Less spots, fewer chances

Discussion in 'Academy/Military News' started by USCGA2017hopeful, Jan 16, 2013.

  1. USCGA2017hopeful

    USCGA2017hopeful Member

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    Explains the same thing is happening with AFA, and likely the other academies as well.


    http://theday.com/article/20130114/NWS09/301149957/1017
     
  2. BigBear

    BigBear Class of 2015

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    I don't know about the officer retention stats on the officer side, but yes, USMA's entering class size is getting smaller and we have been told that there is a mandate to kick at least 200 people out by the end of this semester, so it is definitely becoming more competitive here.
     
  3. falconfamily

    falconfamily Member

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    Part of the issue has to do with the statutory limits of 4000 Cadets in each of the major Service Academies (USMA, USNA, USAFA), I understood that USMA had about 4600 in 2012 and was mandated to get to 4400 by this year. However that is still more than the statutory limit. It will all depend on force structure, if the Army gets smaller there will be less demand on leaders. As it stands now the strategy is for the least amount of restructuring in the Navy and Air Force. Additionally it appears that USAFA is very close to it's statutory limit right now, with USNA about the same size as USMA.
     
  4. GoArmyBeatNavy

    GoArmyBeatNavy Member

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    I still believe the authorized size of the USMA Corps and USNA Brigade are still 4400 as authorized by congress. I have not heard that the service secretaries have mandated smaller bodies for them:

    USMA:
    (Title 10 › Subtitle B › Part III › Chapter 403 › § 4342)

    USNA:
    (Title 10 › Subtitle C › Part III › Chapter 603 › § 6954)

    I believe that Air Force has reduced its Corps size to 4000, but it is still allowed by law to max at 4400.

    USAFA:
    (Title 10 › Subtitle D › Part III › Chapter 903 › § 9342).
     
  5. USCGA2017hopeful

    USCGA2017hopeful Member

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    In addition to smaller classes, don't expect to see many more of those "he was honest about breaking the rules, so we'll keep him around" honor/conduct violation cases. There most likely won't be that many second chances, and very few third chances.
     
  6. scoutpilot

    scoutpilot Member

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    ...says the voice of the experienced candidate?
     
  7. USCGA2017hopeful

    USCGA2017hopeful Member

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    ... Says the voice of someone who knows how to read an article.

    Simply trying to start a discussion since another user recently posted about lying on his application regarding drug use after receiving an appointment.

    There is no need to jump down my throat for that post. It involved nothing that needed personal experience.
     
  8. LineInTheSand

    LineInTheSand USCGA 2006

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    An honor violation generally ends in getting the boot. A conduct offense was more up in the air, but yes, it seems that no seccond chances.
     
  9. scoutpilot

    scoutpilot Member

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    Often declared, rarely enacted, it seems.
     
  10. scoutpilot

    scoutpilot Member

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    If you think that's someone jumping down your throat, you could be in a for a real shock if you're appointed.
     
  11. jbsail

    jbsail Member

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    Exactly 2017! I was right there with you when I read this.

     
  12. LineInTheSand

    LineInTheSand USCGA 2006

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    I saw, maybe 2-5 second chances as a cadet (not my chances, others) for honor. Yes, more chances for conduct, but from what I've heard from someone there now, you have a whole lot less rope now.
     
  13. Luigi59

    Luigi59 Banned

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    Former Supe RADM Burhoe gave lots of 2nd chances, he retained many of whom were recommended for disenrollment by the Commandant(s).

    RADM Stosz is an iron fist, not even waiting for the Commandant to hold the Mast, she is doing it herself (I don't think Burhoe ever held a Mast while at CGA).

    The same Conduct and/or Honor offenses, as well as borderline PFE and grades that were "remediable" in the past, are getting the boot during her tenure - it is being both "declared" and "enacted" with regularity.
     
  14. SamAca10

    SamAca10 Ensign - DWO

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    Well that Mast was a special case - it was a 1/c cadet who was stealing large amounts of money/valuable from the Corps. He had started doing it when he was the Swab Summer Officer, and was eventually caught at the end of the first semester. The only other way to deal with that case would have been court-martial, and his class would've already graduated by then.

    As for the rest, it is true that you're way less likely to get retained if you get masted. 9 of my classmates were masted last semester for a conduct case over the summer, and only a third of them remain. It really is getting tougher around here if you get in trouble.

    Sadly, my class is almost as small as 2016. :frown:
     
  15. scoutpilot

    scoutpilot Member

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    33% getting a second chance is still pretty good.
     
  16. SamAca10

    SamAca10 Ensign - DWO

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    They were all originally recommended to be disenrolled, but luckily their appeal went through. And they had a lot of character witnesses/high performance (academic,military,physical) built up from their time spent here, which certainly helped
     
  17. LineInTheSand

    LineInTheSand USCGA 2006

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    I was pre-Rear Adm. Burhoe, who, we may want to remind people, was an OCS grad.

    Rear Adm. Van Sice gave a few "second chances" for honor violations, two of which I put up and were voted 9-0 and 5-4 disenrollment (or was it a 7-person honor board, then it would have been 7-0, 4-3).

    Honor, for me, should send you out the door, no second chances. Conduct is case by case. I can't remember a single classmate who was recommended for disenrollment but graduated with us. Maybe one got by, but I can't remember any.
     

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