CGA Incoming class expected to be most diverse ever

Eagle dad,i agree with your point, as an american i hate to see the watering down of one of the few institutions that work in this country just so some can feel good when they worship at the altar of diversity. What happened to the notion of a meritocracy? To say on one hand we have 'the best and the brightest' and then on the other hand showcase the fact there is such a high percentage of this group or that group strikes me as a bit ironic. I can see to fulfill the mission there needs to be an increase of certain languages spoken for the obvious reasons or the need for a better gender mix (and there are only 2) when in many operational deployments, but to fudge the numbers and target certain groups to appoint so as to have a diverse officer corp for the sake of having a diverse officer corp is insulting. If i'm sinking in the gulf of maine i could care less if that cutter steaming toward me is diverse all i want is for the crew to be the best darn sailors to pull me out of the 15 foot seas. I was stunned when i read the news release chatted about earlier in this thread, if the officer corp and advancement is based on your skills, merits, honor, hard work, integrity, devotion to duty then why should the corps of cadets be chosen any other way. And if you start targeting groups for inclusion then you will always mark them with the added burden of proving themselves as people will wonder how they made it over the bar. I have a cadet at cga, i think this sort of societal stuff makes their lives just a little bit harder. Hang in there eagle and good luck to your son whatever he chooses to do. c i
 
1EagleDad said:
What happened to the holistic approach? I guess that the holistic approach is only if you meet the criteria that the diversity program is looking for. I wish that someone would have the cajones to just come out and said they were going to increase the minority and that white males were going to be a thing of the past...or at least until they need the familiar type of leadership that has gotten the USCG to this point...it's only been what? a couple hundred years of success?
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1EagleDad,

I'm troubled by your assertion that somehow only white males are qualified to lead the Coast Guard. Surely you don't think that military leaders such as Colin Powell and Eric Shinseki are somehow sub-par, simply because they're not white?

I'm sorry that your son did not gain admission to CGA, but as sprog noted, it is very competitive.

It is also the only military service academy that does not rely on congressional appointments to fill its corps of cadets. To maintain its merit-based admissions system, free from congressional interference, the CGA has had to recruit top students who wouldn't normally consider attending the Academy. How is this a bad thing? If a top minority student chooses to attend the Coast Guard Academy over Duke or Harvard, isn't that good for the Academy?

Once the stats for the Class of 2015 are released, my guess is that they'll show that the incoming class has higher average GPA's and SAT scores than previous classes. Just because class composition is more diverse does not mean it is somehow less qualified than previous classes.

It just means that the Coast Guard will have a well-trained and capable officer corps that looks more like the rest of the country. :thumb:
 
I do not believe that anyone who has posted has a problem with diversity. Diversity makes us better in so many ways. The problem occurs when an entity assumes that those who are different require additional/extra attention, help, resources, which are NOT available to the population as a whole.

It creates an odd situation for those "minorities/women/insert URM label here" who ARE fully qualified to enter CGA with the rest of the class, and who do not need/require any additional help/resources. Casts them into the role of the victim which is NOT where anyone wants to be at CGA or any other top notch, competitive university.

If these kids truly are the best and brightest, AND they make the class of 2015 the most diverse ever, then kudos to CGA for making it happen. If not, and they (or any other cadet for that matter!) need hand holding beyond the early days of their time at CGA, then I think a lot of people will have a problem with this program...and rightly so.

My hope is that 2015 kicks some serious butt! Go get 'em Bears. :thumb:
 
shellz said:
I do not believe that anyone who has posted has a problem with diversity. Diversity makes us better in so many ways. The problem occurs when an entity assumes that those who are different require additional/extra attention, help, resources, which are NOT available to the population as a whole.

It creates an odd situation for those "minorities/women/insert URM label here" who ARE fully qualified to enter CGA with the rest of the class, and who do not need/require any additional help/resources. Casts them into the role of the victim which is NOT where anyone wants to be at CGA or any other top notch, competitive university.

If these kids truly are the best and brightest, AND they make the class of 2015 the most diverse ever, then kudos to CGA for making it happen. If not, and they (or any other cadet for that matter!) need hand holding beyond the early days of their time at CGA, then I think a lot of people will have a problem with this program...and rightly so.

My hope is that 2015 kicks some serious butt! Go get 'em Bears. :thumb:
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Shellz -- Very well stated!
 
Weather said:
1EagleDad,

I'm troubled by your assertion that somehow only white males are qualified to lead the Coast Guard. Surely you don't think that military leaders such as Colin Powell and Eric Shinseki are somehow sub-par, simply because they're not white?
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Read it again, I don't think that is what he said.
 
shellz said:
I do not believe that anyone who has posted has a problem with diversity. Diversity makes us better in so many ways. The problem occurs when an entity assumes that those who are different require additional/extra attention, help, resources, which are NOT available to the population as a whole.
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Shellz, It makes no sense for the Academy to recruit desirable candidates (in this case, URMs and women), only to let them fail once they're cadets.

The Coast Guard Academy has finite resources, and they've already said that if the pilot orientation/intervention program is a success, they'll try and expand it to include all incoming cadets.

