Jump Wings AFROTC

Discussion in 'ROTC' started by bb2405, Jun 5, 2015.

  1. bb2405

    bb2405 Member

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    I know at USAFA they have the chance to get jump certified but is there the same program for AFROTC?
     
  2. Non Ducor Duco

    Non Ducor Duco I am not led, I lead

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    Unfortunately, they don't allow AFROTC cadets to participate in that anymore. I don't know when they stopped sending AFROTC cadets to extra training, but it's been at least 6 years.
     
  3. Fayt42

    Fayt42 Member

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    AFROTC has reinstated PDT's (Personal Development Training) this year. How I wished I utilized that in my first year of AFROTC... It's one of my biggest regrets as they stopped doing that due to budget cuts.
     
  4. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    Quick question bb2405,

    Are you intending to go ALO? I ask this because in the rated world, the running joke is why would you jump out of a perfectly good airplane?
    ~ With each jump you take a risk of an injury that may stop you from going rated.

    Secondly,
    Bullet jumped with 82nd when he went ALO. I don't know how many jumps he did, but he has the wreath(aka toiletbowl) and the star. However, when that tour was 89 days out before he left for the F15E, he never jumped again due to the risk. Back than to keep jump pay it 1x every 90 days.

    Clarification for the PDT. It is only for scholarship recipients during their rising sophomore year. A type 7 recipient that converts to a 3 yr type 2 will not be offered that opportunity. At least that is what my impression is due to the fact that they have yet to contract their freshmen year.
     
  5. Non Ducor Duco

    Non Ducor Duco I am not led, I lead

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    It depends on the PDT. AFROTC suddenly found a lot of money this year. So rising 200s on scholarship are being sent on summer base visits. That's the only one that's scholarship based. FT cadets can apply to CRO/STO/ALO Orientation PDT's, rising 400s were allowed to apply to the AFA's ESET program this summer, one cadet from each detatchment. Hopefully this is a good sign and there will be even more opportunities next year, I'd like to do the Jump Program if they start letting ROTC cadets do it again.
     
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  6. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    Non Ducor,

    Just becareful if you want to go rated. Bullet went through Jump at Benning as an ALO. On the last day, a guy that had a follow on for 16s, jumped and shattered their ankle requiring many pins. His 16 slot was pulled. It sounds like fun, but at certain point you have to weigh the risk. If you have a rated slot as a 300/rising 400 and break a bone you would have to go through DoDMERB/Flight Medicine all over again.
    ~ The guy took the Jump ALO only because the 111s were basically a dieing breed (F15Es were replacing them) and this was the only way to guarantee he would get out of the 111s at a young age. Instead he never flew again.
    ~~ In the rated world, right or wrong, fliers avoid flight docs at cost...Bullet and his peers were known to reset their broken fingers/toes just so they didn't have to go to a flight doc. It was pretty serious if anyone said I need to go to the flight doc....i.e. couldn't walk, and even then it was the spouse that called the ball and said YOU ARE GOING!

    Many have no issues, and I assume that is the majority, maybe 1 breaks a bone, but that 1 could be you. I am sure I am being Janie Raincloud, but I can guarantee you that Bullet would have said to our DS, if offered this as a cadet with a rated slot, that it would be a no go for not only the risk, but also as a guy that had what Bullet called "real" jump wings, there is no extra respect, because if you don't have at least the star in the AF it means you did it over summer as a cadet.
    ~ Thus, don't risk it.
    ~~ Not joking go ask Flieger, what people say to rated that decide to jump as an assignment....10 will get me 10,000 that he will say everyone in the unit teased them about jumping out of perfectly good airplanes. My DS that flies a C130J where they drop people out of his airplane now laughs and says....no way would I do it!
    ~~~ Probably because he sees them squeezed in like sardines, and later on hears about how many landed in a tree on the drop.
    ~~~~ That and the fact he now even hates flying commercial because he can't see what the pilot is doing! It is amazing once you get your wings how your perspective changes. Bullet feels the same way too.

    Secondly, If you do go rated, than as a rising 400 you go to WPAFB, that summer, you will need to make sure there are no confliction dates.

    I think it is a great opportunity, and I think the money will be there next year, but getting a ride in a 16 because you were the pogey might be a better decision than doing the jump. It will enlighten you to what life is like in an OP squadron, how many hours they brief, debrief, life support, roll call, etc.

