My application process

Discussion in 'Air Force Academy - USAFA' started by g041rf0rc3, Sep 11, 2015.

  1. g041rf0rc3

    g041rf0rc3 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2015
    Messages:
    89
    Likes Received:
    7
    step1: basic eligibility requirements

    *US citizen
    *at least 17, but not older than 23(on july 1st of the entry year) (I'm 18 yo)
    *unmarried without dependents
    *good moral character

    step2: my application process

    1)Now I'll apply to get my PPL in my country (finish in 2016):cool:

    2)Once my EB-5 visa have been done(so after 10-14 months after started the application ,I get my ''green card'')

    3)My HS certificate ''accrediatation''

    4)Take the TOEFL/ACT and Enroll at local college or community college in San Antonio, TX

    ->Enroll at the English as Second language program to improve my poor english skills
    -> They said I must have a strong academic preparation.. so I'll take courses in geometry, algebra, trigonometry, precalculus, chemistry(with a lab), social studies, computer science etc

    Participate in some extracurricular activities( I do Karate in my country right now), but it's not enough...

    -Maybe also participate in air rifle and/ or paragliding championships in the US.

    -Community service(homeless challenge program and Americorps - help to veterans)

    -Science club in college, if applicable, IDK yet... Astronomy or Robotics club

    -Volunteer in EAA ,Young Eagles or US Ultralight Association(IDK if my PPL will be accepted by the FAA)

    -survival school(lol) just to feel this experience before join the military

    5)Talk with a recruiter and take the ASVAB and MEPS PULHES Standards(and pass)

    6)Stay in the college while in DEP(3-9 months)

    note: with 30 or 45 semester hours I can enlist as E-2 or E-3

    7)AFBMT(8 1/2 weeks)

    To improve my EPR..I'll *TRY * to be a honor graduate(only 10%)
    ->Requirements:

    #never fail in a graded inspection(wall locker, personal area)
    # thunderbolt or warhawk ribbon
    #must score > 90% on all written exams
    #must be recommended by you TI
    #satisfactory grades (core value ratings, individual drill, reporting, training weapon, fest, sabc, and beast)

    Try to get the ''expert marksmanship ribbon''(45 out of 50 shots with m16 rifle)


    8)Finally ... Apply for LEAD Program

    PCQ(online)ACT scores, class rank, GPA

    AF IMT 1786 with attached commander's letter of endorsement

    letters of evaluation(military officer and 1st sgt)

    up to 3 letters of recommendations(optional)

    CFA

    DoDMERB

    Interview with ALO

    Writing Sample

    nomination(congressional or VP)

    USAFA Form 146(personal data record)

    AF IMT 2030(drug and alcohol abuse certificate)

    Form 147(extracurricular activities record)

    Furthermore, someone knows info about DANTES version of the ACT?
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2015
  2. g041rf0rc3

    g041rf0rc3 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2015
    Messages:
    89
    Likes Received:
    7
    I don't need to be perfect. I just have to have the requirements.
     
  3. Christcorp

    Christcorp Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    4,963
    Likes Received:
    872
    Maybe I missed it; but where in that time line you get your US Citizenship?

    Also, you might not think you have to be perfect; that you only need the requirements..... but you will be competing with others who are close to being perfect. Or at least they are much higher than just meeting the requirements.
     
  4. g041rf0rc3

    g041rf0rc3 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2015
    Messages:
    89
    Likes Received:
    7
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2015
  5. Christcorp

    Christcorp Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    4,963
    Likes Received:
    872
    I'm familiar with the citizenship program. Just wanted to make sure you knew it wasn't automatic. You have to get all the proper paperwork done.
     
  6. Christcorp

    Christcorp Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    4,963
    Likes Received:
    872
    As for the act through Dantes, you're still taking the same act test. You're just doing it through Dantes at a base instead of through a high school. Very common especially among airmen oversees. But the test , scores, etc. Are the same.
     
  7. fencersmother

    fencersmother Founding Member

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2007
    Messages:
    2,580
    Likes Received:
    800
    OP: what are you asking of us?
     
  8. g041rf0rc3

    g041rf0rc3 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2015
    Messages:
    89
    Likes Received:
    7
    About leadership positions/student government (president, vp, secretary,treasurer, historian, stewardship agent)...

    They are elected by their classmates?
    So...there is no other way to become a leader?
     
