Graduation program
- Thread starter cajost
- Start date
This conversation is almost about the opposite of what happened at our end. DD (USNA 2017) was approached by her school's Administration and asked if she would let her BGO and a local USNA grad (Class of '93, now on the faculty at USNA) present her appointment folder at the senior awards ceremony. She thanked them and said yes. At the ceremony, before the BGO spoke, the school administrators referred during their laudatory comments to DD's "full scholarship" to the Academy.
After the ceremony, those that "got it" just gushed with congratulations for DD. Others, however, made comments akin to: "Wait, so you get the whole four years for FREE?" In response to the latter, DD smiled politely and said: "Well, sort of. I will be commissioned as an officer in the Navy or Marines for a minimum of five years, possibly deployed into combat, and that could result in a cost. I am looking forward to serving my Country."
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After the ceremony, those that "got it" just gushed with congratulations for DD. Others, however, made comments akin to: "Wait, so you get the whole four years for FREE?" In response to the latter, DD smiled politely and said: "Well, sort of. I will be commissioned as an officer in the Navy or Marines for a minimum of five years, possibly deployed into combat, and that could result in a cost. I am looking forward to serving my Country."
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She has her eyebrow-raising moments but, yes, she generally does when it matters most. Thanks.
Back to the original question, the fact the 'everyone' who gets an appointment has their tuition paid really has no bearing on whether or not you would consider it a scholarship. Thousands who applied were all competing for an appointment and everyone applying does NOT get accepted. While the IRS may not technically consider it a 'scholarship', the reality is that those who get apppointments will not have to pay any tuition during those 4 yrs and will graduate from a fully accredited college with a degree.
Some h.s. prefer to recognize students during an awards ceremony prior to graduation. Some schools/cities, etc. have an anti-military view on things and won't recogize students appointed to service academies. While you can't change the world, people who DO understand what an appointment means will certainly look highly upon such a commitment.
Some h.s. prefer to recognize students during an awards ceremony prior to graduation. Some schools/cities, etc. have an anti-military view on things and won't recogize students appointed to service academies. While you can't change the world, people who DO understand what an appointment means will certainly look highly upon such a commitment.
cajost, sorry to hear of the situation. My high school didn't even put me as going to college when I graduated, but enlisting. I could of cared less. I was a recruited athlete in one of the big sports so my BGO wasn't allowed to have contact with me, so there was no formal presentation or anything. To be honest... I could of cared less. Yes, USNA loses out on a great opportunity to tout about the school and tell the world how awesome your DD is.
Couple of things to consider also... As most grads will say... getting in was the easy part. It is a long, hard process to stay. My class started with over 1200 and graduated just over 900. That means 1 in 4 quit or was asked to leave. Not having the huge pomp and circumstance can sometimes take a little pressure off in some ways. I know that might not make sense, but I can't tell you how many kids when they quit say they were letting down the entire town or they were the pride and joy of their entire town. We had a kid jump out a window instead of resign Plebe Summer. His reason was he couldn't quit because it was such a big deal in his town that he was at USNA. Over the next 4 years you will have to explain what USNA is to alot of people and once she graduates you and her will have to explain her service to many. When I say explain it generally means justify. You will hear more strange things, assumptions and opinions over the next 9 years than you knew possible. Some of the stuff I heard just made me laugh. I actually think we had some threads last year talking about some of the things we have heard.
Couple of things to consider also... As most grads will say... getting in was the easy part. It is a long, hard process to stay. My class started with over 1200 and graduated just over 900. That means 1 in 4 quit or was asked to leave. Not having the huge pomp and circumstance can sometimes take a little pressure off in some ways. I know that might not make sense, but I can't tell you how many kids when they quit say they were letting down the entire town or they were the pride and joy of their entire town. We had a kid jump out a window instead of resign Plebe Summer. His reason was he couldn't quit because it was such a big deal in his town that he was at USNA. Over the next 4 years you will have to explain what USNA is to alot of people and once she graduates you and her will have to explain her service to many. When I say explain it generally means justify. You will hear more strange things, assumptions and opinions over the next 9 years than you knew possible. Some of the stuff I heard just made me laugh. I actually think we had some threads last year talking about some of the things we have heard.
payitforward
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Very good point.
VERY good point, and I had subcontiously thought this. Her HS is a private, all-girls catholic school that has really high academic standards. We are catholic, but the cirriculum was the "real" reason I spent upwards of $50k for her HS education. Victoria has pretty much always had the where with all to know HS was her means of getting to her goal (she's wanted USNA since she was in 4th grade - looked it up on the internet and declared this to everyone.) My point? She is just like you were/are. She could care less.
Therefore, I'm like the song "Let it go, let it go!"
(I'm a comic in the making!)What got my blood a bit hot was that (as I've mentioned) she has regional regatta the weekend of graduation. I've paid $150 for graduation which includes 7 tickets. I told Victoria - sell them. The Assistant Princple found out and had a fit. To Victoria's credit (and good practice for the future) she just said "Yes, ma'm" and carried on. Really?
I'm at the point of - "Let's just get through this and be done."
Ironically, these girls schools complain that they don't have contributions from their alumni like the boys schools. (I guess this could be a whole separate post...)
66 days...
Memphis9489
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It's amazing how even parents are reluctant to acknowledge that their midshipman has a scholarship at the Naval Academy. They always seem to want to say, "They are paying by serving in the military." That's true. But that does not make it any less of a scholarship. In fact, it's more than a scholarship! They're getting paid to go to school with guaranteed employment to follow. What school offers that?