    Just my opinion, and now throw it in the circular receptacle.
     
  7. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    That is an amazing opportunity. If it is true that it is 1 from each det. than, coming from a large unit like my DSs where @30 commissioned, it would be a long shot to get that opportunity, but still a great chance. A smaller unit and your odds increase. There are some posters that state only 5 commission, basically a 20% chance instead of a 3.5% chance.
    ~ I do believe it does not count though from the rated world perspective. IOWS, you still have to do SERE after you wing. I could be wrong. I think Fencer can answer that question.

    Again, I think if offered any opportunity as an AFROTC cadet is great, but being that far down the pipeline, I believe cadets should choose wisely regarding risks and benefits. Jump wings at 21 sounds sooooo cool. Shattered bones in your arm because you landed in a tree right before you were suppose to go WPAFB for your FC1A...not so much.
     
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2015
  8. Stealth_81

    Stealth_81 Super Moderator Moderator Founding Member

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    Over 300 cadets get their jump wings at USAFA each year and I don't see the AF worrying about it too much. It is a good program for teaching to overcome fears and to have a large sense of accomplishment. AFROTC used to do the program at USAFA along with the AFA cadets so I would hope that they can return to that training. Son has said that it was his favorite airmanship program.

    Stealth_81
     
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  9. -Bull-

    -Bull- Member

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    Thousands of Soldiers manage to do it every year and drive on. Risks are everywhere, you don't have to completely avoid them, just understand and mitigate them. If you get offered the chance, go for it, especially if you want to work with the Army or Marines in the future.
     
  10. Non Ducor Duco

    Non Ducor Duco I am not led, I lead

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    It is a great opportunity, I'm glad I got selected for it. I still haven't been able to collect a lot of information about it, but the packing list has a lot of cold weather gear that we don't get issued down here in the south. I've never been farther north (in the US) than D.C so I'm wondering where they're going to take us that we'll need thermal underwear and fleece or GORTEX in mid July. Are parts of Colorado just freezing year round?

    I'm fairly sure that it doesn't count for SERE though, there is no resistance and escape portion. I'm still leaning heavily towards going intel so I figured this might be my only chance to experience something like it.
     
  11. MomWPgirl

    MomWPgirl Member

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    Sad to hear summer opportunities for AFROTC cadets are no longer offered or extremely limited. My eldest (commissioned 2012) did Freefall his freshman summer. It is going to be interesting to see the differences in my youngest's AFROTC experiences vs his big brother.
     
  12. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    My very close friends in Denver just posted pictures of them skiing this past weekend, so my guess is that it will still be cold enough in July that thermal underwear may keep you warm at night.
    ~ Think about it. If it rains in the woods and the temp only hits 50 for the day, nighttime it could be 40 degrees.

    They have to be prepared for all types of weather.
     
  13. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    I think that it appears they are bringing it back now for contracted cadets. After 08 (2012 grads) they basically stopped everything except SFT.
    Actually, if memory serves me correctly, back in 08, if a HS scholarship recipient converted their 4 yr type 7 to a 3 yr type 2, they were not offered any summer programs as a 100 prior to their 200 year. However, reading the posts here they are offering it to those HS recipients that converted. Thus, it is expanding.

    The AF does this on a cyclical basis with an ebb and flow. It just depends on when you enter.

    As far as the jump thing goes. I hope people understand that I am not opposed to it at all. Bullet jumped for 2 years as an ALO, however, I do feel that people should weigh the risks. It is fun and unique, something that your non-military college friends will envy, and many, the high % will have no problems at all, but walk in with eyes wide open of what if an injury occurs, because unlike USAFA cadets, you will get your rated slot as a 300, and you will go to WPAFB for your FC1A as a rising 400. It can mess things up.
    ~ Just like how every AFROTC cadet, scholarship or not, as a freshmen walks in believing they will commission 4 years later, there will be many that won't. Find me 1 person that says it will be me prior to entering the program.

    I believe in fate and not living in a bubble, if I didn't I would have been locked up in the looney bin when Bullet jumped, instead I sat on the bleachers with my kids at the drop zone watching him fall from the sky....laughing/joking with the other wives as we watched them fall...oh thats my DH he is falling like a rock....thats my DH he landed up in the shrubs! That being said, I also don't believe in taking a risk for the heck of it, especially since in the AF nobody cares about the 6 jump jump wings.
     
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