DoD Budget Cuts, an Outsider's Perspective

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To no one in particular,

Something I try to remember about resorting to personal attacks and broad assumptions...

Is that while it satisfies a need we may have to lash out, it only serves to bolster the other's assumptions about us and our positions.

And I think perhaps the chasm is wide enough already; wouldn't we all agree?
 
I'm probably guilty of the broad assumptions (as is, probably, Meteor).
 
I think there is plenty of that to go around.... on BOTH sides for sure. :smile:
 
The assumptions are already made... whether we want to admit it or not.
 
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Folks,

A mod has already posted one warning about keeping this topic apolitical. I'm adding to it the requirement of this site that you not attack other posters. You can disagree with one another, but keep the discussion on the points that they make, not on their personality, background, political views, etc.

I don't like to close threads but, if this one doesn't get back on track, it will be closed.

Fair warning . . .
 
meteor,

You say you want to get the pulse of the military so you visit this site. As mentioned this site is designed for those seeking admission to a SA or ROTC programs. Yes, we discuss other things, but that is not the primary purpose of the site. A few thoughts (not that they are worth anything):

1. Don't read websites to get a pulse, go see, talk, and more importantly listen to service members. That includes E-1s all the way up to the highest officers. If you want the pulse, go directly to the sources. Have you toured barracks? Not the new shiny ones bases have, but some of the old ones or an enlisted berthing space on a ship. I had Marines living in condemned housing at one point! I, for one, actually believe military pay with all the benefits and tax breaks are actually pretty decent. There are some military officers assigned to the Hill, talk to them. They arrange lots of trips to bases, ships, etc. A lot of my friends have served in these billets and they are top notch people and officers. Use them, they will talk all day about the service in which they choose to serve.

2. Have you visited Bethesda or Section 60 lately? Ever? These are the real heroes. If you are to represent the issues and all sides, ensure you know about this side of the military. These are young men and women who have made the biggest sacrifices. When you hear about VA backlogs, death benefits not being paid and all the other things, regardless of political party, these are the people and families who get hurt the most.

3. Please do not group military members as mindless drones who cannot think for themselves and are all right wing tea party members. The military has a top notch, educated, intelligent, creative force that gets the job done no matter what. This is true for the youngest service members to our Generals. IMPO, what you see from the top ranking brass on the Hill are military members trying to survive in a weird political world. I would hate their job, glad its not me, because I would probably start yelling at every politician and staffer. I just left the defense contracting world for the "regular workforce." My ability to communicate, brief, discuss things, etc are light years ahead my peers. I 100% attribute that to my time as a Marine. I would tell you to hang out in a wardroom on a ship for a few days and you will probably hear some great conversations that challenge folks on their beliefs, views, etc. Better yet they will shake hands at the end of it and it will be done without the name calling (your name calling is pretty ridiculous and comes across as extremely unprofessional).

4. Your assertion that all military members are Senator McCain blind followers and Tea Party members is really wrong. As a USNA grad, and many others, we hold Senator McCain in the highest regard for his service and what he went through as a POW and what it took to make it back to flying. Politically, not a huge fan of his, but there are plenty of others I disagree with more. As far as the Tea Party, wrong again. Actually I think you would find most service members want a balanced budget and realize we need big cuts in the DoD. But we also believe there are plenty of cuts that need to be made outside the DoD and all cuts should be done intelligently.

5. One of the things every brand new Lt or Ensign learns is never go to your boss with a problem... you better have solutions to go with them also. As far as I can tell all you do is blame and identify perceived problems. How about this... be a part of the solution? Get rid of the name calling, trash talking, blaming and be a part of the solution, not the problem.
 
I'm pretty sure Meteor would never, in a billion years, consider his work to be "The Lord's." Ever.
I bet he does, it's just a different "Lord" than others might think of.

BTW ... anyone else notice that meteor is long gone from this discussion?
 
He's PMing folks, so he's around. Maybe he's on recess?

Honestly, NavyHoops gave the best advice here. You want to give feedback on the military, or have an idea what the issues are? Go to the Russell Senate Office Building, through the doors next to Hart. After you walk through that doors, go about 20 feet. To your right is the Army's Senate Liaison office, and within that office is the Coast Guard's Senate Liaison office. Across the hall are the Air Force, Navy and Marine Corps Senate Liaison offices.

If you're in the house, I forget the building, but the liaisons are right near the food court.

Share your thoughts there. Or better yet, listen to them. The liaison officers likely have more experience and education than you, and they've seen the world a little more, so they can give you the "Ivory Tower" thoughts mixed with reality.

And while you and much of the public assumes the military is a bunch of right wing nut jobs, you would probably be surprised to discover how many liberal members there are. True, LITS is not one of them. I'm under the general thought that the government is inefficient and wasteful, and that through extends to the military as well. I probably wouldn't have voted for your boss, and I certainly didn't vote for this president. That said, I was a government major in undergrad and learned long ago that the way I think and what I believe are mine. I can state those thoughts and feelings without feeling the urge to have every liberal friend around me agree with me. We all approach things differently. I'm OK with that. It doesn't mean I think your approach is right, or grounded in reality, but I also allow for the fact that I may be wrong, even when I know I'm right.

