Go Navy! Beat Army

[navygirl89]

WOW.

Back in my younger years, I used to love watching Army guys cry at the end of the game. Today it just looked pathetic watching the Army QB cry. First off, it's just a game. I know there's emotions, adrenaline, and testosterone, but come on.. Man up. Second we're still at war. What's he going to do when his butt gets shipped out to the sandbox and something real happens?

I'm pretty sure that if you spent the last 4 years of your life training really hard for a sport that you have been playing most of your life and you lost one of the last games you would ever play. You would be bawling like a baby too.
The only thing pathetic in the whole scenario really is your post and your lakc of empathy.
_________________________

But anyways stoked that Navy won even though it sucked to watch Steelman cry.
But it was a good game for both teams, the score was close (and super low - as always ) and Army did have their moments.

 

[parentalunit2]

lovethenavy - On the contrary, the best times we've had watching and attending all the intra-service games were in 'mixed company'!

As to Steelman's reaction, the only thing pathetic was the fact that the network coverage wouldn't leave it alone. I get the 'drama' factor that they have to go for, but I always feel after a sporting event that they should focus on the winner's celebration, and not the other team's tears.

Does anyone else find it odd that the Army QB is branching QM? Typically they are expected to branch infantry. Perhaps that's been our problem for the past four years. Ah well, eleven and counting....

 

[Hurricane12]

I'm pretty sure that if you spent the last 4 years of your life training really hard for a sport that you have been playing most of your life and you lost one of the last games you would ever play. You would be bawling like a baby too.
The only thing pathetic in the whole scenario really is your post and your lakc of empathy.

I'm pretty sure that navyasw02 has spent that last 10+ years of his life training really hard on active duty and dealt with a little more adversity than losing a football game.

I get that it's emotional. If Navy had lost, I'm sure a lot of the players would have probably been crying as well. I also agree that the broadcasters should have given him a little space. After the first couple minutes it stopped being sympathetic (and, yeah, a little funny) and being awkward and uncomfortable to watch.
A few tears is expected and fine. I'm sure most of the other seniors (who everyone seems to be forgetting about) were upset and crying as well. But completely breaking down and openly bawling? Come on, man, it's national television.

He didn't train really hard for four years to win a football game (at least he shouldn't have), he trained really hard for four years to lead Soldiers. The stakes after graduation for him and his teammates are going to be a lot higher and everything is just going to get more serious and difficult. At the end of the day, this was just another football game, and his contributions to Army Football will matter far less than his contributions to the guys he leads, the Army, and the country. I know perspective can be hard when you suffer a disappointment like that, but maybe he should have kept that in mind and held his head up.

 

[usna1985]

I remember the days when it was USNA that was losing to Army and AF and everyone else. The season when USNA went 0-10. Which followed a 1-10 season and preceded a 2-10 season. When USNA went 4 yrs without winning a home game. The 13 yrs in the 80s and 90s USNA won no more than 5 games any season. It sucked.

And the one hope each year was beating Army at the end. The one thing that might make a miserable season at least somewhat bearable. And when that didn't happen, there were more than a few tears on the USNA side. With all due respect to the recent grads, you haven't experienced what Army is going through. It's only a game but we all know it means more than that.

Yes, in the vast scheme of things, this will pass. The Army players, including the QB, will go on to do much more important things. But it probably is/was at least one of the most defining moments of their lives to date . . . well, I get the disappointment, which went beyond the QB crying.

I agree the press should have left it alone after the first minute or so. But, that's the press.

 

[Jason922]

Glad Navy won...but I do feel bad for the Army QB. Hours of work for nothing.

 

[Bullet]

I'm pretty sure that navyasw02 has spent that last 10+ years of his life training really hard on active duty and dealt with a little more adversity than losing a football game.

I get that it's emotional. If Navy had lost, I'm sure a lot of the players would have probably been crying as well. I also agree that the broadcasters should have given him a little space. After the first couple minutes it stopped being sympathetic (and, yeah, a little funny) and being awkward and uncomfortable to watch.