Help is available to all cadets, but not all of them know where to find it or even think that asking for help is okay. And honestly, I don't have a problem if a cadet gets a little extra help along the way; this isn't a case of one cadet succeeding at the expense of another.

I give the Academy props for balancing competing requirements and limited resources while still providing ALL cadets with a world-class education and producing great Coast Guard officers.
 
Shellz, well said, the same bar for all based on their merits, no special exceptions or handling, make the classes coming out of all the academies the strongest possible ( though we are partial to the cga ) our country is going to need honorable exceptional leaders now more than ever with what will be headed our way. Seeking out diversity for diversity sake confuses things, we are all different, the standards should be applied universally and each different individual over time will make things 'diverse'. c.i.
 
leapyear said:
An article in yesterday's Navy Times ... contained the following quote: "The academy has developed several programs meant to help retain those incoming minority students, especially during their “fragile first year,” Stosz said. This summer, minority cadets will be able to get acclimated to the academy a few days before the rest of the class arrives June 27."
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Weather, Of course help is available to all cadets. That isn't what is being discussed here. The gist of this thread stems from the quote above -- that minority cadets could report earlier than non-minority cadets in order to get acclimated. So, in that vein, I repeat my first post in this thread: Wow. No fair.:thumbdown:
 
Weather said:
Shellz, It makes no sense for the Academy to recruit desirable candidates (in this case, URMs and women), only to let them fail once they're cadets.

The Coast Guard Academy has finite resources, and they've already said that if the pilot orientation/intervention program is a success, they'll try and expand it to include all incoming cadets.

Help is available to all cadets, but not all of them know where to find it or even think that asking for help is okay. And honestly, I don't have a problem if a cadet gets a little extra help along the way; this isn't a case of one cadet succeeding at the expense of another.

I give the Academy props for balancing competing requirements and limited resources while still providing ALL cadets with a world-class education and producing great Coast Guard officers.
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+1000 :thumb:
 
Weather said:
Shellz, It makes no sense for the Academy to recruit desirable candidates (in this case, URMs and women), only to let them fail once they're cadets.
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So it is the academy's job to not "let" them fail? I thought they were to educate and prepare them for a future rife with difficult and dangerous situations, requiring split second decision making and an eye towards detail and initiative. It is the cadet's job to not "let" himself fail by having the tenacity and initiative to seek out help and resources when needed. The help is there folks, it really is. Failure is part of the equation at CGA....everyone hits a bump in the road, and guess what? They learn from it and take that knowledge with them into the fleet, the world, and their lives. Try to protect kids from failing at something, and you have a recipe for disaster. CGA has done a great job of providing help for the cadets within the current system, and those who make it through have what it takes to serve and serve well.

Weather said:
The Coast Guard Academy has finite resources, and they've already said that if the pilot orientation/intervention program is a success, they'll try and expand it to include all incoming cadets.
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Yes...finite resources that should be used to ensure the success of all cadets, not just URM cadets. And your use (or CGA's use, if that is what they said) of the word "try" is not reassuring.

Weather said:
Help is available to all cadets, but not all of them know where to find it or even think that asking for help is okay.
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They were smart enough to do well in school, score high on the SAT, but they can't figure out where to get help? But somehow the non-URM cadets can? I find that to be insulting to the URMs as it implies that they are somehow lacking in their ability to cope. They are not.

Go 2015. You guys are better than all this speculation. You CAN and WILL do it! Go Bears.
 
I agree with Shellz! Isn't it almost a little insulting to have to offer these kinds of programs? As a girl, I wouldn't want someone to hold my hand through swab summer just because I am female. Heck, I'd want to be pushed just as hard as the guys! And if someone doubted my ability to handle that, I would be pretty offended! I have no problem with increasing diversity. I think it is great and just adds more to the experience of the Academy since there will be people from every aspect of the country! But the class of 2015 is in it together. They will succeed together, fail together and work together. Adding these programs kind of tarnishes that idea by separating the "team".
 
My second semester roommate was a minority recruited through the CGAS program. Unfortunately, he couldn't handle the academics and was disenrolled as a result. If the Academy wants diversity, they shouldn't sacrifice the standards or let a cadet fail...
 
As the mom of a current Swab in Charlie Company, I am putting my own personal feelings about the CGA RISE program aside and focus on the class of 2015 learning to become a team even with all the "diversity" in their class.

They have made it through Day 4 and all my thoughts & prayers are with the swabs and their families who are waiting for that first letter home!

Go Class of 2015 & Go Bears!

:thumb:
 
SamAca10 said:
My second semester roommate was a minority recruited through the CGAS program. Unfortunately, he couldn't handle the academics and was disenrolled as a result. If the Academy wants diversity, they shouldn't sacrifice the standards or let a cadet fail...
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Always dangerous to make an judgement on one data-point.

The unofficial numbers that were discussed by the academy administration at the R-Day parent orientation does not indicate a lowering of admission standards. 2015's G.P.A. was 3.79, .02 higher than last year. SAT scores (not yet official) were 1259 combined score for 2015 compared to 1269 for 2014 and 1240 for 2013. The numbers just don't support "sacrifice the standards".
 
holistic approach?

