Interesting twist for Class of 2011

Discussion in 'ROTC' started by MissouriDad, Apr 15, 2010.

  1. MissouriDad

    MissouriDad Member

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    Was just told last night that anyone in the class of 2011 will be put in an odd situation if they are going for aviation or nuclear power options. Currently affecting only this class, they will graduate and commission but then they will have up to a year in inactive reserves. This time will count for time in service as well as time in grade but they will have NO military responsibilities (or pay) until they report for their further training. Of course they would need to stay in shape but that would be about it as far as responsibilities go. Will surely be an odd situation.
     
  2. riroka

    riroka Member

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    While visiting Tulane AROTC we were told that a number of this years class had no option but to go reserves. This is odd since the Army is handing out so many scholarships still.
     
  3. goaliedad

    goaliedad Parent

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    The number of AROTC scholarships is actually down almost 50% this year from the figures I've been told. From what I understand, the classes immediately ahead of us are a bit overenrolled, which would be consistent with the forced reserves instead of AD, as the Army needs to keep its ratios of officers at all levels constant. They need officers every year, just some years more officers are needed than others.

    It would seem that overcorrection (over-recruiting followed by over purging) seems to be a pattern. And when the economy improves, I'm sure the balance of officers and ROTC recruiting will once again have to be adjusted.
     
  4. Centhea

    Centhea Member

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    For Army and Air Force ROTC this situation has been around a long time. The status is actually Individual Ready Reserve or IRR. For the Navy, I hear they are looking at this option for the first time due to budgetary concerns and number of school slots. Nuke and Aviation options are long schools and they can only train so many people in a year. Add that to the budget concerns and you have a situation where not everyone can go straight to school and active duty. Priority goes to the academy graduates. It is the Reserve Officers Training Corps, after all. :redface:
     
  5. Carbarrister

    Carbarrister New Member

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    My son is in NROTC Class of 2011, He was told that the change would affect his class and beyond, It was primarily focused on aviation because of the training class backup.
     
  6. kp2001

    kp2001 USMMA Alumnus

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    Sounds like a great time to knock out a 1 year graduate degree. Would come in handy down the road when you already have yours and everyone else is trying to fit it in.
     
  7. aglages

    aglages Parent

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    I wonder if this is not a good time to apply for a NROTC scholarship for Nuclear engineering? Do they have too many nuclear engineers?
     
  8. Centhea

    Centhea Member

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    Aglages: Navy ROTC scholarships are granted based on majors. Most go to Tier 1 (engineering, very technical majors), some to Tier 2 (technical but not as technical as Tier 1, includes things like Architecture) and very few to Tier 3 (things like journalism and criminal justice). So, being a nuclear engineer would not be a bad thing when applying for a scholarship, it would be a good idea.
     
  9. dunninla

    dunninla Member

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    I learned this past Thursday at the Pointsettia Bowl in speaking with some firsties that Naval Academy commissioning officers billeted into Aviation this year will only have to wait about two weeks.

    I also learned that there was a draft for Naval Aviation for the first time in a long while (or possibly ever), which really surprised me. If they had relaxed their standards, no problem, but some of those who chose aviation didn't meet the reqs, so some other highly scored firsties needed to be drafted out of Marines, subs and SWO. The obvious implication is that the hard quotas for diversity of the graduating class is finally impacting the ability for aviation to fill their billets with the quality they require.
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2010
  10. Luigi59

    Luigi59 Banned

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    That's disappointing to hear, but not unexpected.
     
  11. agolson

    agolson Eagle43

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    What proof do you have that the diversity of the class of 2011 has an impact on the Navy's ability to fill its aviation billets?

    Minorities

    The Class of 2011 includes 24.1 % (290) minority midshipmen with ethnic backgrounds as follows:

    African Americans (59)
    Hispanics (134)
    Asian Americans (57)
    Native Americans (26)
    Hawaiian/Pacific Islander (14)
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2010
  12. dunninla

    dunninla Member

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    ^ No proof. It is implied. You may draw a different implication if you wish:smile:
     
  13. Jcleppe

    Jcleppe Member

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    I've seen a couple posts lately regarding diversity at the USNA. I'm not quite sure what is inferred here. Is it implied that minority students are not ending up qualified for slots such as Aviation, or that they do not need to meet the same standards for an appointment. I admit that I come from the Army side of things but over the last 3 years I have seen nothing to suggest this at all. Every cadet that has joined our program no matter what race has been very qualified, in fact most had higher stats then I did when I received my scholarship. I was just surprised to see the direction the posts were going.

    My brother, and father and I share this screen name on this board, sorry for the confusion that sometimes causes.
     
  14. Luigi59

    Luigi59 Banned

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    No, it's not being "inferred" it's a direct accusation by a tenured professor at the United States Naval Academy, who asserts that a "two-tiered" admissions process is in place at USNA that treats minorities and non-minorities differently.
     