  9. fencersmother

    fencersmother Founding Member

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2007
    Messages:
    2,580
    Likes Received:
    800
    You have me confused here. Leadership is demonstrated BEFORE you are appointed, not after you get there (though that will be demonstrated on a daily basis there too).
     
  10. g041rf0rc3

    g041rf0rc3 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2015
    Messages:
    89
    Likes Received:
    7
    fencersmother,

    Yes...Before the academy...

    Leadership positions are strongly recommended. But I think that is hard to arrive in the US, go to college and right after this be elected by your classmates once you're a ''new guy'' there...

    So HOW can I achieve this leadership position?Any idea?

    Thanks
     
  11. Captain Falcon

    Captain Falcon New Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2015
    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    1
    They don't do class presidents in college, but you could become leader in a club; but like you said it's hard to elected when you're new. However, outside of college you can lead in boy/girl/cub scouts as an adult or at a boys and girls club. None of those positions require election.
     
    g041rf0rc3 likes this.
  12. g041rf0rc3

    g041rf0rc3 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2015
    Messages:
    89
    Likes Received:
    7
    Thanks Captain Falcon
     
  13. USAFA83GradWife

    USAFA83GradWife Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2013
    Messages:
    1,115
    Likes Received:
    564
    Leadership qualities can be shown in ways other than getting elected to student councils/government.

    For instance:
    Were/are you a captain or leader on a sports team?
    Do you hold a leadership position in a club or other activity?
    Did you help raise your siblings? Handle family finances or work to support your family?
    Do you have a job where you have to mentor or train others?
    Have you organized an activity like: book drive, charity event, church activity, etc. ?
    Do you tutor other students?

    Those are just a few examples.
     
  14. AlexT

    AlexT Banned

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2013
    Messages:
    171
    Likes Received:
    65
    OP, why are you talking to a recruiter, taking the AVSAB and also passing the MEPS PULHES standards? Are you planning to enlist first and then try to get an appointment while enlisted?
     
  15. g041rf0rc3

    g041rf0rc3 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2015
    Messages:
    89
    Likes Received:
    7
    AlexT,

    Yes...this is my plan
     
  16. Pima

    Pima Parent

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2007
    Messages:
    12,800
    Likes Received:
    932
    Here's things that shot out to me from a timeline/age aspect.

    1. PPL in your own country sometime in 2016.
    ~ Have you checked to see if it will be accepted here by the AF and the FAA?
    ~ Many cadets try to obtain their PPL for 2 reasons. 1 is being more competitive for pilot selection. 2. To have IFT waived. If they don't accept your PPL than where does that leave you?

    2. You are going to be in San Antonio when?
    ~ If you are finishing your PPL in your country sometime next year, than I am going to assume you won't be starting CC in San Antonio until Fall 2016 at the earliest.
    ~~ Doing my math that places you at 19 turning 20

    3. Enlist at 19 using delayed entry meaning you will be close to 20 before basic (basic in 2017)
    ~ Have you investigated what occurs after basic, that they may send you to another training school for your career before moving you to your 1st base? That school can be 3-6 months, and there may be a lag time between graduating basic and the specialty school starting, which it can put you coming up at 21 if not already 21
    ~~ Chances of getting Command support if you only showed up 2 months earlier is not going to be high IMPO, especially if there are 2 or 3 others that have been there much longer.
    ~~~ Thus, that means you have to wait one more year before you get a shot at it. You will now be 22. Let's say you turn 22 on June 15th. That means Prep school is completely out of the question.

    Additionally, the assumption that you can juggle both CC and just starting your career is a very poor assumption in my opinion, let alone all of the other ECs that you are stating. You will need to get your bearings 1st.

    4. Curriculum
    Totally confused here.
    I would have never assumed that you are not a US citizen by the way you correspond with posters here. Why would you enroll in a program like that? Why not take English courses that would be considered more rigorous when they look at your transcript?

    Are you saying to us that you never took a Math or Science class in HS? In essence, what you are accomplishing those 30-45 credits is to get the equivalent of the avg HS graduate? This may be a problem because you need to understand that the candidates are not avg HS graduates. Most of them will have 30-45 college credits, and those credits are not what we would call remedial for CC. Anything in math below Pre Calc/Calc at a CC would be considered remedial.
    ~ IE. When my DS applied, he not only have every AP the school offered (Eng, Lit, Physics, Calc, US Hist., Euro, Govt and French), but was also going to CC part time(18 credits there).
    ~~If they placed him side by side to you for one of those direct appointments, than for his PAR he would have 30+ credits at a higher rigor right out of HS than you after a year in CC if you follow your intended plan.
    ~~ You would need to continue once AD to get that PAR up. At least that is my view, which with $2.07 you can get a small coffee at Starbucks.