A few tears is expected and fine. I'm sure most of the other seniors (who everyone seems to be forgetting about) were upset and crying as well. But completely breaking down and openly bawling? Come on, man, it's national television.

He didn't train really hard for four years to win a football game (at least he shouldn't have), he trained really hard for four years to lead Soldiers. The stakes after graduation for him and his teammates are going to be a lot higher and everything is just going to get more serious and difficult. At the end of the day, this was just another football game, and his contributions to Army Football will matter far less than his contributions to the guys he leads, the Army, and the country. I know perspective can be hard when you suffer a disappointment like that, but maybe he should have kept that in mind and held his head up.

'm pretty sure that navyasw02 has as well. I'm also pretty sure that at age 23, he didn't face as much pressure as the Army QB did, on national TV no less, to win one for his team-mates, his Alma Mater, and for every fellow cadet at WP who placed so much emphasis on this game. He was trying to make up 10 years of frustration, and for a fumble that lost it for his team two years ago, only to to fumble the ball again with victory oh so close.

Were other Army players (and fans) crying? Certainly. And did CBS focus too much on the QB's reaction? I agree that they did, but understand WHY they did this, mostly because they are part of the ENTERTAINMENT industry, and this display of emotion is a way to show how important this game is to some and adds the human element. Doesn't mean I agree with WHAT they did.

He'll get over it eventually. He'll more than likely will go on to bigger and better things and be successful at them. And yes, he will gain some perspective on it.

But unless you yourself have faced that much pressure, at age 23, in the National spotlight, you have no right to judge how he handled the disappointment.

 

[Whistle Pig]

A few thoughts ...

1. The team that SHOULD have won DID win. Not because it was Navy, but because the scoreboard "said so." That is the beauty and the tragedy of sports. The scoreboard is unemotional and ALWAYS reports who was ahead as time expired. Army played well. Navy won. The Mids scored more. Bunk suggesting "Army should have won." They should win when they score more. They did not. It's really simple and pure.

2. Why did Navy win? They executed what and when they were supposed to more often than the Black Knights. As the announcers announced ... Army has lost a whole bunch of games for one reason. Turnovers. They lost one more yesterday for the very same reason. Turnovers. They failed to do what they were coached to do. MVP for the game: Navy's DEFENSE. Played well WHEN they needed to execute. Runner-Up: Navy QB for his gutsiness, playing hurt, and notably the last drive when he answered the bell.

3. As for the Army QB, I too felt for him. But he is so very fortunate to have loved playing for and with a team that when they failed to achieve their hoped-for victory, he hurt. But in the end, the game was won and lost precisely by the teams that were supposed to win and lose.

We too often use the metaphor of battle and war for athletic contests, and sometimes it helps to explain the experience of competing. In that vein, Winston Churchill lent one of his pithy pronunciations that puts this in perfect perspective ...

“It is not enough that we do our best; sometimes we must do what is required.”

The Army QB did his best. It seems none but him might argue that . Give him credit for that. Give him credit for his pain for having let down his mates. Again. But according to the game's verdict, he did not do what was required to win.

Lastly, thankfully this game is not war. It is a great game. Let's celebrate this young man's ability to play for 4 seasons. His sadness is only possible because of the joy we saw among the Mids. Next time it might be different. But if we've sorrow ...let's feel sorry and weep for the men who lose in battle.

 

[navyasw02]

'm pretty sure that navyasw02 has as well. I'm also pretty sure that at age 23, he didn't face as much pressure as the Army QB did, on national TV no less, to win one for his team-mates, his Alma Mater, and for every fellow cadet at WP who placed so much emphasis on this game. He was trying to make up 10 years of frustration, and for a fumble that lost it for his team two years ago, only to to fumble the ball again with victory oh so close.

Were other Army players (and fans) crying? Certainly. And did CBS focus too much on the QB's reaction? I agree that they did, but understand WHY they did this, mostly because they are part of the ENTERTAINMENT industry, and this display of emotion is a way to show how important this game is to some and adds the human element. Doesn't mean I agree with WHAT they did.

