed candidate appointed. It's majoring in the minors at that point, imo. Getting an A in calculus will move that candidate up a whole lot further and faster.
     
  13. usnabgo08

    usnabgo08 USNA 2008/BGO

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2007
    Messages:
    1,829
    Likes Received:
    595
    That is generally true.

    However, from what was passed on to me by an RD was that candidate's records are not normally pushed to the Admissions Board until their CFA is complete. A poor CFA performance could sway a few decisions.

    Given that competition is getting better and times are changing (budget/sequestration)...bottom line is a candidate needs to strive to do their best in anything....because if one doesn't (or can't) there are others out there from whom USNA can choose from. The more one works out and practices the exam, the odds are the better they can/will do. There isn't a rule saying you can't practice a mock CFA a week before the real one to assess improvement. I also view that an improvement from one CFA to the next show initiative, determination to improve, and commitment to physical fitness.

    Remember, the Whole Person Assessment is what is being evaluated. I would leave no card unturned, especially for things that are in one's control!
     
  14. Vista123

    Vista123 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2011
    Messages:
    1,180
    Likes Received:
    105
    I have to agree with usnabgo08, why leaving anything on the table? There is ALWAYS one more thing you can do to improve your odds. There is nothing to say you cant retake your SAT and work on your CFA.
     
  15. redskyatnight

    redskyatnight Tina

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2013
    Messages:
    22
    Likes Received:
    0
    I didn't pass the CFA my first time, I failed the mile section and afterwards my BGO told me you are only able to take it twice so to make it count. This was confirmed to me through and email to my regional counselor. I wound up passing my second time, not maxing out on any section but that didn't seem to hurt me since I was offered appointment to the incomming class. So if you pass be grateful and don'y worry about maxing out.
     
  16. Whistle Pig

    Whistle Pig Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2006
    Messages:
    1,634
    Likes Received:
    1
    Agree that all should strive to do their best. Always. None contended anything to the contrary.

    However, let's be very clear about your contention that "... competition is getting better..."

    By all traditional measures of the USNA class profile, this is not so. While there are vastly MORE competitors, the final measure of the competition is collectively lesser. That's a painful truth, but the USNA numbers don't lie.

    As for "leaving anything on the table", as it has been consistently noted, re-taking a CFA, in an attempt to do a little better, unlike doing that with other standardized testing, carries real risk of leaving the best ... on the table. It's always THE LAST CFA that counts. Not the BEST CFA.
     
  17. usnabgo08

    usnabgo08 USNA 2008/BGO

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2007
    Messages:
    1,829
    Likes Received:
    595
    WP, hence why you take one's own practice assessment before trying to do it.

    WP...you are right the numbers don't lie...since the Class of 2011, every year there are more candidates that are fully qualified. I guess either the candidates are getting more impressive or the Admissions Board is lowering its standard? What the final class "looks like" isn't what candidates need to worry about....they have NO idea who they are competing against during THAT cycle.

    Additionally, from those fully qualified to those offered an appointment, the Class of 2016 was the most selective than any other class since C/O 2011 and it had the lowest number of offers, as well. Cut the stats any way you like....but candidates better bring forth their best efforts because STATISTICALLY it is getting harder each year.
     
  18. Whistle Pig

    Whistle Pig Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2006
    Messages:
    1,634
    Likes Received:
    1
    I'll guarantee, you nor any others really want any analyses on this one. You've conveniently cut the number of years that illustrate this issue. Looking at it from whence it was in 12-14K of candidates to the currently hyper-inflated 20K, the statistical decline is significant. Sorta flies in the face of what one would anticipate, and certainly contradicts your claim.

    As you said and did, you can conveniently cut the numbers however you might like. Except when you've conveniently disregarded the foundation of the stats, i.e. when the competition became MORE. It did not become GREATER.
     
  19. usnabgo08

    usnabgo08 USNA 2008/BGO

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2007
    Messages:
    1,829
    Likes Received:
    595
    WP,

    I do my homework and work with stats that I have (if you can provide me the number of candidates who were actually reviewed by the Admissions Board past 2011, I'd be happy to expand my analysis). My analysis IS NOT based on the NUMBER of applicants or candidates. It is based on how many were reviewed by the Admissions Board, how many were fully qualified, and how many were offered appointments.

    As you have stated in previous posts, the number a candidate should be concerned about is how many actually go in front of the board...i.e. the competition isn't 20k but the 5-6k presented to the board. Given that each class has had LESS offers, and an increase in the number fully qualified...means less chance of an appointment. Based on using the number of reviews in front of the AB (hard to inflate that number since all completed applications gets a review) and the numbered of offered appointments (again, can't really inflate that either), Class of 2011 had 37% chance of appointment and Class of 2016 was 22%, if one completed the entire application and had a nom.
     
  20. Maplerock

    Maplerock Proud to be an American

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2013
    Messages:
    582
    Likes Received:
    346
    USNABGO08

    :smile: good luck...
     

Share This Page