I think I don't stand a chance anymore...

[kinnem]

Thanks. I appreciate that you are trying to help me, but I still feel like the best I could do is bring my grade up to a D, and then I think that that wouldn't be good enough for anything. I don't do a very good job of being optimistic, but I try to be realistic. It's hard to give 110% when you feel like you've already lost the battle. Anything I do, I feel I'm doing in vain. I was also too stubborn to take regular instead of honors. I regret that the most.

I agree with Pima's post above. Seems to me you can go out in a blaze of glory fighting the forlorn battle (and maybe even pull through. Whether you pull though or not you gave it your all). Or, you can go out with a whimper as you seem wont to do. Which guy would you rather follow into battle?

 

[ESLGuy]

I only skimmed, but I have to say in my mind lots of red flags went up.


Um...great, but here are my red flags.

Are you applying for Purdue?
Are you competitive for admissions?
How many wanted rated...if 1 didn't get it, and 3 applied, you have a 66% shot...let's not even go into the fact that UPT does not wing 100%. Not by a long shot
How many dis-enrolled?
Nobody can predict 6 yrs from now regarding manpower needs.

You need to ask yourself would you be happy being a maintenance officer in the Navy. I get it, you have a dream, our DS did too, but we drilled in his head, he will serve at the luxury of the AF.

I am not applying to Purdue, I just used it as an example. If I was assigned to Maintenence, I would deal with it it. I understand I might not get a pilot slot, and if I don't I will serve the country in a different way.

This is another red flag. You had a B, but failed the final. To me as a teacher it means the foundation was not built. You failed because academically somewhere it didn't click/absorb.

I agree. But I have struggled with math since I was young. To me it has just always been the hardest subject.

Not following, unless you are hoping this teacher will take you to a D.

Clarification needed

Yes. Even though the teacher does not seem friendly, and I barely believed it at first, it gives me a little hope.

now the next post said


What is it...miss practices and kicked off or not. Can't miss practices, but you miss 2X a week.

I will miss 1x a week and come an hour late 1x a week. The coaches are okay with that.

Is Lithuanian school due to heritage, or is it like aviation club...a choice.

My parents make me attend, because they want me not to forgot how to speak, read and write Lithuanian. It is the same as Polish/Russian/Ukranian school.

Do you see your posts are contradictory?

I am sorry, but you say one thing in a post, and another in the next.

Heartless teacher, but has been known to raise grades up.

Maybe she has a soft side? Or so I've heard.

I am not trying to be harsh, I am trying to illustrate when it comes down to your interviews, be it MOCs or CoCs, they may ask why 2+2 in your defense is not equaling 4.

It is something you need to think about.

Also, the idea of saying I always wanted to be a Navy pilot! The Navy wants officers, not just pilots. You know what they call an O1 or even an O10 pilot? It is not Pilot Smith, it is Ensign or Admiral Smith.

Officer first, pilot second. I'm aware of that, but the only way to achieve my dream is through the military. For me, getting to defend the country and live my dream is as good as it can get.

Final red flag


Sorry, but I think you need to hear harsh truths now. As an F15E WSO wife of 20 yrs AD, and as an AFROTC 2012 grad Mom at UPT now. If you find it hard in HS to give 110% when you feel you already lost the battle, I am not sure the military is a good fit for you.

It is rarer than rare that anyone will crow for you or pat you on the back. In the AF flying world they are known to eat their young. I assume the same is true for Navy.

The it's hard to give 110% when you feel like you've already lost the battle comment scares the beegeegees out of me. You are going to defend this country.

I get it you are 15/16, but if you really want to be competitive IMPHO, accept responsibility now for your actions.

If you want us to sugar coat or coddle, we can do that too. It is up to you now to direct us on what you want.

Again, I know this post comes off harsh, and I apologize for that, but IMPO if we aren't honest with you now, we do greater harm later on.

I think you have a great shot commissioning, keep moving forward.

I don't mean that I've stopped trying, or that I won't try, because I do, and after finals I will have an A in every class except math. I just mean that I always feel sad or depressed, not that it affects my grades.