He'll get over it eventually. He'll more than likely will go on to bigger and better things and be successful at them. And yes, he will gain some perspective on it.

But unless you yourself have faced that much pressure, at age 23, in the National spotlight, you have no right to judge how he handled the disappointment.

Internetmate...

At 23 I was driving a billion dollar submarine with about 130 crew onboard during a war. Compare that to a football game solely for entertainment purposes. Lets get real here, OK?

What these young folks at the service academies do while in the comforts of Bancroft will never compare to the level of responsibility or mental challenge required for caring for the lives of his/her sailors.

 

[usna1985]

What these young folks at the service academies do while in the comforts of Bancroft will never compare to the level of responsibility or mental challenge required for caring for the lives of his/her sailors.

Exactly! The point some of us are trying to make is that most of the firsties (those who aren't prior enlisted) don't yet know that b/c they've yet to experience it. In a few years, more or less, the game will come into perspective. Just not as of last Saturday night.

 

[Bullet]

Internetmate...

At 23 I was driving a billion dollar submarine with about 130 crew onboard during a war. Compare that to a football game solely for entertainment purposes. Lets get real here, OK?

What these young folks at the service academies do while in the comforts of Bancroft will never compare to the level of responsibility or mental challenge required for caring for the lives of his/her sailors.

Web-buddy,

Sure. Let's get real here. At 23, you were an Ensign most likley assigned to your first boat. Remember what they called those butter bars on your shoulders? They called them "$&@t-shields", and for good reason. Your superiors EXPECTED you to make mistakes, based on your lack of experience at your new job. You got away with those mistakes with a shrug from your supervisors saying "what do you expect? He's an Ensign".

Of course comparing the levels of responsibility and challenge between those performing a combat role and those playing in a game is a moot point. There IS no comparison on those levels. But I have to ask? When you walked onto that boat to do your mission back then, did the ENTIRE base lead cheers for 4 months prior hoping you "won"? Did the SecNAV and CNO lead formations of sailors world-wide in telling you to win one for the team? Did every prior service sailor you met for those 4 months prior shake your hand and say "Win it for us?" Did every person on that Navy base march out in formation prior to your launch to cheer you on? Did they all stay and cheer you from the sideline? Did you have cheer-leaders and marching bands leading you up that ramp? Did all this occur on national TV, ready to follow and analyze, for eternity, your every move? And when you did screw up (which, as an Ensign, is inevitable), did you do so in front of millions watching?

The words used to describe the Army QB's emotional display were "pathetc" and "laughable". I find those who labeled it as such pathetic as well, as they obviously never had to deal with that kind of pressure to perform in a sports contest on such a national level, with so much on the line -- few, if any, will.

Is this pressure to perform in an athletic contest different (and in the big scheme, less important) than the pressure to perform in combat? Certainly. But it is immense pressure to not let your team mates down none the less, and a invaluable lesson taught at the service Academies. While you may find his heartfelt emotions after such a letdown "pathetic", I for one think this individual will be a better leader because of how he felt after the game. He will strive to never let his team down agian, and this time the team will be every soldier he leads, and the nation.

 

[navygirl89]

honor-valor-fidelity.tumblr.com/post/37519577015/that-awkward-moment

I think his reaction was justifiable but CBS definitely made it worst because they were clearly looking to make the moment oh-so-dramatic.
Also, for Steelman, this is probably one of the most pressure he has ever been under considering he's never been out leading troops, so this is a big deal. He may look back on it and think the way he reacted was silly, but I don't think he'll be feeling that way anytime in the near future.


@navyasw02 thank you for all the sacrifices you've made and for being in service during a time of war. Were you the highest up in chain of command on a billion dollar submarine? I'm not saying that makes it any less impressive if you weren't or that it would be easy for you either way, or that a football game is a bigger deal than anything you did in your military career. I'm just wondering.