    5. As stated none of this can occur until the citizenship aspect is resolved.

    I am just using the data you have given, such as, you are not moving here until sometime next year and you are currently 18.

    Finally, since it is obvious you are not arriving here for many months, what do you plan on doing where you reside now until you move?

    Have you investigated to see if an online college like UMUC or Phoenix will allow you as an international student to take classes now? Unless I am reading your post wrong when you said HS EQUIVALENT accreditation. If you have a HS degree, and do online, the CC will most likely accept all of your online college courses if it comes from an accredited college. Thus, you would enter the CC year with a more rigorous course load.

    Good luck, but I would really suggest opening your eyes now on how there are many paths to commissioning. Have you investigated ROTC scholarship? If you need the full ride for a financial reason, have you investigated colleges that are known to give generous needs base financial aid.

    OBTW, many community colleges have students that are in ROTC. They typically commute to the 4 yr. college nearby. If you are looking for an EC that might help, this could be one.
     
    Dad likes this.
  17. g041rf0rc3

    g041rf0rc3 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2015
    Messages:
    89
    Likes Received:
    7
    Pima,


    Thanks for responding me.

    You’re Always giving us support and posting interesting critical analysis in your comments.


    Ok..Back to topic..


    You’re right.

    I’ll make some small changes in my plan.


    1) Get my PPL in the US(maybe start on February or march 2016)

    There are 3 ‘’flight schools’’ in San Antonio:

    -SKY SAFETY

    -FLIGHT TRAINING

    -ALPHA TANGO FLYING SERVICES


    The theoretical course is not mandatory, so I can start studying for the written test right now!

    I’ll buy books about principles of flight, navigation, meteorology,aircrafts;and other things such as: air navigation protractor, flight computer and air navigation ruler etc

    Ok..that is not too easy to learn, but I’m motivated!


    I must score 70% or better to pass

    ->Flight hours(40):

    Depending on my learning skills, I can finish this step in 21-30 days(if I already have my FAA medical certification of 3rd class or above at this time)


    So FAA PPL equivalent accreditation won’t be a concern for me.


    2) I’ll turn 19 yo on may 23rd, 2016(I get my green card in 2017 and I hope to arrive at the BMT in this same year, get my US citizenship and then apply for LEAD.

    At this time my transcripts and ACT scores will be done to attach this in the AFIMT 1786 and to include in my PCQ

    ->I don't pretend take college courses and/or achieve leadership positions while on duty(This I'll take before enlist)

    3) Once I take the TOEFL and pass, I don’t need to show more proofs that I’m able to understand and learn well the courses subjects.

    So (as you said) instead take the English as second language program, I’ll take courses in English composition, literature and speech (if applicable) .


    In your opinion ,Courses in geometry, trigonometry, algebra etc are too ‘’basics’’ to take in college? What kind of courses may I take? Maybe more’’specific’’ subjects of engineering?


    4) I can’t take online college courses because I’m a senior yet (my HS certificate will be done on December or January – varies according to my school’s administration schedule/calendar, ie., holidays(Christmas and New Year’s Day)(here in my country, the school year starts on February and finish on December).

    5) The most(or,at least, the BEST)scholarships/financial aid are part of federal programs(FAFSA) –as matter of a fact, as a green card holder, I can get it,but at the time my resident status is done- 2017(as I’ve said 10-14 months after start the application)I think that will be too much time waiting for green card before start college ,ie.,I would have to have the green card in my hands b4 enroll at college and then try to get the financial aid (once the GC is required to get the scholarship).
    Luckly my mom will be able to pay for my expenses.

    I pretend take the college courses(one semester to 1 1/2year /30-45 semester hours) while waiting for my green card and - after -while in DEP.



    6)The main difference between ‘’true’’colleges and cc admission requirements(among other factors) in my view is that ‘’true’’ colleges(i.e 4 year-degree programs)have’’rigorous’’academics programs and requires teacher’s Letters of recommendations…

    Here starts the problem…my teachers won’t takes ‘’pleasure’’ in recommend me to study in the US because they would like this for their daughters/sons(believe or not..that happens here)

    My dilemma is:

    Now I think that ‘’true’’ colleges credits(with more rigorous academics programs) are better to take instead cc credits…but HOW enroll at college WITHOUT letters of recommendations?