Also, in my opinion, saying that I have a great shot commissioning is like saying I have a great shot getting into college. Sure, I might get commissioned, but not from the Naval Academy. I might get into college, but not -insert highly selective college here-. I feel like getting a silver medal is like being the first loser, not the one in second place. All my life I've felt that I haven't been good enough to achieve anything I wanted to. I know if I don't apply, I won't get in. However, when I hear of people with perfect GPAs and varsity sports apply to service academies it makes me think that I would only be wasting my time applying. Even if I did good for the rest of HS.

 

[ESLGuy]

I agree with Pima's post above. Seems to me you can go out in a blaze of glory fighting the forlorn battle (and maybe even pull through. Whether you pull though or not you gave it your all). Or, you can go out with a whimper as you seem wont to do. Which guy would you rather follow into battle?

But, if you give something your best, and don't succeed, then how can you be proud of doing your best if it wasn't good enough?

 

[Pima]

Because you gave 110%. OBTW not good enough to whom?

If anyone here can make you throw in the towel, than there is your true answer. You never wanted it bad enough. Nobody who wants it so bad will listen to any naysayer. They will be motivated to prove them wrong, just to shove it in their face and say time to eat crow.

Your choice. Do we eat crow, or do you pick up your jax and walk away.

Truly it is your choice.

 

[kinnem]

But, if you give something your best, and don't succeed, then how can you be proud of doing your best if it wasn't good enough?

So whoever graduates at the top of their class from USNA or USMA (or anywhere else) is the winner and the rest are losers? You don't believe that, and rightly so.

Let's try another example. How about those 300 Spartans at Thermopylae? Did they do their very best? You bet. Did they win? Hell no! Did they know they would lose? Yup. So why didn't they just give up and surrender since it was a lost cause? And why are we making movies about them 2,500 years later? Because they were losers? I don't think so. They were winners even in defeat. Wake up man!

 

[Pima]

Matas,

Let's leave the swim practices alone, because let's be honest you said miss a practice and cut.

What I found interesting in your reply was this:

My parents make me attend, because they want me not to forgot how to speak, read and write Lithuanian. It is the same as Polish/Russian/Ukranian school.

So in other words they are making you attend knowing you are failing Geometry? On top of that they drive you to swim practice too, instead of forcing you to drop it so you can pass Geometry.

I am a Mom. 2+2 doesn't equal 4.

Going to take a shot in the dark here,but I am guessing your folks speak Lithuanian. I am also guessing you hid this failing grade from them like 96% of every teenager.

If not are you stating your folks placed Lithuanian school and swim team above academics for hs graduation?

That is what you are implying in my mind. Were they aware of you failing and as you stated made you attend after school Lithuanian schools to learn how to read,write and speak?

I am honestly not trying to be cruel or mean.

I am 3rd gen. Polish. Mom's parents were 1st gen. Grandma died at 101 yrs old, and when she died she could only say confession in Polish...forgive me father. She could also only do her rosary in Polish. My mom spoke to her in Polish in their home. My chiccas (aunts) lived on the same block. Chicca Annis, Chicca Mary, Chicca Florence. So yes I get it.

HOWEVER, her parents wanted her to be a part of the US too. They would have gone insane if she failed any class. It would not be acceptable.

I feel as if there is a deeper issue at hand. I take you at your word regarding career fields. I just wonder as a 2nd gen. that this maybe more about finances.

FYI there are great unique scholarships, and I think if you investigate you will see you are a great candidate.

 

[ESLGuy]

Matas,

Let's leave the swim practices alone, because let's be honest you said miss a practice and cut.

What I found interesting in your reply was this:


So in other words they are making you attend knowing you are failing Geometry? On top of that they drive you to swim practice too, instead of forcing you to drop it so you can pass Geometry.

I am a Mom. 2+2 doesn't equal 4.

Going to take a shot in the dark here,but I am guessing your folks speak Lithuanian. I am also guessing you hid this failing grade from them like 96% of every teenager.

If not are you stating your folks placed Lithuanian school and swim team above academics for hs graduation?