I know that there were thousands more applicants this year than there had been in the 20 years before...but what was that ONE thing that was the real hot button? Someone knows...

Was it the SAT score that was the primary factor in the application process?

We're just trying to understand what the ONE area of the application that got one cadet rejected over another one.

Oh, as far as assuming that I don't think that a good leader can only be white that's incorrect. I have known and served under many different leaders in my life. Some have risen to their position because of their race and gender and were terrible leaders...good people, but terrible leaders. White guys included.

My question is this...if we all want a diverse leadership...who is sacrificed to attain that diversity? The guy who has been filling that position for years...the caucasian male. Everyone wants to pull down the leaders to try to get to the top themselves. If a URM is qualified then they should get the job...but they shouldn't get the job just because they are URM. How about an equal opportunity opportunity.

So am I not allowed to have my diverse thought or do I need to fall in line with everyone else about the trend to make everyone feel good about inclusion? Diversity is good to a point...it's a tipping point where we usually don't know and can't forecast the outcome until it's too late.

Why do we go out recruiting and begging people to join "our" service academy? So your numbers stay high? Take the "best of the best" that want to be there and they will perform to the high standards expected of them. Sure, their grades may not be at the top level, but either way...out of the 290 cadets, there will always be a #1 and a #290. If everyone is the "Valedictorian" of their school just imagine how many disappointed people there will be when grades come out and there is a fight for the top spots...you need some gap in there for the cream to rise to the top and separate itself from the other 3.85ish GPA cadets. How many Rhodes scholars will come from this group?

You can strive be a top university in the area...but what's the objective? To graduate top leaders of the USCG or to be at the top of the list in the NEWSWEEK Top Universities of 2012?

Just because you are intelligent doesn't mean that you will be able to communicate and connect with those you lead....and that is what we thought was the objective. To develop good leaders to serve America, all of it's people in whatever capacity was required.

I wish I had more time...perhaps tomorrow.

Happy 4th of July everyone. Celebrate the sacrifice of those men and women who died for your freedom to express your opinion. Whether we agree or not.

And by the way...put a flag up in your yard or on your house and be proud!

Father of a US Navy Recruit. OO-RAH
 
Don't count on the Coast Guard Academy getting an increase in budget. Don't expect the Coast Guard as a whole to get a much bigger budget (lets not forget, the President tried to cut the CG's budget this year).
 
What is the ONE area of the application that got one cadet rejected over another?

First to level set...this is just an opinion. I am not an AAP or anyone associated with the Academy. Just an opinion from a mom whose daughter was rejected.

After going through this long and difficult process with my daughter I have to believe it is NOT solely the standardized scores...her ACT placed her in the top 1 % of the country.

It is not solely class rank. Out of 1,000 graduating seniors in her high school, she was in the top 2%.

It is not AP courses or class rigor - she carried a full honors and AP course load her entire high school career - including AP Calculus, chemistry and physics.

It is not solely leadership. She was a youth director for a 501C charity and helped change the role of the National Honor Society for the better at her school as an officer.

It is not solely physical fitness. She was squarely in the average range for accepted swabs.

It DOES have to do with sports - that was her weak point but I think if she had, had another "particular talent" that would have been overlooked.

After all of this I believe applicants who were accepted have most of or close to all of the above but what gets them accepted is a "particular talent" that the academy needs - that could be sports, that could be a great voice or a skill with an instrument. That is what our daughter was lacking.

Could be totally off base...but that's my two cents.
 
riverdale said:
Weather, Of course help is available to all cadets. That isn't what is being discussed here. The gist of this thread stems from the quote above -- that minority cadets could report earlier than non-minority cadets in order to get acclimated. So, in that vein, I repeat my first post in this thread: Wow. No fair.:thumbdown:
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I'm going to limit my participation in this thread because it's already become a bit of a dogfight. But as a URM cadet who actually *gasp* made it through 4/c year, I just want to clarify a few things:

Yes, ALANA is a mentoring program formally supported by the Academy. But it is not mandatory, and the extent of institutional involvement is to make a list of names (volunteers and 4/c), and match each other by sex. After that it's completely up to the mentors and mentees to do as they see fit with each other (the mentors, mind you, are volunteers from the various student diversity councils. No volun-telling here. If there aren't enough volunteers, then upperclass simply get multiple people to mentor).

Calling RISE "reporting early" is to seriously overestimate the leg-up the program would give anyone. I'd think of it more as the Academy's official way of saying to the URMs that "You Are Not Alone". Certainly the most enduring part of RISE for me was getting to meet some of my other minority (and international!) classmates.

And as for the increasing percentage of URMs per class... remember how small the classes are compared to the other academies, and other colleges in general. The absolute number of URMs doesn't have to jump too much to make the percentage swing all over the place. I'd be tempted to dismiss that number until there's actually some form of trend (to say nothing of retention, but that's an entirely separate issue).

As for the poster who implied that minority cadets would "HATE" having a special program for them... yes it is vaguely insulting, but then again so is being placed in Remedial Swimming while at a maritime service academy. The difference here being that the RISE and ALANA programs are both completely and totally optional.
 
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