How come we wait to get weapon's qualified?

Discussion in 'Coast Guard Academy - USCGA' started by SamAca10, Dec 4, 2011.

  1. SamAca10

    SamAca10 Ensign - DWO

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    Does anyone know why we wait until 2/c summer to do range qualifications instead of doing it during swab summer?
     
  2. USCGA13STN

    USCGA13STN Member

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    Yeah, there isn't enough time to get you qualified during Swab Summer, it takes at least two full days to get the basic safety qual and to do the firearms training, and we don't have the extra two days in the schedule to get Swabs in there. In addition they have to bring in GMs from outside the Academy to help teach, and to keep them here that long would be a little crazy.
     
  3. RevenueCutterService

    RevenueCutterService Revenue Cutter Academy

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    Also, would you trust a swab with a SIG?
     
  4. SamAca10

    SamAca10 Ensign - DWO

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    They do weapons training, or at least familiarization, in regular boot camp, don't they? And the other academies have weapon's familiarization during their BCT/CBT/Plebe Summer. So yes, I think a swab could do okay with a SIG if trained properly.
     
  5. LineInTheSand

    LineInTheSand USCGA 2006

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    TRACEN Cape May has changed its firearms training in the past few years. There's no reason to train a swab how to use a fire arm. There's also no reason for USMA, USNA, USAFA, or USMMA to do it during that summer. Too much to do, too little time. Swabs should use the little time they have (let's not forget a week of EAGLE is thrown in) to learn how to be cadets. Not how to shoot a weapon considering 1/3 of them won't graduate.
     
  6. Casey

    Casey USMA 2015

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    LITS, I would would strongly disagree that training on basic proficiency with firearms at USMA over Beast is not necessary. We spent a good week or so during the second half of our summer becoming proficient with the M4 as well as gaining exposure to some other kinds of weaponary.

    Where I could agree that maybe you would not necessarily need the training is when you teach a new cadet how to use a M240 but that's because the great majority will never fire it after that day.

    The M4 though? West Point's summer training the first two summers is heavily grounded in infantry tactics considering that the infantry is the boots of our Army. How can you understand the "why" behind half of the things we're in the process of being taught, if you have no clue how to handle the basic primary weapon your soldiers will have? Setting up patrol bases and camping out pulling security would've been even more ridiculous if we had rubber duckies. If anything, I know that there are many people who are more interested in continued familiarization with the M4 during the actual school year so as to decrease drop off in forgetting things when handling it between summers. It would take more time away from CFT if you had to train yearlings how to handle their M4 from scratch when the point of CFT is to build on the knowledge from Beast and actually get into the tactics and procedures the Army uses, heavily biased towards infantry of course.

    Besides, there is a certain expectation that you will be mature obviously in how you handle yourself with the weapon. If you don't the actual NCO's watching, as well as the cadet NCO's, will quickly correct you. Definitly seen that happen. The guy was scared to death by the reaction and he definitly learned not to do it again. It also teaches you responsibility and accountability. New cadets are only responsible for themselves and their rifles. If you manage to lose an inanimate object that's attached to you have the time, we have issues and that's unacceptable.
     
  7. TwinsDad

    TwinsDad Member

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    Weapons training is available for fourth class cadets USCGA

    Incoming fourth class cadets at the Coast Guard Academy can join the pistol or rifle team during their freshman year. The team competes with other academies and colleges and nationally.

    My son applied for and was accepted on the combat arms team. The team is small (I believe less than 20 members) and competes with other academies, more enforcement personnel and private individuals. The competitions usually consist of a series of obstacle courses where the contestant must shoot the terrorist, but not shoot the targets depicting the public. They shoot from various positions both during daylight and at times in darkness by flashlight. The team accepts approximately 4 new members each year mostly but not exclusively freshman.

    The team is highly respected for their professionalism. My son who is now in his first class year began his training on a 9 mm Beretta and also qualified on the M-16 rifle and on shotgun. No prior gun experience is required prior to joining the team but new team members are evaluated and selected for their aptitude. Safety is their highest priority. They also received training as a range safety officer. Team members compete as individuals. By the end of my sons third class year he was qualified on pistol, rifle and shotgun and had made expert on pistol and rifle. Most of the competitions involve 9 mm pistols.

    If anyone is interested in getting involved with small arms training earlier than their second-class year, the opportunity certainly exist at the USCGA.
     
  8. Luigi59

    Luigi59 Banned

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    Which seems odd, as the standard USCG sidearm is the Sig P229R-DAK in .40 S&W caliber, and is also the weapon used to qualify for their pistol marksmanship ribbon.
     
  9. Packer

    Packer Member

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    If this number is real, can you tell us how it is calculated as it is significantly different than the graduation rate that USCGA admissions is stating?
     
  10. Luigi59

    Luigi59 Banned

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    It's not quite as grim as LITS states.

    Class of 2009 = 307 entered, 225 graduated (73%)
    Class of 2010 = 274 entered, 196 graduated (72%)
    Class of 2011 = 272 entered, 224 graduated (82%)

    Class of 2012 = 292 entered, I believe the 1/c strength is currently around 220 (75%).

    :cool:
     
  11. Objee

    Objee USCGA Admissions

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    It's not real...I think LITS was just making the point that everyone here for Swab Summer won't be here for graduation, but most who are around for 2/c Summer Training are. The Class of 2011's graduate rate was 82% and the Academy's goal is 80% for future classes. Even his class graduated 72% so not sure where his "1/3 of them" data comes from since I believe our graduation rate hasn't been below 70% since the late 90's.
     
  12. TwinsDad

    TwinsDad Member

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    Reply

    in the fall of 2008 the Coast Guard Academy combat arms team were using 9 mm Beretta's. Approximately a year ago they switched to sig. P229 .40's to clarify the situation.

    The point of my post was that weapons training was available for those who wanted it at the Coast Guard Academy even in the freshman year and was not going to be a discussion into the history of which guns were used when.
     

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