That is what you are implying in my mind. Were they aware of you failing and as you stated made you attend after school Lithuanian schools to learn how to read,write and speak?

I am honestly not trying to be cruel or mean.

I am 3rd gen. Polish. Mom's parents were 1st gen. Grandma died at 101 yrs old, and when she died she could only say confession in Polish...forgive me father. She could also only do her rosary in Polish. My mom spoke to her in Polish in their home. My chiccas (aunts) lived on the same block. Chicca Annis, Chicca Mary, Chicca Florence. So yes I get it.

HOWEVER, her parents wanted her to be a part of the US too. They would have gone insane if she failed any class. It would not be acceptable.

I feel as if there is a deeper issue at hand. I take you at your word regarding career fields. I just wonder as a 2nd gen. that this maybe more about finances.

FYI there are great unique scholarships, and I think if you investigate you will see you are a great candidate.

My parents are aware of my grade, I don't hide it from them. That's why my stepmom is getting me a tutor. My dad places sports above everything, but Lithuanian school above swim practice. They were both born in Soviet Lithuania, and I'm the first generation to be born in the U.S. I don't think they understand what it takes to get into a SA or prep school. My dad especially doesn't understand the American grading system, but my stepmom has a slight understanding of it. (She is also Lithuanian).

I am kind of offended that you assumed I hid that from my parents, but since you only know what I'm like online I understand.

@everyone else about winning/losing: if you aim for something and don't achieve it, then you have failed. Soldiers fight when facing defeat, because they are fighting for a cause. Even if they die, they can still succeed if they achieve their goal, such as slowing down the enemy. I'm not sure what the goal of the 300 Spartans was, but they probably achieved it even though they died.

 

[kinnem]

@everyone else about winning/losing: if you aim for something and don't achieve it, then you have failed. Soldiers fight when facing defeat, because they are fighting for a cause. Even if they die, they can still succeed if they achieve their goal, such as slowing down the enemy. I'm not sure what the goal of the 300 Spartans was, but they probably achieved it even though they died.

OK. Well let me know how the wallowing in self-pity and the "I'm already defeated" attitude works out for you in life. I look forward to hearing about it, but I expect it will simply become a self-fulfilling prophecy.
I do hope you get the satisfaction of proving me wrong, not that what I think matters one bit. Good Luck.

 

[bfrat93]

I don't mean that I've stopped trying, or that I won't try, because I do, and after finals I will have an A in every class except math. I just mean that I always feel sad or depressed, not that it affects my grades.

Also, in my opinion, saying that I have a great shot commissioning is like saying I have a great shot getting into college. Sure, I might get commissioned, but not from the Naval Academy. I might get into college, but not -insert highly selective college here-. I feel like getting a silver medal is like being the first loser, not the one in second place. All my life I've felt that I haven't been good enough to achieve anything I wanted to. I know if I don't apply, I won't get in. However, when I hear of people with perfect GPAs and varsity sports apply to service academies it makes me think that I would only be wasting my time applying. Even if I did good for the rest of HS.

Dude, I can tell you that my sophomore year in high school was brutal. I struggled a lot in Honors Chem. and almost got a D in it. I had a similar experience in Honors Trig my Junior year. And now I am on a 4-year AROTC scholarship at Penn State (a very competitive school to get a scholarship in). I also had similar feelings. I was very doubtful of my performance and chances and I almost gave.

I too wanted to go to the Naval Academy and was a candidate last year. As you can figure out, I did not get in. However, I have one question to ask you; do you want to be an officer in the United States Military or a graduate from Annapolis? The academies are amazing institutes but if the education and glory of going there is your motivation; don't do it because you will serve as an officer whether you like it or not (not to mention over 350,000 tax payer dollars are invested into you that could have gone to someone who wanted to commit their life to the service). If you legitimately want to serve as an officer then it does not matter where you get those gold bars from. When I was conflicted about not getting into the Academy my JROTC instructor told me how his best CO's where not from the Naval Academy (not at all saying that there are no amazing officers from the Service Academies, I have a huge amount of respect for them). At our Dinning In event this month, our honorable guest was a Colonel who graduated from West Point and served as AROTC's CO of 2nd Brigade (in other words he got to see cadets at work from ROTC and an academy). He said that the most dedicated ROTC cadets are "Just as good and, if not, better than West Point cadets." I even had the opportunity to speak to a retired Rear Admiral who went to the Naval Academy. He said if he could do it all over again, he would have done ROTC. If you want to be an officer (especially with the budget cuts going into effect) you need to cultivate all options maybe even other branches. I originally wanted Naval Academy, I am now in Army ROTC because the ulitmate goal was to become an officer and that was the opportunity that opened not to mention I am very happy with that choice.

