Economics at Kings Point

Discussion in 'Merchant Marine Academy - USMMA' started by kpbaseballmom, Feb 17, 2011.

  1. kpbaseballmom

    kpbaseballmom Member

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    Many, many mids are having trouble passing economics at KP. Is there any current mid or alum that successfully found a way to study and pass this course. Any tips? So many good students are not doing well and seem to be at a loss as to how to study for this class.
     
  2. kp2001

    kp2001 USMMA Alumnus

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    Good ole economics... I remember Professor Katz like it was yesterday, but have no idea who is teaching it now.

    Unfortunately I don't have much for study tips as I can't recall what study aids we were using, I don't think we really had any to be honest.

    Was there a recent change in the professors? I don't recall hearing of "many good students" struggling in that class in recent years.
     
  3. shutterbugC

    shutterbugC Member

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    The GA Parent Association can have some study aids for this class if there is a great need. We currently have Calculus 1 and Physics study aids but can get study aids for any subject. We just need to know how big of a need there is for us to get and have on hand these study aids.
     
  4. kpbaseballmom

    kpbaseballmom Member

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    You can ask the current mids, but from what I hear, there is a need. The professor asks them to read a chapter , which can be 25 pages I am told, in one night, then calls on people the next day. If you get then answer wrong he deducts a point from your grade. If you answer what he considers a "dumb" answer, 2 points are deducted. While this would be OK for the students if he were asking main points in the chapter, he goes after extremely minor points, almost with the expectation that you memorize the chapter. My child in not in this class - I am hearing from the other students. Would like to know how a mid can approach studying for this class? What methods have worked for other Mids? Very good students are failing or nearly failing this class. Economics isn't rocket science and surely not as hard as physics or calc so something is wrong here!! Supposedly his tests also focus on some very minor points made in the chapters, which when the test covers 10 chapters, can be almost impossible to study for.
     
  5. deepdraft1

    deepdraft1 Master, Ocean Steam or Motor Vessels, unlimited

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    I asked my son, who graduated a few years ago, if this was the same guy he had for Economics.. He said it sounded exactly like Professor Cohen, who he said was "legendary" at KP. He told me he didn't know how he managed to pass the course, but he did with a D (while learning virtually nothing about economics). He also said the grade distribution was as "random and bizarre" as Cohen's quirky teaching style.

    He's not rated very high here
    http://www.ratemyprofessors.com/ShowRatings.jsp?tid=408096&page=2
     
  6. kpbaseballmom

    kpbaseballmom Member

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    Hellooooooooooooooooooo Dr. Kumar!! Can anything be done about this? I read the reviews on Rate My Professor and they exactly fit what the mids are currently saying. Everyone can't be wrong. There is truth there. This should not be tolerated. Someone needs to sit in on his classes and see what he is doing, have him correct it or get him out of there. This can impact how the alum view the school when they graduate and therefore not feel inclined to be supportive. There has to be some great econ teachers out there.
     
  7. KP2013dramamama

    KP2013dramamama Member

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    I totally agree with you about the possibilities of Alums not wanting to contribute financially if the same ridiculousness, to put it politely, hasn't changed. There has got to be a way to contact the academy about this without the midshipmen being punished. Perhaps through the Alumni Association? Parent's Associations coming together?
     
  8. shutterbugC

    shutterbugC Member

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    Does everyone take Economics or just the Deckies.
     
  9. KPMarineopsdad

    KPMarineopsdad Member

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    Everybody takes economics. DS failed the same course. He had to "lag" it in his first class year and did much better the second time around. As a parent, I know how frustrating this can be but I chose to stand back and let him figure it out which, of course, he did.
     
  10. jasperdog

    jasperdog Member

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    I couldn't agree more with you. Also as this thread seems on the brink of going off topic with the whole "Don't people understand these sorts of bad experiences might make people not want to donate to the USMMA" - I started a separate thread that is now open and available to discuss that topic.

    http://www.serviceacademyforums.com/showthread.php?p=166776#post166776
     
  11. KPDD2014MOM

    KPDD2014MOM Member

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    I spoke with my DD and it appears the students are taking control and reporting this individual instructor as approx 90% are failing the course or have a "D". Our children are very smart and handling this well. :thumb:
     
  12. jasperdog

    jasperdog Member

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    Good luck with that the subject Professor is tenured, has been a faculty member sine 1978 and is but one of eight of the 33 faculty members in the Academy's largest department with a PhD level degree - something relatively important when it comes to periodic Accreditation Reviews such as the USMMA is getting ready to have to undergo shortly. Of course you never know what might turn the Dean head on this subject, I mean it's not like the professor in question is also a published author or has any other credentials in his favor ... oh wait a minute ...