    7)The’’foreign’’ airmen become US citizens one day b4 the BMT graduation day.

    I send some e-mails to airmen(MSgt, 2nd Lt and Lt Col) and they(all) said that I can apply for LEAD program as soon as I graduate from BMT(I’ll need contact the CAA).

    My concern is:

    I) How to combine my workout program,college courses and extracurricular activities? This is not possible?


    II)How the MPF ACC 05 works?

    The LEAD Handbook said that ‘’availability code will place a hold on any PCS orders until the airman is either offered an appointment or declines an appointment’’

    As far as I know , PCS is AFTER the technical school, so until May of the entry year, I’ll still have to go to tech school anyway?And..If I get an appointment while in tech school?

    Please Correct me if I’m wrong.Maybe I missed something.

    Advices will be welcome
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2015
  18. fencersmother

    fencersmother Founding Member

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2007
    Messages:
    2,580
    Likes Received:
    800
    Oh my.

    I am glad to see you have your future all mapped out, but you might be unaware of several things which could easily delay ALL of the plans: bureaucratic delays are common, expected even, and now, since 9/11, international students in American flight schools have somewhat more scrutiny, so expect even more time to elapse.

    Many LACs and even state schools have several provisions for foreign students. Why are you coming in through the community college avenue?
     
  19. Pima

    Pima Parent

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2007
    Messages:
    12,800
    Likes Received:
    932
    So, you will be 20 before you get your green card, correct? You than intend to start BMT sometime later in 2017 from a time frame aspect. In that case theoretically you will not start USAFA or Prep until 2018 at the earliest, or when you are 21.

    The problem you have yet to understand is that competing even for LEAD is not easy. Our neighbors DS went to Basic right out of HS (July after graduation). This meant he was too late to start the process for the fall. He went to his base (Nellis), and started the process. He had MoC nominations in hand. The shock to his system came from when the Commander called in him for a sit down. The Commander was honest with him and told him that there were 3 other enlisted members also applying. Thus, from a rack and stack system, he would endorse him because he felt he was deserving, but because he had only been there for 6 months, and the others had been there longer, they were now staring down the barrel of age and that meant he would not get the line you want from the Wing King/Queen....my top choice, must send now.
    ~ He went on to continue his education, pumping out a full course load via colleges on base, he choose ERAU. During that year he was deployed and opted not to apply, feeling that he still was young enough. FFWD 1 more yr.. He was now 30 credits away from his college degree. He instead went and applied for OCS. He is now an Officer.

    The point is life gets in the way. You know that old adage...People plan and God laughs, is especially true for the military....God being Big Blue!

    I remember talking to his Mom and Dad (Dad was enlisted that went to OCS) about if he regretted not reapplying. She said yes and no. He would have loved to have had the experience of an SA education, but at 21 he wanted to just get on with his life as an operational officer. He didn't want to wait 4 or 5 more years.

    I am not slamming USAFA. I am just saying if I am doing my math correctly, you could be 22 before you start USAFA or Prep, because of how your timeline is playing out. You are right now 2 years out from gaining citizenship. That is if bureaucracy isn't going to be a wrench in your time line. Govt in our country does not move swiftly...trust me when you get here and go to the DMV you will get what I mean!
    ~ Like Mike said your true step one is citizenship. The dream is great, but until that hurdle is cleared it is a dream/goal.
    ~~ Let's say you don't get it until October 2017. The 1st BMT they can place you in is Dec. 2017. That means reporting for the class of 2022 is a no go. You now have to wait until the class of 2023.

    I know this sounds like Debbie Downer, but I am just saying be prepared before it hits you with the possible twists and turns you will face.