Here is one other piece of advice. If I were to say why I got an ROTC scholarship, it would be because I sold myself. Even though I had a few mediocre grades and not allot of athletics, I pointed out everything good I do and did in my resume and interviews. I sincerely spoke about how I wanted to be an officer and that the money did not matter to me. I showed how I learned from mistakes and how I improved. If this is what you want, you need to lick your wounds, learn from the experience, improve, and show it to the powers that be. Not to mention you need to want this, it must be YOUR dream. If you do that; someone will notice it. They will see how much you are dedicated and even if you don't go to the Naval Academy or West Point or Air force Academy; you may get the next best thing. For now, rethink your priorities, make adjustments, and do anything and everything possible to improve; the rest will work itself out. It did for me.

 

[Lawman32RPD]

With respect to the idea of tutors, I would offer this observation. You need to work with your current teacher; ask for recommendations and ideas. Explain what you want to achieve and ask for direction. No advice works 100% of the time but that would be my suggestion about where to begin. Our son is a junior in high school and struggling with trigonometry. We live close to a small college and I contacted the chair of the math department and asked if that individual had any recommendations or suggestions about students who might consider tutoring. He provided three names of math education majors and we were able to make an arrangement with one of those individuals. The student tutor gets to make some extra money and given that she wants to be a math teacher, gets some additional real world experience. Our son is benefiting from some additional one on one instruction once a week, in addition to going in to see his trig teacher 3 + mornings a week. Given that I have a hard time adding two and two on calculator and getting the right answer I wasn't able to provide any additional parental guidance or assistance vis-a-vis the trig thing. Anyway, if you live near a college or community college that might be something to consider as well.

Maturing is not easy, nor should it be. We also usually learn more from our goofs and failures than we do from our effortless victories. Once you post something you have largely invited the responses you get - getting mad at the individuals who responded is unlikely to either make points, or more importantly, accomplish much. Look at where you are, and look at where you want to go, and then decide on a plan to get you there. No plan, unlikely to succeed. From the there is no use crying over spilled milk school (though you do want to learn from the past to avoid repeating the error), it is, in my view, more important to take stock of the situation as it exists now and then deal with it. The "dealing" with it part can be hard but it can likely be "dealt" with. Lots of paths to the top of the mountain, when one door closes another usually opens, that sort of thing.

 

[khergan]

OP -


You are making a fatal mistake if you are under the assumption that not getting exactly what you want in life is "failing". Even people like Bill Gates & Steve Jobs failed out of college or quit. Most successful people meet with failure or adversity, but get back up to fight another day. It's perseverance and resilience that makes the best leaders.

Most people don't get exactly what they want. Some do, but most (like you) will meet with some sort of blockade to your goals. You can either decide to quit, or power through it.

I hate to say it, but the military doesn't need people who will give up if they don't get exactly what they want. They need tough, resilient and adaptive leaders who will get the mission accomplished regardless of what's thrown at you. The enemy isn't going to give you what you want, that's for damn sure. Getting into a service academy is the least of your worries - what you do after is what really matters. Step up to the plate, give it your all or just quit now, because you'll never make it with the attitude you've got now.

edit:

It's never a black and white situation where one single event in your life means you're ruined. I've even known guys who went to jail and came back to become exemplary officers and NCOs. The situation is only a failure if you decide it is one. If your mind is set that you have failed because of this one class, then nobody can help you. But if you refuse to accept ONE failure as the end of your budding military aspirations, then you will do fine and I'm sure will be an officer one day.

