Metrics for acceptance by state/ Congressional district and NWL by State ?

Discussion in 'Military Academy - USMA' started by NJ_Dad, Jul 14, 2016.

  1. NJ_Dad

    NJ_Dad Member

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    Does anyone have or seen or have a link that shows the demographic mix for acceptance by congressional district / MOC and also the quantities by state getting acceptance off the NWL.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2016
  2. NJ_Dad

    NJ_Dad Member

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    Got a email from USMA Admissions. That info is not public knowledge but had a good talk about my congressional district specifically and that was helpful.
     
  3. time2

    time2 Member

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    You have asked basically the same question on various threads dating back to March, 2016. Is your son/daughter more/less likely to apply based on what you find out? Unless you plan to move to some other state that is 'less' competitive to try to improve their chance for a NOM, I am not sure what exactly you are looking for or how that information would be relevant to the application process.
     
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  4. jl123

    jl123 Member

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    Candidates can only apply in one congressional district, but some have an option to apply in one district or another.
     
  5. NJ_Dad

    NJ_Dad Member

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    I have kept asking becasue I really never get the answer to the question I am specifically asking and no this is only for me I do not share these kinds of discussion with my DS. But part of that answer I did get today on the phone with admissions so I'm content. I always think its important to understand what the direct playing field looks like. Example were there 500 applications opened in your district and none were completed or they all were. I like to know the odds in all aspects of my life. And to my suprise for an extremly competitive academic district the submissions were quite low as compared to the NJ districts much closer to WP which were at times 4x greater. What State / Dictrict Pct-wise wins the NWL battle from a trend year after year is still an open question. That might be a bit more difficult to get but they said I could always call back at any time and they gave me their direct number
     
  6. bookreader

    bookreader Member

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    I think it would be very interesting to know. I spoke with a NJ FFR at Rday and he said that NJ was one of the most competitive states. Glad I didn't know just how competitive our state is when my cadet was applying.
     
  7. Cerberi

    Cerberi Member

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    But you will never know because though some districts always have more applicants - you will never have insight into how your DS compares to this year's crop of applicants. People go through all sorts of analysis to find the secret sauce that tells them with certainty if they do x or score y points will they get nominated/appointed. It is a futile exercise - the only folks that know are the nominating sources and how they do it and the admissions boards and how they ultimately decide. There is science involved but also intangibles and who else is in the pool.

    I am also curious to the post that says applicants can only apply in one district but may have an option to pick which district to apply. Are you referring to divorced parents, military families living in one district but the official home of record is somewhere else? Not saying that is wrong information, but would like to see the source for that information referenced.
     
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  8. jl123

    jl123 Member

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    @Cerberi Any instance where there is an alternate residence and the congressional office will accept the application. MOC has final say. Occurs with above examples and college students living away from home. But most use this as a matter of convenience. As mentioned elsewhere, trying to game the system is risky because the pool in each district changes every year. Even in a "weak" district, it only takes one candidate to knock all of the other qualified ones onto the NWL.
     
  9. Cerberi

    Cerberi Member

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    College students attending out of state colleges will apply to the MOCs where they have official legal residence.

    In my reading your post, you seem to suggest people can pick and choose which state candidates can use to determine which MOCs to apply for a nomination.

    I think those circumstances when people can choose which state they can apply are at best rare if they exist at all.

    If the nomination system of which MOC could be gamed, how to do that would be well known and utilized.

    If you are saying it can be done, I am asking for the source of that information.
     
  10. brovol

    brovol Member

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    Last year someone posted a link to a source which listed how many nominations each MOC has made every year. It was surprising to me that many MOC 's made only a few nominations to each academy, instead of the ten they are allowed for each slot. This led to my conclusion that those MOC 's were gaming the system to cater to a certain group within there constituency . These were not small or uncompetitive districts either. Many including one of my Senators, appeared to be nominating almost soley "underrepresented" groups. Not trying to steer this in the wrong direction, but if the question is whether some MOC 's have a broader agenda than nominating the most qualified candidates, I strongly suspect there may be merit to the contention. And other perhaps more qualified candidates may fall victim to those politics.
     
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  11. Cerberi

    Cerberi Member

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    My question is not how many MOCs do or don't nominate a full slate if they nominate any at all. What I am questioning what sources are being referenced that gives anyone or group (if any at all) to request a nomination from anywhere else but the candidates home of record.

    I knew a number of military dependents that for college application purposes were allowed to apply as in state residents for both the official home of record of the military member and the state where they currently live (attended high school)

    I may have read too much into but I implied that JL123 was suggesting MOC shopping was an ok part of the nomination process
     
  12. AJC

    AJC Member

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    Of course they have a broader agenda. That is why they passed the laws to create nominations in the first place.
    It always has been about patronage. The concept of doing what is best for the country as a whole has yet to catch on in the halls of Congress. If you want fair, most states and counties have them during the summer.
     
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  13. buff81

    buff81 Moderator

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    Many MOCs use boards to interview the candidates to avoid the appearance of favoritism. The boards create the slates and the MOC rubber stamps it.
     
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  14. Dixieland

    Dixieland Member

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    This was my grad's experience with all of his MOC interviews.
     
  15. Freda'sMom

    Freda'sMom Parent

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    I was told Congressman Chris Van Holland's district (MD-7th) had more total candidates admitted to all 5 academies combined in each of the last 3 years, more than any other district in the country. Yes, he includes the CGA because even though they don't use nominations it provides a better picture of the competitiveness of the district.

    Or apply to that military academy in CT that doesn't use a nomination process.
     
  16. pinkroyals32

    pinkroyals32 Member

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    An admin should make this a sticky already haha. Just email your MOC they'll tell you everything you would want to know.
     
  17. time2

    time2 Member

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    I am not sure what we are even discussing. We are certainly off 'in the weeds' compared to what the OP originally asked.
     
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  18. jl123

    jl123 Member

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    College students attending out of state colleges will apply to the MOCs where they have official legal residence......
    I may have read too much into but I implied that JL123 was suggesting MOC shopping was an ok part of the nomination process

    Misleading. A college student can justify legal residence at school or home. They are adults.

    And, yes, you did read too much into it. I never suggested anyone was "MOC shopping". In most cases it is impossible to determine which district is going to be less competitive. It was in response to the suggestion of trying to game districts that I provided the information about potential candidates that one can not account for in trying to gauge competitiveness. Source: Knowledge of candidates that had a choice and chose the more convenient one.
     
  19. Cerberi

    Cerberi Member

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    No clue what I just read.

    Under what scenario did your source have options to pick and choose (divorced parents living in separate states/districts; military dependents living in one state with parents legal residence in another; ??)

    Your scenario is at best non standard, but if what you suggest is possible and has occurred, it could be relevant information to those in similar situations to take advantage. At least I would ask about it at the next Prop and Wings meeting in July

    There was a scenario last year where someone asked if they could apply to MOCs in state x, even though their Dad who was retired military actually lived and worked in state y, but had decided to keep his 'military home of record'. So essentially the Dad was cheating on his income taxes.
     
  20. jl123

    jl123 Member

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    This is not an unusual situation. Every year several candidates to all service academies experience uncertainty about the district in which they should apply due to some connection to more than one district. The steps they take: 1. Talk to admissions 2. Talk to congressional office(s) 3. apply.

    Not sure why you are nitpicking this issue. Pointless to continue this discussion.
     

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