    I find that shocking there are so few flights schools in such a big city. Not disagreeing, just shocking. My only advice on this topic is to try to find a school where the instructors are retired military.
    Have you gone to the website www.collegeconfidential.com? There are many international students asking for guidance on admissions. I do not know if there is a different admissions process for international students than for our kids. Do you? If not than impo, you are spending way too much time on here asking funny questions that has nothing to do with the next 7-8 years of your life (headphones, beer)

    Sure, you can apply, but that is the funny thing about asking questions. You need to ask the right questions too. Can apply and what are my chances directly out of Basic may not be the same when it comes to the answer. I think you are assuming that every airmen applying will get appointed as long as they apply.
    Here is my confusion again. How is it that you will graduate in Dec. and have yet to take any of these courses. I would not call any of those math classes at even a CC as a basic. I would consider them, at least in VA, remedial. Pre Calc and Stats or Quantum would be basics. Calc is where you want to be at when you are trying for USAFA.
    1. Do you know what old timers jokingly call USAFA?
    ~ The Little Engineering School in the Rockies.
    2. Have you taken the time to peruse the mandated curriculum for every cadet. Sure, you can get a degree in Econ, but you still will be taking courses that are engineering oriented. You need that math and science foundation if you want to succeed.
    You are not going to like this answer. If you cannot manage all three of these, I am not sure how competitive you will be when you compare yourself against other candidates.
    ~ Are you saying that you have not juggled all 3 in HS?
    ~~ I get it. There are kids that "wake up" later in life. I am just asking again a question you have yet to answer. What have you done in HS? Right now, the way your posts read are that you took the easy path academically and have nothing on your resume. Have you read the chance me threads for candidates? They make some people that work full time jobs look like slackers! That is your competition in the end.
    ~ What do you think ADAF enlisted life will be like?
    ~~ Not flaming, but asking in honesty.
    No offense, but again you are placing the cart before the horse. I don't know why at this time you think you have a Basic training date, 2 years out, at the very least.
    ~ Nobody in 2012 saw sequestration happening, but it happened a year later. Nobody saw that our govt is now talking about a govt shutdown again, but here we are.

    What if they don't send you to Basic until Dec.? You would not be a candidate at that point. Their books close end of Feb. That means there is a chance they will PCS you because they will not open their books for the next year until June. See above regarding my 1st answer to your quote.

    The one thing everyone that has ever served will tell you is this:
    Timing matters.
    ~ Look at USAFA class of 12. They offered @1650 appointments. After that year group. or maybe it was 13, they dropped to offering @1300-1350 appointments.
    ~~ 20% drop from 1 year to the next. Nothing that these kids born in 1991 could control. It was just timing.
    ~ Look at UPT grads that just winged last month. For 2 years plus, RPA drops were not part of the equation at UPT. Now and for 1 more year, every class at every UPT base, except ENJJPT, will have 2 RPAs drop. Nobody saw that coming, but it did, and it happened very quickly.
    ~ Look at AFROTC. One year it was a 93% selection rate overall, the next it was 58%, and then 90% again. I doubt any of the 58% saw that either.

    I could go on and on, but you get the point. You can't control timing. You are assuming all will hold true. That is great, but again, like we always say here: Have a plan B in place. I am not reading anywhere here that you have a plan B for your future.
    1. Investigating AFROTC as a CC student
    2. Your career desire as an enlisted member
    3. Educational goals (major)

    Again, not being debbie downer, but I feel that I have to be now. I feel like you think that as long as I do this or that from fill the square aspect I will get an appointment and commission out of USAFA and become a pilot. I think you are not looking at the big picture on how hard it is to clear all of these hurdles (squares). There are many HS students that get the TWE, and reapply 1 or 2 more times before getting the BFE. There are many that created an illusion of an SA life, and once there they realize it was not a good fit for them.
    ~ They were able to move forward with their life because they had plan B in place.

    Best of luck, I wish you all of my best hopes and thoughts.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2015
  20. fencersmother

    fencersmother Founding Member

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2007
    Messages:
    2,580
    Likes Received:
    800
    OP, let's get right down to the brass tacks (assuming you actually want our help here):

    What MATH courses have you taken in high school? What scores did you get? What is your SAT/ACT? Frankly, you don't sound like you would qualify for English-as-a-second-language classes, since you seem to have a grasp of the language (see your "outline" of USAFA requirements, your grasp of the differing "to-too-two", your larger vocabulary...

    You seem to be flirting with just cruising through an enlisted AF career which, here's the news, may not happen! Your superiors may recognize your plan from the beginning and take offense that you were not there to serve the needs of the AF, but to serve the desires of YOU. This doesn't always sit well, as you can imagine.

    What country are you from? Why are you so willing to give up that citizenship?

    Why did you not take standard classes: Algebra, Geometry, Trig, etc, in your high school curriculum?
     

Share This Page