 

[Melitzank]

Matas--

Do not give up. I am also a sophomore, and math is not my strongest subject--in fact, I don't do very well at all (I'm more of a English-history person, opposite of the typical USNA student). BUT, I won't give up. You cannot give up either. If this is what you want, you can do it. Keep working hard. Use your resources, and overcome the challenge. Like others have said in previous posts, there's always NAPS that might be possible. Right now, I have a C in math, and am working to get it higher before the semester ends in January. And if for some reason I can't get it higher before then, I won't just say, "Well, I tried my hardest, but I just can't succeed, so I give up." I'll just try harder next time, and know that in the long run, no matter what happens--whether I get to USNA, NROTC, or get into the military at all--I still tried my hardest. Personal satisfaction in trying my hardest, even if I wasn't #1 in my class, or if I had a 4.0 GPA. Because in the long run, statistics don't matter. What matters is whether or not you and I work our hardest and perverse. I thought I'd give you a real life current example of me since we're in the same grade and both have a math deficiency, so to speak.

If you are giving 110% and still don't succeed in getting to Annapolis, that does not mean you are a failure. It only means it just didn't happen. There are other ways to become an officer too. And if USNA is what you really want, you can go to college for a year, and reapply. And again, and again if it doesn't work out the 2nd and 3rd times. I'll share my personal plan of what I'll do to get to USNA:

1. Apply to USNA C/O 2019
2. If I don't get in, college and NROTC for a year. Reapply.
3. If I don't get in, continue with college and NROTC. Reapply.
4. If I don't get in, keep going with NROTC and college, and by now, I'll stick with NROTC and try and get commissioned. If it doesn't look like commissioning will happen through NROTC, then I'll apply for PLC (I want to be a Marine officer)
5. If PLC doesn't happen, then I'll apply for OCS.
6. If OCS doesn't happen, then I'll enlist.

As you can see, I have quite the plan going. To sum it up in a sentence or two: I won't give up. To me, I will not accept defeat. No one can beat me, including something like academics. You shouldn't let it either.

 

[ESLGuy]

The reason I wanted to go to USNA was because it is more prestigious. I wanted to prove I was good enough for anything if I got in. If I got an ROTC scholarship, I could still be happy, if I achieved my goal.

Another thing worth pointing out, is that everyone here has only been in danger of receiving a D, but nobody who posted here, as far as I know, actually failed a class. I thought that as long as I tried, I couldn't do worse than a C, but I was wrong.

If I get commissioned through ROTC I'll be fine as long as I get a pilot slot. Even if I went to USNA and didn't get a flight slot I would have failed in my mind.

 

[ahuntedyeti]

The reason I wanted to go to USNA was because it is more prestigious. I wanted to prove I was good enough for anything if I got in. If I got an ROTC scholarship, I could still be happy, if I achieved my goal.

Another thing worth pointing out, is that everyone here has only been in danger of receiving a D, but nobody who posted here, as far as I know, actually failed a class. I thought that as long as I tried, I couldn't do worse than a C, but I was wrong.

If I get commissioned through ROTC I'll be fine as long as I get a pilot slot. Even if I went to USNA and didn't get a flight slot I would have failed in my mind.

If you want to become a pilot then go to flight school and become a civilian pilot. If you failure for you is defined by the failure to obtain a pilot slot then you have no business being an officer. NROTC specifically states (I'm sure it is somewhere in USNA info) that pilots are officers, leaders of their platoon/brigade/whatever is the correct term for whom they lead first, and pilots second. If you want to become a military pilot you must realize this and that obtaining a pilot slot is one of the single most difficult tasks one can hope to achieve. In the event one doesn't earn their wings the Navy won't want someone in charge of other souls dragging their feet and moping because they failed.

Do not mistake this for trying to deter you from your goals. I too hope to become an aviator but am more than ready to take on any assignment the Navy hands me. I urge you to really decipher what it is you truly desire, service as an officer or to fly jets and make any future decisions from there.

A common theme on these boards is you will be garaunteed failure if you don't try so I will repeat. The worse they can say is no, but if things go the way you'd like you may one day earn your wings. Good luck and God bless.

