" Failure of Leadership"

Discussion in 'Academy/Military News' started by greeneagle5, Feb 10, 2015.

  1. greeneagle5

    greeneagle5 Member

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  2. servenow

    servenow Member

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    This is a very disappointing and unsettling expose. Miller was a model for upcoming officers in Annapolis!?! How are students at usna responding to this?

    Sent using the Service Academy Forums® mobile app
     
  3. Capt MJ

    Capt MJ Member

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    This will make an excellent case study in ethics. Admiral Miller was a well-regarded and respected Supe, but good officers are capable of doing bad things. Regardless of rank, it's far too easy to get caught up in these things if "we've always done this." Fat Leonard was well-known, and he made it easy to let poor judgment and a sense of entitlement wreck the moral compass of officers who should have known better. I encountered my share of slippery slopes when on active duty, and occasionally they are hard to recognize until you make yourself pause and actually look down. The more money that is involved, the slipperier and steeper the slope.
     
  4. Sydney C.

    Sydney C. Member

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    Disappointing to be sure...a sad day. The personal irony here as I type this is looking up from my desk at a framed appointed letter for DS signed by Admiral Miller himself.
     
  5. NavyHoops

    NavyHoops Moderator

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    Agree ADM Miller was well respected by the Brigade and I hope this does become a case study. Although case studies with folks of this level of rank are always hard to imagine as a Mid. The few articles I have read are very vague on what they specifically did so its really hard to form an opinion of what really happened. As mentioned, he seems like he might have gotten caught up in the "this is how its always been done" and didn't ask enough questions or step away from a questionable situation. Officers of this rank and even civilians who deal with contractors and others receive numerous briefs and training on what is allowable or not. They have lawyers and protocol officers on their staffs who can help when questions arise. Its disappointing to see they didn't at least question these things first. Good lesson learned for all officers and future officers.
     
  6. LineInTheSand

    LineInTheSand USCGA 2006

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    You spend your entire life buliding your credibility and career. It takes one bad decision to change you from the good guy to the bad guy. Any prospective cadets/midshipmen (and I guess anyone else) should remember that.

    Part of our CGA indoc was "Who owns your honor?" To simplify the answer.... you own your honor. It's the only thing that can't be taken from you, you have to give it up.
     
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  7. MemberLG

    MemberLG Member

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    My personal opinion, ADM Miller "gotten caught up" in something. I doubt he didn't get caught up in the "this is how its always been done," rather he got caught up with "I am special because of my rank." As you correctly pointed out, senior officers "receive numerous briefs and training on what is allowable or not" and "have lawyers and protocal officers on their staffs." If it is wrong for a junior officer, it's wrong for a senior officer also.
     
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  8. usnabgo08

    usnabgo08 USNA 2008/BGO

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    I think more information is needed on what these 3 Admirals did before anyone can lay judgment. Gifts accepted more than a certain dollar value (I think it is $20) are not allowed unless approved by certain authority. Are they going back and looking at if someone received $30 or is something far more consequential? Yes, Flags receive briefs and such, but I think it might be a little ridiculous to go back ~10 years to see if someone went over the limit by a few dollars or something far more consequential (hence why I think we would need to see the facts). We might as well see if ALL the Flag officers currently serving ever did that for any gifts and then censure those, as well. If the facts determine something so grossly unethical occurred, then appropriate action (and this is what the SECNAV is saying) is justified. BTW, I am not saying that spending $1 over the limit is acceptable or ethical, just that is it really worth it to waste time, resources, and holding up Flag officer movements and retirements for something inconsequential?

    I mean there are so many little rules in ethic regulations that many people don't know....for example, if a co-worker's family member passes away, one has to be careful how an email is worded, so not to imply that one must contribute to some type of "fund" if the person has financial hardship and the command/unit wants to help (out of the goodness of their heart) AND the contribution cannot be more than $10/person. Therefore, if someone gave more than $10, they would be violating ethics policy.

    I just think more facts are needed before we say whether it was gross negligence and that Flag officers think "they are special because of their rank."
     
  9. Wilco

    Wilco Member

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    Well said LITS. Tell my own children reputation is like a glass sculpture if it is broken you can try and glue it back together but it will never be or look the same.

    Too bad for all.
     
  10. LineInTheSand

    LineInTheSand USCGA 2006

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    To usnabgo08: Maybe, but the Navy doesn't hit three admirals for going $10 over. I'm pretty confident something happened that was big enough to get the attention of "big" Navy.
     
  11. Capt MJ

    Capt MJ Member

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    And - those 3 admirals are accountable for actions, decisions and policies made by subordinates. It may be a case of they "knew or should have known," a well-known investigative phrase, or deemed to have failed to put sufficient measures in place to ensure ethics policies were adhered to. We will never know all the facts.

    One aw-s_ _ t ruins all the atta-boys.
     
  12. usnabgo08

    usnabgo08 USNA 2008/BGO

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    LITS, I would hope so, too. Some news outlets are reporting that 3 dozen flag officers are being looked at.
    I am not a JAG or lawyer, but since military rules of evidence do not apply at NJP and it is simply an "administrative" action (non-punitive), why wouldn't the SECNAV or the consolidated disposition authority hold Secretary/Admirals mast instead of just a letter of censure? Again, not sure on the legal aspect -- maybe statue of limitations is still applicable. A Secretary Letter of Censure, from my understanding, is a little more harsh than a Letter of Reprimand, but less than NJP.
    I also believe that the "Carrier videos" that happened a few years back ended up in similar administrative action -- which speaks to Capt MJ's point. It ended up being poor judgment and whether production of those videos was appropriate.
    Doesn't the citizens have a right to know what the Admirals did? LITS -- you would be good to answer that with your PA background.
     
  13. LineInTheSand

    LineInTheSand USCGA 2006

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    Typically, an administrative action isn't released. Honestly though, I'm not entirely sure is that's different for a flag officer. I would assume it's not.

    So.... my answer is horrible.
     
  14. greeneagle5

    greeneagle5 Member

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  15. MemberLG

    MemberLG Member

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    Doing the right thing usually works out, whereas if you approach things first from is it in violation of some policy or not means you are concern about not getting in trouble.
     

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