Misdemeanor Trouble

Discussion in 'Naval Academy - USNA' started by gmac607, Apr 20, 2011.

  1. gmac607

    gmac607 New Member

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    My son, who recently received his appointment, even more recently got into some trouble. It had nothing to do with drugs or alcohol, but while in a car with his friends and the windows down, he shouted a profanity, "a$$" to clarify. A police officer over heard and pulled them over and gave my son a citation for disorderly conduct. The officer was willing to let my son go through Pretrial Intervention, or PTI. This would drop the charges and expunge his "arrest". Will this cost him his appointment? Also when should he notify the academy, now or after the court date? Any advice, especially from a BGO or admissions officer would be greatly appreciated.
     
  2. MIDNDAD

    MIDNDAD Member

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    My Opinion: As you have described this event, this is the equivilent of a traffic citation. This will not cost appointment. That said, I would not contact the Academy and volunteer the information that this event took place. Let that sleeping dog lay there. Per your information the PTI will expunge any charges, therefore in the eyes of the the law the event never took place.

    Police background check takes care of any criminal issues that the Academy would care about. Even if this has not been completed as yet, an event like this would not show up with your description of PTI procedure.

    Assume you have had conversation with your son that "stupid hurts" and take this as warning that his dreams can disappear in an instant of being dumb.

    Best of luck and this is only the beginning of a true roller coaster ride.
     
  3. behrsmom

    behrsmom Member

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    My son received a ticket for not wearing his seat belt, right in front of our house. I was advised to notify admissions immediately, and had to provide copies of the ticket. I was told it was better to be up front with them, I think having them find out (and they will) and have to ask you about it would be much worse. I think they just want to have everything documented, doesn't sound like it will be a big deal either way. Better safe than sorry, but that is just my opinion.
     
  4. MIDNDAD

    MIDNDAD Member

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    This is one of those gray area issues that also depends where you are in the application process. While in the application process, academy wants to know about any significant changes from grades to criminal activity. It's part of their decision process.

    Once appointment is in hand, other than permit to report packet, Academy is not asking for data. The decision is made. Hence my reccomendation not to volunteer information on something that will not exist after the PTI process completes. Again: Just my Opinion
     
  5. jennyp

    jennyp Parent

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    I agree with the sentiments that one should notify the Academy immediately. Yes, supposedly the arrest/ticket does not go on his record.

    I know someone very well who had an incident with the police in 2004, completed the terms of his probation which included expunging the entire incident from his record. He was told he didn't have to say it ever happened. Lo and behold, every couple years he has to pass a background check for a youth organization and it comes up. He has to explain it every time. Expunging from the record is not a very fool proof thing. Not at all.

    I think it would be best to be up front than have them find out later. And my money's on them finding out.
     
  6. usnabgo08

    usnabgo08 USNA 2008/BGO

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    Not commenting specifically on this issue/case, but looking at the big picture, as well, don't forget that MIDN have background investigations for clearances (which could possibly include Top Secret/SCI down the road) -- something to "think" about through the application process, at USNA, and then in the service.

    I think in this case it is a judgement call and sometimes you don't want to be the Senior man with a secret. In all honesty, Sailors are "salty" and throwing out an explicit probably won't cost an appointment, especially if it is not the ordinary conduct of the person.

    I never heard of someone getting a ticket for randomly saying an explicit.
     
  7. rkrosnar

    rkrosnar Member

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    gmac607

    This is not a traffic citation (ticket), this is a criminal citation, a misdemeanor, which could have serious consequences. and a juvenile at that. While, what your DS was foolish, he broke the law. I agree with jennyp, get in contact with someone. Because if you don't and they find out, well, enough said. If he loses the appointment, he loses it and besides having to probably to court and paying the fine.This will be a big lesson learned.

    Good luck,

    RGK
     
  8. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    Additionally prior to commissioning they will go through another security clearance, and every 5 yrs as an AD member.

    Keep the paperwork and never assume that it was permanently expunged. You don't want to be in 4 yrs scrambling looking for paperwork that you pushed aside because you trusted that it did get expunged.

    Security clearances are intense. We are not talking about 5-10 pages, we are talking 50+, with references, social security numbers, addresses of every home you lived in over X amount of yrs.

    Anyone in the military will tell you to keep your paperwork. Our DS is now going through it for AF UPT. First thing DH said to him, download it on a flash drive and print it up, give the copy to us, and we will keep it in our fire safe lockbox.

    Bullet served 21 yrs ADAF, and now he is govt, he still has the 1st one from 1986, and every one after that.

    Also, for the security clearance they ask for personal refs., and interview these people, all you need is to put someones name down, and they get asked do you know if they ever had trouble with the law? Oh yeah, I remember when he was a sr...., but that was expunged. The innocent, honest answer just started an inquiry because you never informed them.
     
  9. sprog

    sprog Member

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    To whom did the kid direct the word when he yelled it out of the car? Was it to the cop, to another driver, to a friend?
     
  10. gmac607

    gmac607 New Member

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    Thank you everyone for your advice. I will definitely report it. I am still wondering whether to do it now or after the court date. To sprog, he knew there were people nearby and yelled it to get a laugh from his friends but to no one in particular.
     
  11. PositiveThinking

    PositiveThinking Member

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    Make sure your son is the one to report it - that will really help the "lesson " sink in! Kids will be kids, but don't you want to strangle them sometimes? :wink:

    And by the way, the words he'll have yelled at him during plebe summer will be a tad worse than "a$$", believe me! :eek: :shake:
     
  12. Memphis9489

    Memphis9489 Parent

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    I will SECOND your opinion!

    If the net result of the event is the equivalent of a traffic ticket - I would disregard it, also ... especially if I had my "Permit to Report" in hand.
     
  13. gmac607

    gmac607 New Member

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    Guys thank you so much. He hasn't gotten his ptr just yet although i don't believe this event has an effect on this. Also if this was just the equivalent of a traffic violation I probably wouldn't be as concerned but disorderly conduct is a misdemeanor. How does that change things?
     
  14. usnabgo08

    usnabgo08 USNA 2008/BGO

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    I am not sure what this year's PTR content states, but in the one for the Class of 2007, which was, obviously, a long time ago, it stated:

    "All candidates accepting their appointment to the Naval Academy are required to obtain a routine police record check from their local police department prior to reporting to the Academy on Induction Day...The police record check is for all violations of the law, including minor traffic and nontraffic violations. If you were charged with a misdemeanor or felony, a copy of the court record is required."

    This is also consistent with DD FORM 369. This form is sent to all appointees AFTER appointment, therefore the decision to appoint a candidate was never "officially" based on a police background check. Since there was a change in status, I think the right thing to do is to notify USNA and explain the circumstances around the issue....and in all honesty, I think as long as your son learned something from it, Admissions is not likely to rescind the appointment.

    My two cents.
     

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