 

[usnabgo08]

I'd agree that it is pathetic to use any derogatory term to talk about any player at the Army-Navy game. No one steps onto that field (regardless of how the season has unfolded) without 100+% effort to try and defeat the other.

Sure, Trent and the other Class of 2013 players will look back at that game and think "just if..." However, I truly hope this is overcome by reflecting on the "positives" -- how they lead their team throughout the season and over the past four years. The margin of victory for Navy has shrunken over the past two years, which is a stride, in of itself.

Sure. Let's get real here. At 23, you were an Ensign most likley assigned to your first boat. Remember what they called those butter bars on your shoulders? They called them "$&@t-shields", and for good reason. Your superiors EXPECTED you to make mistakes, based on your lack of experience at your new job. You got away with those mistakes with a shrug from your supervisors saying "what do you expect? He's an Ensign".

@navyasw02 thank you for all the sacrifices you've made and for being in service during a time of war. Were you the highest up in chain of command on a billion dollar submarine? I'm not saying that makes it any less impressive if you weren't or that it would be easy for you either way, or that a football game is a bigger deal than anything you did in your military career. I'm just wondering.

I'm sure that the Officer of the Deck of USS PORTER, who collided with the vessel near the Strait of Hormuz was an ENS or LTJG. In either case, a very junior officer (likely between 22-24 years old), who had responsibility for the operation and safe navigation of that warship -- something I wouldn't label as a "minor mistake" -- given that many lives (and equipment) were at stake. Sure the Captain has the ultimate responsibility, however, if you can't tell from the news articles or photos, there is a great amount of responsibility placed in those around "23," who are on the bridge. Ultimately, THEY could have prevented an international incident -- talk about pressure and their career is likely over or degraded!

Again, football game and real military world aren't equivalent. The good news is Firstie Cadets/MIDN will "get over it" sooner-or-later, live their second and final semester, and then all move on to do what they ultimately showed up for on R/I-Day -- service to their country.

 

[navyasw02]

First off, I said it looked pathetic, not that the QB personally was pathetic. Second, based on reading your profile and navygirl89's profile, I'm not going to justify my comments to a few children who have never been in an actual leadership position. If you think butter bars are negligible, you've never driven a ship at night when you're the senior man awake and you've never led a platoon of marines into war. My classmates and I did that at 23, a few of us died or were severely injured in the process. Please dont tell me that regardless of the visibility of a game that it isnt just a game. The CNO/SECNAV/ all these high ups know that and understand that. So when you get done knowing everything at your ripe young age, then come back and talk to me about my comments. Until then, the blubbering was pathetic.

 

[haz]

you've never driven a ship at night when you're the senior man awake and you've never led a platoon of marines into war.

And I don't think you have ever been a QB for a Div I college football team playing on National TV. Unless you have been their i don't think you should be calling his reaction "pathetic"

 

[navygirl89]

First off, I said it looked pathetic, not that the QB personally was pathetic. Second, based on reading your profile and navygirl89's profile, I'm not going to justify my comments to a few children who have never been in an actual leadership position. If you think butter bars are negligible, you've never driven a ship at night when you're the senior man awake and you've never led a platoon of marines into war. My classmates and I did that at 23, a few of us died or were severely injured in the process. Please dont tell me that regardless of the visibility of a game that it isnt just a game. The CNO/SECNAV/ all these high ups know that and understand that. So when you get done knowing everything at your ripe young age, then come back and talk to me about my comments. Until then, the blubbering was pathetic.

LOL at how I asked you a legit question and you just said you wouldn't answer, because I was a pathetic child.

Oh well, I may be a pathetic, clueless child. But atleast my posts on here aren't borderline-moronic.

