Do no pull-ups really mean no West Point?

Discussion in 'Military Academy - USMA' started by Chocolate, Dec 20, 2011.

  1. Chocolate

    Chocolate Member

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    If a male can't do any pull-ups but does ok on everything else on the CFA, will he fail the CFA? Will West Point look at other factors in deciding whether the no pull ups means an F for the CFA, such as scores on the other components of the CFA, prior athletic participation, back packer, life guard, etc.? My son is not a recruited athlete but he a big boy (not fat, just big) and was a football lineman and I would guess that some of the recruited football linemen struggle with pull ups too because pull ups are hard for big people. My son took the CFA once and hopefully he will be granted permission to take it again. He has started training to improve his pull-up skills, but that will take time.

    Thanks
     
  2. MemberLG

    MemberLG Member

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    Yes, any individual event failure will result in overall failure for the CFA.

    West Point do grant waivers for CFA failures. I don't know what the waiver process is other than the Regional Commander requests it.
     
  3. Chocolate

    Chocolate Member

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    Thanks. I didn't know about the waiver, which is helpful. My son has two nominations to West Point, good grades, good test scores, good leadership experience, etc., he just can't do a pull up! Is the Regional Commander the person my son has to contact to get permission to retake the CFA?

    Thanks again for your help.
     
  4. MemberLG

    MemberLG Member

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    Yes.
     
  5. hawk

    hawk ButterBar Dad

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    Just something to think about, but there will be many activities during beast & plebe year that will be very difficult if you cannot do a pullup.

    My recommendation if serious is to immediately start working on this. Even if he was to get a waiver, he will not want to be "that guy" in his squad.

    Not only will he have to do pullups in PT, you will do activities involving walls & such that are pull-up type activities. And unlike some of the females who at least are light enough to be helped up by buddies, if he's a big boy it will cause problems for the squad. He does not want to be "that guy"!

    Likewise, in Military Movement plebe year he will have difficulty with most of the IOCT type activities.

    He can start with weight training to emulate pullups until he reaches a point that he can execute them.

    This is true in general of all CFA type items with the exception of the B-Ball throw.. if you are having trouble getting a competitive score, much less passing an item, it will come back to haunt you once at USMA. You really want to be able to achieve at least average, ideally better.

    Also add leg lifts to the list.... because it's not on the CFA or APFT most appointees do not train for it, and pay the price especially in beast. But remember that all plebe year periodic "smoking" will take place, and will usually involve whatever PT you do not excel at. :smile:
     
  6. dunninla

    dunninla Member

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    You know, when a Hollywood actor gets a part that requires they put on muscle and drop fat, or even gain weight, they do it. They get a trainer who helps with nutrition and supervises daily workouts.

    There is no reason, given 2-3 weeks, that a person cannot train up to being able to do a few pullups. This is a hurdle, but do you really want an officer leading our nation's finest in harms way that cannot clear a hurdle of this small size?
     
  7. Chocolate

    Chocolate Member

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    Thanks for the replies. He is training for the pullups, but he wasn't able to start training until after football season ended and he needs more time. He is 6'4" with really long arms, and really long arms make pullups harder. He can pull up to his nose (and hang there a long time), just not to his chin, although he is hoping that in a few weeks he will be get to the chin. Can he ask for a retest before he receives the letter from West Point saying that he did not pass the CFA, or does he need to wait for that letter before he asks for a retest? Thanks for the help.
     
  8. Sawndog

    Sawndog Member

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    I was 6'2, 215 lbs at one point and could do about 4 pull ups and I worked at losing weight through working out and dieting and had done many push up and pull up workouts and within 3 months I was 180 lbs doing ~15 pull ups and almost doubling my push ups (80 now). Lose weight, there is a reason why Navy beats us at football - NO WEIGHT STANDARDS :D
     
  9. TacKLed

    TacKLed Member

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    Of all the things to fail at, pull ups are the worse. Not to beat around the bush or anything but your son needs to lose weight because saying that he "big not fat" is code-word for "he is fat but I don't want to label my son that way". Also, being tall shouldn't hinder pull ups. I went to the gym (you're suppose to rest the day before your PFT, I was told) and still managed 13 (I'm 6'2). Seeing as he is not a recruited athlete, they won't take his height and weight into consideration. He will just be seen as the kid that lacks upper body strength to do the most common thing that will need to be done.


    How many push ups did he do?
     
  10. BigNick

    BigNick Member

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    I am not trying to be mean but- if you want to be a West Pointer you need to quit thinking about not being able to do something. Get to work on pullups and have a "can do" attitude.
     
  11. SeaMars

    SeaMars Member

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    Authority?

    Would love to hear from either someone with very specific knowledge in Admissions on this, or a Field Force Representative who has been briefed. There are some fairly definitive statements being made without a specific reference to authority -- do those who have replied above know?
     
  12. Chocolate

    Chocolate Member

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    It's the really long arms, not being tall, that make pull ups difficult--it's a matter of physics--the longer your arms the longer the distance that you need to move your body (mass) to complete the exercise. He weighs 215 pounds and is not fat, but he is working on losing weight now that football is over. He is taking 4 AP classes and finished his Eagle Scout this fall and, when you add those things to football, he just did not have time to train specifically for the CFA until after football was over. He needs more time, and he needs for West Point to allow him to retake the CFA. I don't know how many push ups he did, although I know he was doing around the average in his practice CFAs--he is working on increasing the number of push ups he can do too. Thanks to everyone for all of the advice and encouragement. He does have a can do attitude which is why he is working hard on his pull ups.
     
  13. Sawndog

    Sawndog Member

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    I have extremely long and slender arms (6'2 as well) as well and I had always thought that was holding me back from push ups and pull ups. Well, while there is some validity to that statement, it is not entirely a huge set back. I worked at my push ups and brought them from struggling to pass (42) to getting above the max (72) within a few months. My pull ups I can get 15 now on an average day. Just figure out a good routine (mixing weights with body weight exercises and including cardio and abs within workouts while dieting works wonders) and stick with it.
     
  14. hawk

    hawk ButterBar Dad

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    sounds like a good kid, just start training now. No one here can answer if he can retake or is "at risk" due to pullups. If you wait for an answer to start you will likely run out of time.

    If at 215 he has a hard time with the pullup just hit a weight room. Use the lat pull bar, but hold it like doing a pull up. I'd do as much weight as he can complete 5-10 rep sets at a strain. Then start working up.

    once he can complete a pullup, put a bar in the door to his room or hallway and do pullups anytime he walks by.

    Instead of thinking of this as a screening test, understand it's prep for what he will have to deal with at USMA.
     

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