Honor

Discussion in 'ROTC' started by LineInTheSand, Dec 5, 2007.

  1. LineInTheSand

    LineInTheSand USCGA 2006

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    Recently there seems to be a little confusion about the concept of "honor", especially as it applies to the US Military, ROTC and Service Academies.


    First, as you will hear the most basic recruit at any training center spew, Honor is the only thing that cannot be taken from you. You have to give it away.

    This is true. You hold your own honor. At CGA the saying was, "Who Lives Here Reveres Honor, Honors Duty. We neither lie, cheat, steal nor attempt to deceive."

    The Coast Guard Academy does not have an "Honor Code" but an "Honor Concept", meaning if someone commits an honor offense and you know about it but don't report it, you yourself are not committing an honor offense, but a conduct offense.

    Now, Lying, cheating and stealing are pretty cut and dry, we know what that means. It is the fourth concept, having read some of the conversations specifically on this base thread, that I want to hit. In this, you have to read into the "spirit" of the concept. Attempting to deceive; it's finding that gray area and trying to exploit it. Some may call it using strategy. Attempting to deceive will work on Survivor but in the military it is a danagerous game to play. In the future, as an officer, you tell half-truths to "cover up" something you may not be proud of, or a stance on an issue that may not be popular, it will come back to bite you. I've seen enough cadets walk out the door because they thought their little trick would benefit them. Their inability to uphold their honor led them to disenrollment (which does not look good on a transcript to another college).

    If the hairs on your neck stand up and you're stumbling over your words because you're not sure if what you're saying will "work" with that person, it may be a clear indication an alternate method should be sought.

    I use the Coast Guard Academy example, because that is what I am familiar with, however, I will say that the commissioning sources are only the first step. They harp on honor, not because it is important only at the academy or college ROTC program you are attending, but instead because of what will be asked of you after you walk across that stage and pin on those butter bars. Honor is important then because you have men and women's lives riding on the fact that you may need to make the right decision for them.

    Maintaining your honor is not important because it gives you a nice warm and fuzzy, but because you will be serving your country, and it is your responsibility, having been entrusted by them (and their tax dollars), to carry out your duty in an honorable way. It is the utmost importance to maintain this trust between the people of the United States and those who have elected to defend it.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2007
  2. Exar Ganis

    Exar Ganis Member

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    *Claps* Well done Sands. I thought that was well written.
     
  3. LineInTheSand

    LineInTheSand USCGA 2006

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    When you're still in high school without an acceptance to a college, I'm sure a lot of things look "well written".


    I'm not surprised that you were probably looking for spelling errors, rather than the content of the post.


    Do yourself and everyone else a favor, stop coming in here. You have a father with an understanding of the "inner workings" of the military. Surely someone whose only claim to fame with respect to Service Academies is being rejected from one will have more incite than the parents of current cadets/midshipman and the alumni of each of the five service academies.
     
  4. RetNavyHM

    RetNavyHM USN (RET)

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    I normally do not interject outside of the DoDMERB realm, but I have to step up on my soapbox, so give me a few moments of your time.

    We all need to honor those around us, even if we do not agree with their motivations, actions or attitudes. We do not tell others not to come around. If we do not agree with what they have stated, we say so and leave it at that. If we were able to go around and remove everyone who we do not agree with then life would be pretty dull.

    Everyone on this forum has attempted to make this a place of learning, and not a place of contention. It is an open forum and everyone is entitled to their opinion. Please take a second before hitting the "Submit Reply" button to make sure what you have written is something you want to have in the public forever.

    I'm stepping off my soapbox for now. Have a great Navy, Air Force, Army, Coast Guard, Merchant Marine day!!
     
  5. Exar Ganis

    Exar Ganis Member

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    Sands, remember this:

    EG = 800 Writing SAT + 5 on the AP English Lang. & Comp Exam
     
  6. LineInTheSand

    LineInTheSand USCGA 2006

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    This begs the question...why has USNA69 been banned, why was a thread locked, and why have parts of people's posts been edited to be "more agreeable?"



    I'm sure you're very familiar with the concept that an organization with spend 99% of it's time on 1% of the people because those people are constantly problems. It's that Seaman who keeps getting in fights and shows up late to work. While you're councelling him, how many people are missing out on more meaningful advice?

    I respectfully disagree, at some point you need to say "move on" especially if every indication is given that it might not be the best thing for those currently serving to deal with the consequences of someone's actions.
     
  7. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    Wait...wait....wait....USNA69 was banned? I know of the thread, but how did USNA69 get banned, he didn't swear!
     
  8. LineInTheSand

    LineInTheSand USCGA 2006

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    Yeah, I have no idea why...he was right on as far as I could tell.
     
  9. kgrmom

    kgrmom Member

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    I happened upon that (USNA69- banned) yesterday and was surprised. He has been helpful to me- I was wondering what happened also.

    On the "other" issue in this forum I am astounding by the audacity of this kid.

    "Sands, remember this: EG = 800 Writing SAT + 5 on the AP English Lang. & Comp Exam"-

    With a comment like this- I'm even wondering that you find yourself in need of attending college at all. Your propensity to manipulate, "bend", lie and de- value those with experience are the qualities that give people a mistrust of the government and military today. And worse- you find a way to laugh it off each time as if it is of no consequence. :mad:
     
  10. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    Maybe he wasn't banned, and just went on a vacation?
     
  11. mom3boys

    mom3boys Parent

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    no

    No, he's banned....I looked in my PM box to send him a quick note, and he's in red and it says, "banned." The rest of us are on thin ice, I guess! Mea culpa to those I have offended w/ my rant to EG....sometimes a mom has to do what a mom has to do.
     
  12. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    Go to off topic,

    I started a thread and zap answered. I suggest everyone read it.
     
  13. Zaphod

    Zaphod Founding Member

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    No one is on thin ice. The situation is very complex and is being worked out. Let's not compound the situation with rumors and innuendo.
     
  14. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    Zap,

    I hope you are not working today, because I think you'll have to be running around and answering posts LOL:shake:

    Maybe you could send us your address so we can send you a holiday gift for all your work
     
  15. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    Line,

    I actually think it is good that potential cadets see the lieing thread. It shows them and others the moral fortitude it takes to be an officer. It also illustrates that we do live at a higher code and will not accept it
     
  16. raimius

    raimius USAFA Alumnus

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    We should not be telling people to leave, unless they are asking for a ban or trying to sabotage a discussion.

    Is forcing someone to leave because they "don't get it" going to help them? Us? Others? I don't believe it would.
     
  17. momoftwins

    momoftwins Founding Member

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    So, it appears that usna69 has been unbanned and that he prefers not to return. I'm very disappointed as he has valuable information for the applicants here.

    Here's hoping he reconsiders. A lot of kids will benefit from his advice.
     
  18. momoftwins

    momoftwins Founding Member

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    Line in the Sand,

    I love your post about Honor. It's actually a concept that should guide everyone - not just military - and is a topic worthy of continued discussion.
     
  19. csBlaZe

    csBlaZe Member

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    Hey Line, great post!

    Its great that we have officers and enlisted we can count on. In my CAP squadron we talk about honor alot, becuase its pretty much one of the most important concepts we, the military, or anyone should have an understanding of and apply.
     

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