 

[Bullet]

First off, I said it looked pathetic, not that the QB personally was pathetic. Second, based on reading your profile and navygirl89's profile, I'm not going to justify my comments to a few children who have never been in an actual leadership position. If you think butter bars are negligible, you've never driven a ship at night when you're the senior man awake and you've never led a platoon of marines into war. My classmates and I did that at 23, a few of us died or were severely injured in the process. Please dont tell me that regardless of the visibility of a game that it isnt just a game. The CNO/SECNAV/ all these high ups know that and understand that. So when you get done knowing everything at your ripe young age, then come back and talk to me about my comments. Until then, the blubbering was pathetic.

Perhaps you read my profile a little wrong. Or perhaps you were too busy to do a simple search on this site about me. Go ahead, I'll wait...

Done? Good. Then perhaps you can now see that I do indeed have the "leadership experience" to discuss this with you. More likely MUCH more than your own.

I could spend a few minutes with you, someone I'm sure is junior in rank than me if your username is an indication of your graduation date, discussing the nuances and the differences between "responsibility" and "facing pressure not to let your fellow team mates down". I certainly understand both, do you?

But instead of that, I'll just say that the way you have judged this young man's reactions makes you come off as a little bit of jerk. Take that for what its worth from a senior officer.

 

[Hurricane12]

LOL at how I asked you a legit question and you just said you wouldn't answer, because I was a pathetic child.

Oh well, I may be a pathetic, clueless child. But atleast my posts on here aren't borderline-moronic.

Slow your roll, sparky.

No one's calling you a pathetic, clueless child. You don't know what you don't know and trying to punch above your weight class. Hit up the Google Machine (or that nifty search bar here) and go soak up some info.

And, yeah, FYI, a month after graduation some of my classmates were standing watches at night in the Persian Gulf and responsible for up to 40 Sailors in their division. By my guesstimate, others will be standing tall in front of Marine infantry platoons less than a year after graduation. Stuff gets real fast.

Some people like me stay in the training command cocoon for a long while (hopefully I'm a 1stLt when I get to the fleet...), but a lot of those guys both on the field and in the stands on Saturday don't have that much time before they hit the real world. Certainly much less than they realize now.


Also...

Can't we all just get along? This is silly and getting out of hand.

 

[Whistle Pig]

Agreed. This is definitely silly.

I agree, CBS wanted and got theatrics and drama.

The kid played well, re-committed the specific flaw he and his mates have failed at all year as viewers were reminded of such ... fumbles ... and consequently Army lost the football game.

There is no moral victory here for them. It's a football game. Both teams played hard, did well, with one winning, the other losing. Because it's Army-Navy and because of the tradition and lifelong consequences, the QB will never forget nor get over this. He WILL get beyond it though. And his life will go on. The better life-lessons are always learned in loss. Not the more pleasant ones.

Let's get real here.

 

[navyasw02]

My apologies, I may have misread your profile and cant see it at the moment on my iphone. However I stand by my comments. In a few months this young man will be lead soldiers probably into war. There's a lot of "**** screen" butter bars who have come before him and paid for mistakes in blood. Yes they're expected to make mistakes, but they have real consequences. Mess up a football game and your name gets written on a record book and not on a tombstone.

You're right, maybe I am a jerk, but at least I have a realistic perspective on what is important and what is required as a modern junior officer. If football was that important there would be a cabinet position overseeing it for our national security.

 

[navygirl89]

Slow your roll, sparky.

And, yeah, FYI, a month after graduation some of my classmates were standing watches at night in the Persian Gulf and responsible for up to 40 Sailors in their division. By my guesstimate, others will be standing tall in front of Marine infantry platoons less than a year after graduation. Stuff gets real fast.

Some people like me stay in the training command cocoon for a long while (hopefully I'm a 1stLt when I get to the fleet...), but a lot of those guys both on the field and in the stands on Saturday don't have that much time before they hit the real world. Certainly much less than they realize now.


Also...

Can't we all just get along? This is silly and getting out of hand.

I didn't pretend to know anything I don't know and I didn't really 'state' anything about anything regarding anyone's careers, I just asked. Because, you're right, I don't know but I don't think I know this stuff nor do I try to act like I do.
And I already spend a bit too much time on here and Google

Thanks for answering my question though