    Don't get me wrong from what I've heard the subject professor is indeed a bit over the top, but I seem to recall a Physics professor I had my own Plebe year who failed 75% of the class and the result was ~50% of that section getting dis-enrolled. As I said this isn't high school, and frankly 25 pages of reading to prepare for each class as well as the 200 pages of material I understand this Professor expected the class to have in their grasp for his last test is not something that is unheard of for a class such as Economics at the University level.

    I'll venture, if that's the student's only or biggest legitimate, substantiated complaint little if anything can and will be done other than perhaps giving a larger portion of those who fail this time around a chance to lag the class next trimester. Nor should it probably be given the actual reality that the Dean is working to raise the Academic standards across the board.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2011
  13. Lynpar

    Lynpar Member

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    Whew, for all the newbies and their parents starting to get alarmed by this thread, near as I can tell Economics is not until term 4 at the earliest and term 8 at the latest. B-spliters seem to get it later whether or not they are deck or engine. I can call my DS down from his room where he is curled up with his high school Econ book. :rolleyes: He said he was just going to start reading it to soak up as much as he could now. Maybe I will just leave him up there after all. :shake:
     
  14. deepdraft1

    deepdraft1 Master, Ocean Steam or Motor Vessels, unlimited

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    What Jasperdog is saying here, in so many words, is that the 'subject professor' is, as we say in the Merchant Marine, 'fire proof'..
     
  15. KPatKP

    KPatKP Member

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    This is all just part of the roller-coaster ride. Get ready, it's a good one!
     
  16. cmakin

    cmakin Member

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    I know in my class (81), there were a couple of professors that were, for the lack of a better term, useless. Or at least in our eyes. Yet, somehow we got through it.

    Only 1/3 of the engineers in my class passed one particular course our third quarter First Class year and had to re-take it during the fourth quarter. To add to the frustration it was retaken from the same teacher and scheduled for 1600 hours (killing Free Gangway once license was passed). Luckily, I was one of those that passed and was never happier with a C- in my life. That is the way it goes.

    If the Economics professor is in fact the one who was mentioned, I had him but he wasn't on my personal list of bad professors.
     
  17. kpskilegac

    kpskilegac Member

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    Comments from a current mid....

    After checking with a couple of current m/n, I rec'd the following note:

    The professor in question is indeed Professor Cohn. As someone already said he has been here since 1978 and he did write the text book for the class. He holds a PHD and is a really brilliant guy, kind of weird and likes to go on strange tangents (he loves to fish)… His class is basically what you put into it…reading ahead is key- a suggestion would be to divide up his syllabus of chapters and have one kid read and take notes out of each chapter, then forward it around your section…he doesn’t like typed notes so writing them out would be a good idea…he literally goes around and asks questions right out of the book so taking verbatim notes from the book is a smart idea…if you answer the questions right you get a point, answer with a smart twist 2 points, wrong or don’t know -1, dumbly -2…the points you accumulate in class are added directly onto your final exam grade which really helps a lot of kids out in the end… the tests are where he kills most of his students…he covers a lot of material and you only have 2 exams …it is the small things that kill you in some cases but usually it’s the time…trying to do one or two homework problems on top of the multiple choice questions in exactly one hour is really difficult…it helps to memorize skeletons of the homework problems so you will know how to get them accomplished, or shortcuts to getting certain parts done quicker…the wording of some of his questions are quite difficult to understand but he is fair in the sense that if he makes a mistake he doesn’t catch before giving the exam he will give students the points back…his homework’s are worth 2 points each and there are usually 10, if only 9 he gives everyone the free 2 points…everything is based on points and the total of all your points somehow determines your grade…but having the homework points and the class participation points from answering questions can save you even if you fail both tests…he likes mids a lot, he loves to talk to people about economics and the novels he has you assigned to read…if you go to him and ask him questions he is really helpful and he sees you’re interested…he does not however base your grade on how many times you visit him (as some teachers give the gentleman’s d) he is overall a fair guy…if you read the book you do well, if you study hard you SHOULD do well on the exams (but that doesn’t always happen)…it really comes down to how much work you want to put into the class- if you read you do well, if you don’t then he deducts and you're already in negative numbers…if it’s a class that you aren’t really worried about because you have more important core classes to deal with then you can work something out with your section- everyone always does anyway…hes a good teacher and the class is actually pretty interesting with completely understandable material; he is just sometimes a bit difficult to deal with…

    This sounds like a reasonable solution as many mids study together and share notes etc. This is just one person's opinion. Hope it sheds some light.
     
  18. wth51

    wth51 Member

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    kpskilegac: Thank you for your insight.
     
  19. kpbaseballmom

    kpbaseballmom Member

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    KPskil:

    This is exactly what I was looking for. Hopefully, it will help many others in the future at least get through the class, even with that "D". Thank you!!
     

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