Meteor, you came here guns blazing. In politics, I'm sure you know, understand the crowd you're talking to.

The other day a senior member of congress, spoke at an organization I'm a member of. The organization is made up of senior experts in their areas. The member of congress glazed over much of what he had to say. People were respectfully, but it was clear afterwards that they got very little out of it. Know who you're speaking to. If you're talking to experts, you can't approach issues the same way you would if you're talking to kindergardeners. If you come to a online discussion board mostly made up of veterans, retirees, active duty, reserves, cadets/midshipmen, prospective/hopeful future cadets/midshipmen and their families, I recommend not immediately coming down on the side of "the military is always wrong." You can ease into that mindset. I would agree that it certainly CAN be wrong, but at least butter people up before asserting it, especially if you have very limited experience on the subject.
 
I bet he does, it's just a different "Lord" than others might think of.

BTW ... anyone else notice that meteor is long gone from this discussion?

Never Interfere With an Enemy (or someone debating you) While He’s in the Process of Destroying Himself. - Napoleon.

Or in a modern manifestation "Please proceed, Governor".


Some of the replies dwere unfortunately edited by the moderator, since they rather illustrated my point in an ironic fashion, I was quite disappointed. I suspect if any of those utterances came from active duty service members they would have been booted out if their superior officers were notified under the rules of UCMJ. Not that I would do that.

I'll submit a substantive response to some of the comments later.
 
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Never Interfere With an Enemy (or someone debating you) While He’s in the Process of Destroying Himself. - Napoleon.

Or in a modern manifestation "Please proceed, Governor".


Some of the replies directed towards me were unfortunately edited by the moderator, since they rather illustrated my point in an ironic fashion, I was quite disappointed. I suspect if any of those utterances came from active duty service members they would have been booted out if their superior officers were notified under the rules of UCMJ. Not that I would do that.

I'll submit a substantive response to some of the comments later.

Oh, now this is just getting precious.... the staffer thinks UCMJ has a play in this. Honestly, I can only laugh at this point. If he wasn't accusing me in PMs are "thinking he's Kenyan" I might be full into thinking he isn't VERY junior.

But as you said "Meteor, please proceed." The entertainment factor is just too great now. I can tell you one thing; junior staff on the hill are a dime a dozen.



And I will take a moment to convey a very fun story. A few years back a three star Coast Guard admiral was on the Hill testifying. After the hearing a mid-level staffer decided he wanted to take a moment to make some demands of the uniformed Coast Guard officers. The admiral turned, saw what was happening, and tore the staffer "a new one." I believe the story goes, "Hey, you. You don't talk to them from now on. If you need something, your Congressman can contact me. You won't be talking to my people."

Meteor will figure this out at some point... members of the military don't work for members of Congress. At no point is a Congressman or Senator in their chain of command. And a staffer? Not even an afterthought.

But I REALLY did like the UCMJ reference... classic! :thumb:

I'm going to go out on a limb and predict that Meteor is gunning for a "BANNED" note below his name here. The guess the bright side of that.... less of our tax dollars are wasted and we don't have to witness the slow process of him becoming a "man" on the internet.
 
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Oh, now this is just getting precious.... the staffer thinks UCMJ has a play in this. Honestly, I can only laugh at this point. If he wasn't accusing me in PMs are "thinking he's Kenyan" I might be full into thinking he isn't VERY junior.

Obviously, I wasn't talking about comments directed towards me, but ones directed at elected officials like the President. I admit that someone with poor logical and reading comprehension skills could think otherwise, I guess it's clear that standards have dropped in certain departments as I suspected.

Obviously, the kenyan reference wen't over someone's head.
 
Obviously, the kenyan reference wen't over someone's head.

Nope, just chose to ignore it.

I'm really going to miss these exchanges once you're no longer allowed to post here.

You came.

You alienated regular folks.

And then you were banned.

And I guess the somewhat sad thing, at least for the people who may have to interact with you in the future, is, you have no idea what you did wrong. You're still 100% sure you have a leg up on everyone here, regardless of experience, education, knowledge or income, you seem to think you have something going for you. Maybe you do, I just have no idea what it is. So you talked down to people and lectured them about things they know far more about than you.

And while you apparently think you know "the game" what we all realize here is, despite our grumblings about elected officials, the most successful ones know how to talk to any group, and to listen. Here, this week, you have neither listened, nor successfully talked. You showed your colors, and they weren't of a future successful politician. No. Just a staffer.

And you'll be banned, and people here will forget about you. You will not have left a single mark.

:rolleyes:
 
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UCMJ...for comments to some supposed junior hack whose name wouldn't even be recognizable to the legislator who employs him. Classic. Seriously, which one of you is behind this meteor username? Best prank ever.
 
UCMJ...for comments to some supposed junior hack whose name wouldn't even be recognizable to the legislator who employs him. Classic. Seriously, which one of you is behind this meteor username? Best prank ever.

LMAO! :shake:
 
If we are in the prediction business, my guess is a locked thread instead of a banning.

Sadly, neither side did itself all that proud here. :thumbdown:
 
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