It's a scholarship! Even the Naval Academy calls it a scholarship. They use that exact word.
Go to their website and you will see the following:
It's a scholarship! Even the Naval Academy calls it a scholarship. They use that exact word.
Go to their website and you will see the following:
Tuition
There is no tuition at the Naval Academy. The Navy pays 100% of the tuition, room and board, medical and dental care costs of Naval Academy midshipmen. This means ALL students who attend the Naval Academy do so on a full scholarship in return for 5 years of active duty service upon graduation. Additionally, you also enjoy regular active-duty benefits including access to military commissaries and exchanges, commercial transportation and lodging discounts and the ability to fly space-available in military aircraft around the world. Midshipmen pay is $929.40 monthly, from which laundry, barber, cobbler, activities fees, yearbook and other service charges are deducted. Actual cash pay is $100 per month your first year, which increases each year thereafter.
There is no tuition at the Naval Academy. The Navy pays 100% of the tuition, room and board, medical and dental care costs of Naval Academy midshipmen. This means ALL students who attend the Naval Academy do so on a full scholarship in return for 5 years of active duty service upon graduation. Additionally, you also enjoy regular active-duty benefits including access to military commissaries and exchanges, commercial transportation and lodging discounts and the ability to fly space-available in military aircraft around the world. Midshipmen pay is $929.40 monthly, from which laundry, barber, cobbler, activities fees, yearbook and other service charges are deducted. Actual cash pay is $100 per month your first year, which increases each year thereafter.
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Good point. Even athletic scholarships at a civilian institution are not free. They have a job to perform, playing their particular sport to the best of their ability. But I don't see anyone saying those are not scholarships.
Memphis9489
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Why is it that nobody seems to have a problem with the term "NROTC scholarship"? That term is used all the time. The NROTC students are getting scholarships but not the midshipmen at the Naval Academy?
It's all very ridiculous!
Of course it's a scholarship!
It's all very ridiculous!
Of course it's a scholarship!
nothingventurednothinggai
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From IRS form 970
"Payment to Service Academy Cadets
An appointment to a United States military academy is not a scholarship or fellowship. Payment you receive as a cadet or midshipman at an armed services academy is pay for personal services and will be reported to you in box 1 of Form W-2. Include this pay in your income in the year you receive it unless one of the exceptions, discussed earlier under Payment for services , applies."
But here is some pretty interesting 'good news'. The value of the 'non' scholarship actually counts as non taxable earned income of $50-$70k a year. That emancipates the Cadet/Mid and avoids any issues with 'kiddy' tax for high tax bracket parents. Since their taxable income is about $6 an hour, that makes them working poor. That puts them in a zero percent tax for capital gains and such up to a fairly healthy amount.
So what this means is that gains on a distributed College Savings plan are likely going to be taxed at a zero rate (and the 10% penalty is waived for SA students).
It also means that if Grandma has some low basis stock she was going to sell to help with college, she might give it to the student instead, who pays no tax up to like $37k a year. Its a twist of the recent tax code changes that is great for SA students. I had read about all the complaining for a 'Buffett Tax' and its 'not fair' that the working poor have to pay anything on investments.....voila, they don't anymore. Its a nice perk for SA students if they can use it.
"Payment to Service Academy Cadets
An appointment to a United States military academy is not a scholarship or fellowship. Payment you receive as a cadet or midshipman at an armed services academy is pay for personal services and will be reported to you in box 1 of Form W-2. Include this pay in your income in the year you receive it unless one of the exceptions, discussed earlier under Payment for services , applies."
But here is some pretty interesting 'good news'. The value of the 'non' scholarship actually counts as non taxable earned income of $50-$70k a year. That emancipates the Cadet/Mid and avoids any issues with 'kiddy' tax for high tax bracket parents. Since their taxable income is about $6 an hour, that makes them working poor. That puts them in a zero percent tax for capital gains and such up to a fairly healthy amount.
So what this means is that gains on a distributed College Savings plan are likely going to be taxed at a zero rate (and the 10% penalty is waived for SA students).
It also means that if Grandma has some low basis stock she was going to sell to help with college, she might give it to the student instead, who pays no tax up to like $37k a year. Its a twist of the recent tax code changes that is great for SA students. I had read about all the complaining for a 'Buffett Tax' and its 'not fair' that the working poor have to pay anything on investments.....voila, they don't anymore. Its a nice perk for SA students if they can use it.
For what it's worth, her BGO presented my daughter with her appointment at senior awards night and talked about the road traveled to get the appointment, the VALUE of the education AND TRAINING that she would receive (I think it was around $300,000), that she would get a modest salary, and that she was committing herself to five years of service to her country by accepting the appointment. Nothing in the graduation program about her appointment, but there was a nice article in the local newspaper.
Well, the President of the school called me and we had an opportunity to talk about all this "stuff."
He raved about Victoria and blamed advertising budget for the lack of awareness. (I don't see where it would cost a thing and I'm the recruiter for a VA with a HUGE advertising budget to recruit docs and RN's.)
At any rate, it was a nice conversation and I am now officially done with dealing with this.
He raved about Victoria and blamed advertising budget for the lack of awareness. (I don't see where it would cost a thing and I'm the recruiter for a VA with a HUGE advertising budget to recruit docs and RN's.)
At any rate, it was a nice conversation and I am now officially done with dealing with this.
Memphis9489
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For tax purposes, it may not technically qualify as a scholarship because the "student" is a service member on ACTIVE duty who is earning a salary.
Yet, from an academic viewpoint, it most certainly is a scholarship and should be recognized as such during high school award/recognition functions.