 

[Melitzank]

Another thing worth pointing out, is that everyone here has only been in danger of receiving a D, but nobody who posted here, as far as I know, actually failed a class. I thought that as long as I tried, I couldn't do worse than a C, but I was wrong.

pilot2b pointed out that there are people at NAPS who have received a D and also ones who've failed classes.

 

[ESLGuy]

I understand that every officer is a pilot first, and a pilot second. Flying would be a bonus, but it would be worth it. I can't go the civilian route, because civilians don't fly fighter jets. I am willing to do anything I can to achieve my goal, and I will do something else if the navy wants me to.

At first, I wanted to be an officer in the Navy, but then I realized that officers have jobs, so I thought about that for awhile. Then I decided I wanted to be a pilot. I would still be happy as an officer who doesn't get to fly, but I would be more happy if I got to fly.

 

[ESLGuy]

If you want to become a pilot then go to flight school and become a civilian pilot. If you failure for you is defined by the failure to obtain a pilot slot then you have no business being an officer. NROTC specifically states (I'm sure it is somewhere in USNA info) that pilots are officers, leaders of their platoon/brigade/whatever is the correct term for whom they lead first, and pilots second. If you want to become a military pilot you must realize this and that obtaining a pilot slot is one of the single most difficult tasks one can hope to achieve. In the event one doesn't earn their wings the Navy won't want someone in charge of other souls dragging their feet and moping because they failed.

Do not mistake this for trying to deter you from your goals. I too hope to become an aviator but am more than ready to take on any assignment the Navy hands me. I urge you to really decipher what it is you truly desire, service as an officer or to fly jets and make any future decisions from there.

A common theme on these boards is you will be garaunteed failure if you don't try so I will repeat. The worse they can say is no, but if things go the way you'd like you may one day earn your wings. Good luck and God bless.

pilot2b pointed out that there are people at NAPS who have received a D and also ones who've failed classes.

Sorry, I forgot about that. However, they are probably really athletic, whereas I am not, just average.

 

[ahuntedyeti]

I understand that every officer is a pilot first, and a pilot second. Flying would be a bonus, but it would be worth it. I can't go the civilian route, because civilians don't fly fighter jets. I am willing to do anything I can to achieve my goal, and I will do something else if the navy wants me to.

At first, I wanted to be an officer in the Navy, but then I realized that officers have jobs, so I thought about that for awhile. Then I decided I wanted to be a pilot. I would still be happy as an officer who doesn't get to fly, but I would be more happy if I got to fly.

I'm slightly confused by your second paragraph. What do you mean officers have jobs? A 1st LT pilot has nearly the same duties as a 1st LT working in radar besides the fact that one is flying an the other is with radar. Both are in charge of men, both must perform the same required tasks, and both adhere by the same rules and chain of command. Pilots do not get their own section of the ship and operate under different rules, they just get to fly just as radar officers get to operate radar. Pilots may consider themselves as an upper echelon of sailors but in the eyes of the DOD they are the same as any other officer of the same rank. Don't be fooled by the media portraying pilots as a nearly different branch from the navy. All officers, airborne or not fulfill the same basic duties and receive the same basic treatment.

P. S. Someone mentioned earlier about reapplication to USNA after each year of civilian college. I would highly suggest this and make yourself as appealing as possible (I.E. tutoring, extra help courses, guidebooks) because USNA will value college experience over high school. A B in a college course could very well override an A in HS and most definitely override a D. My BGO also said that USNA has a shortage of pilots and had to draw from USAFA to fill remaining slots since everyone who was ranked high in the class chose to become SEALs. This almost garauntees midshipmen a pilot slot if they basically stay afloat in their studies.

 

[Melitzank]

I also forgot to mention that I read one of the BGOs on here say before that USNA will see how you reapplied (if it comes to that), and USNA likes the determination and perseverance and will take that into account.

 

[ESLGuy]

I think I remembering hearing that somewhere, but thanks. I will apply anyways, because one thing I can be sure of is that if I don't apply I won't get in anywhere.