  15. gojack

    gojack ....

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    I have read some studies about why so few minorities (blacks in particular)
    are in the upper command positions in the Army.

    The studies concluded that senior positions were usually relegated to officers from the combat arms branches. The study looked at where minority officers branched and saw that minority officers chose combat support branches by a large margin. No reason was found, but it was speculated that black families with a tradition of military service, could have a tradition of combat support vs combat arms.

    If this trend is occurring in the Navy, by increasing the number of minority cadets, the navy could find itself with fewer cadets volunteering for combat arms, irregardless of their academic credentials.

    Just for fun;
    have you visited Military Leadership Diversity Commission (MLDC)?
    Read This?
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2010
  16. Jcleppe

    Jcleppe Member

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    Wow, I guess just us uninformed cadets are color blind these days.
     
  17. aglages

    aglages Parent

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    If you are concerned about the confusion that multiple people might cause by using the same user name, you could register for separate free accounts for each of you. Just an idea...
     
  18. gojack

    gojack ....

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    Read this paper LINK

    (To summarize; test scores are barriers to those who do not do well on the test. Change the currently color blind system to produce the desired results.)

    Official US Government / Congressional Panel Recommendation
    (emphasis added)

    Structural and Perceptual Barriers Can Affect Choices of Career Fields
    Scores on standardized tests, such as the Armed Services Vocational Aptitude Battery (ASVAB), can affect the demographic diversity of certain career fields, as there are average differences across demographic groups in meeting certain qualifications for entry into certain career fields. For example, the well-documented difference in average black and white scores on standardized aptitude tests means that, on average, fewer black service members than white service members can enter career fields requiring high scores on standardized aptitude tests.
    Standardized testing, considered a structural barrier because it is rooted in basic expectations for military service, is one kind of obstacle affecting demographic diversity across career fields. Structural barriers have been described as ―prerequisites or requirements that exclude minorities [and women] to a relatively greater extent than non-Hispanic whites [and men]‖ and are ―inherent in the policies and procedures of the institution‖ (Kirby, Harrell, & Sloan, 2000, p. 525). An example of a structural barrier is the Department of Defense (DoD) policy that restricts women from entering certain career fields that involve direct ground combat (Harrell & Miller, 1997; Segal & Segal, 2004). Another example is the average differences between race/ethnicity groups in scores on standardized tests that are used to assign officers to career fields or initial tours.
    Yet, service members, particularly officers, also have some ability to choose which career fields they enter. These choices can be affected by perceptual barriers, which are ―perceptions, attitudes, or beliefs that lead minorities [and women] to think they cannot or should not pursue… a job or career option‖ (Kirby et al., 2000, p. 525). For example, a perception of barriers may arise if Hispanic recruits fail to identify with non-Hispanic white members of those tactical career fields that are traditionally aligned with the core mission of the Services and provide the most opportunities for high-potential leaders. A Hispanic recruit may also feel a lack of community support both inside and outside the military for such a choice, or they may perceive a lack of role models and mentorship to help them develop their careers in this direction. Perceptual barriers, while perhaps less immediately recognizable through data and analysis than structural barriers, can effectually bar servicemembers from imagining themselves entering those career fields or specialties that can enhance their leadership opportunities.
    While it is important to note that perceptual and structural barriers are not defined as being ―inherently positive or negative,‖ they do ―reflect factors that disproportionately affect minority [and female] groups‖ (IP #15, Military occupations and implications for racial/ethnic and
    gender diversity: Enlisted force, Military Leadership Diversity Commission, 2010b, p. 3). Career field preferences have been found to break along race and ethnicity lines, with more white men choosing to enter ―tactical career fields (e.g., infantry in Army) and specialties (e.g., SEALs in the Navy) than minority men (Kirby et al., 2000; Lim, Marquis, Hall, Schulker, & Zhuo, 2009). It is thus IMPERATIVE to identify both types of barriers and to reevaluate the policy supporting them when necessary.
     
  19. breadcrumbs

    breadcrumbs Member

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    "I also learned that there was a draft for Naval Aviation for the first time in a long while (or possibly ever), which really surprised me."

    Asked my Firstie Mid Kid about this and the answer I got was no way. Only draft was nuke, both SWO & Subs. Would be interested to know where this info came from. Maybe others heard different info/rumors.
     
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2010
  20. dunninla

    dunninla Member

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    ^ from a Firstie who got Aviation. A Trident Scholar, so he's usually pretty good with keeping facts straight, or else my ears failed me :) . Had lunch with him in San Diego.

    P.S. was speaking with a firstie who was drafted into subs... his only comment: "I felt like asking if I could return the $14,000 and get back into my first choice".
     
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2010

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