My son got the principle nomination from his State's Senator, but got rejected by the Naval Academy

[pknguyen44]

In the end, I think that is the only reality and answer. For an 18 year old, kid, that works. For a 50 year old professional, with a couple of degrees, who spent 10 years in the military and still has a lot of ties to it, and has accountability on her shoulders everyday, I feel that somewhere out there is someone with answers. Is it appropriate to contact admissions, or to leave well enough alone.

It's part of the admissions game really. I've met plenty of people who did ROTC after getting rejected from USNA with 4.0 gpa's, near perfect SAT scores, and potential to succeed at USNA. But no one truly knows what goes on behind that door in the admissions office unless you sit on the board, sometimes they take chances on individuals who don't really meet those academic/physical standards because they believe in that person (thank god or else idk where I would be). Best of luck for next year!

 

[proutsneck2000]

In the end, I think that is the only reality and answer. For an 18 year old, kid, that works. For a 50 year old professional, with a couple of degrees, who spent 10 years in the military and still has a lot of ties to it, and has accountability on her shoulders everyday, I feel that somewhere out there is someone with answers. Is it appropriate to contact admissions, or to leave well enough alone.

It's part of the admissions game really. I've met plenty of people who did ROTC after getting rejected from USNA with 4.0 gpa's, near perfect SAT scores, and potential to succeed at USNA. But no one truly knows what goes on behind that door in the admissions office unless you sit on the board, sometimes they take chances on individuals who don't really meet those academic/physical standards because they believe in that person (thank god or else idk where I would be). Best of luck for next year!

Thank you for the advice and insight. Good luck in your career.

 

[reh16]

Thank you so much for your straight response. That is the path we are taking. He is in fact scheduled to retake the SAT. He is also enrolled in a college that supports the type of academics the NA looks for. The frustration is that so many of the "right" people said it was practically guaranteed, unless he did something to get disqualified. He is a model student and great young man, who works hard. When I say "right", I mean experienced with this process.

My son has a great attitude and perseverence. He is ready to go to college this upcoming fall and try again. He really believes in the Naval Academy and all it represents.

I on the other hand, have questions and feel that I deserve some answers, especially if there are other candidates with lower scores accepted and attending. I am reaching out here, because I really don't know who or what to ask. That leaves me asking what is on my mind, at the end of the day. I don't want to step on anybody's toes. I am not sure if there is an appropriate way or place to ask the questions or if the mindset is to not question anything, but accept and move on and try again next year.

Hey there, last year I was a principal nominee and to my surprise received a rejection letter. Apparently it is becoming more common. But never fear! I just got my appointment last week. If he truly is aspiring to go then he will make it. Best of luck. Message with any questions!

 

[proutsneck2000]

Thank you so much for your straight response. That is the path we are taking. He is in fact scheduled to retake the SAT. He is also enrolled in a college that supports the type of academics the NA looks for. The frustration is that so many of the "right" people said it was practically guaranteed, unless he did something to get disqualified. He is a model student and great young man, who works hard. When I say "right", I mean experienced with this process.

My son has a great attitude and perseverence. He is ready to go to college this upcoming fall and try again. He really believes in the Naval Academy and all it represents.

I on the other hand, have questions and feel that I deserve some answers, especially if there are other candidates with lower scores accepted and attending. I am reaching out here, because I really don't know who or what to ask. That leaves me asking what is on my mind, at the end of the day. I don't want to step on anybody's toes. I am not sure if there is an appropriate way or place to ask the questions or if the mindset is to not question anything, but accept and move on and try again next year.

Hey there, last year I was a principal nominee and to my surprise received a rejection letter. Apparently it is becoming more common. But never fear! I just got my appointment last week. If he truly is aspiring to go then he will make it. Best of luck. Message with any questions!

Thanks and we will.

 

[TV4caster]

I too am sorry about your experience and wish you and your son the best.

IMO, there should be a minimum standard and it should be applicable to everyone. In looking at the class profile it shows the 25th percentile for SAT scores at 1230. Typically the lowest quartile at most colleges tends to be overrepresented with students with "hooks" of some kind.

Personally, I think that if they make exceptions to their stated minimums (eg 1300 SAT) for some students, then they should make them for Principal Nominees.

 

[cb7893]

prout,

On many levels, I'm sorry for your DS's disappointment. I can certainly understand your desire to "get to the bottom this."

I am struck most by cavalier vibe and assurances given your DS, knowing that his SAT scores were so low--yes they are low--and knowing how competitive the Academies are. Someone should have flagged the disconnect between and 1130 SAT and a 4.0 GPA. Even more, there should have been a tip off, like low PSAT or earlier SAT sittings. As someone stated earlier, those spots in the lowest 25 percentile are reserved for special cases and I won't speculate on what constitutes a special case other than to say that recruited athlete would fall in that category.

If DS's desire is to try again next year, the standardized tests (ACT or SAT), treated a separate school subject altogether.

Both my DS's did well on the Math SAT, but had problems with Verbal. We used a private tutor for each, for 4-6 hours. He was a law student. BTW, we didn't pay the tutor to watch them take the tests. He taught them the techniques which they employed while taking the practice tests at home. He then analyzed the results with them looking for consistent weaknesses, most of which were correctable.

In both sons' cases, it was intimidation by and dislike of the Verbal section feeding off of each other. Once they learned the "tricks", it became more of a game. There are general strategies for test taking, but also tactics for standardized tests. The SAT and ACT even have their own individual peculiarities. There is a specific way to read each question. There are tricks and tactics which allow you to eliminate answers almost without reading the question. The tactics are few and they are simple. Learn the skills and then employ them with practice tests. After doing that, he will walk into the test looser and with greater confidence.

Whatever he does, don't simply grind through endless practice tests. He'll only frustrate himself. The best athletes arrive at the game with confidence based on an attention to detail during practices which he/she made meaningful.

I have no doubt that if your DS has a 4.0 and AP classes in Math, Science and Lang/Lit under his belt, he can raise his scores considerably.

 

[93Sir]

Thank you so much for your straight response. That is the path we are taking. He is in fact scheduled to retake the SAT. He is also enrolled in a college that supports the type of academics the NA looks for. The frustration is that so many of the "right" people said it was practically guaranteed, unless he did something to get disqualified. He is a model student and great young man, who works hard. When I say "right", I mean experienced with this process.

My son has a great attitude and perseverence. He is ready to go to college this upcoming fall and try again. He really believes in the Naval Academy and all it represents.

I on the other hand, have questions and feel that I deserve some answers, especially if there are other candidates with lower scores accepted and attending. I am reaching out here, because I really don't know who or what to ask. That leaves me asking what is on my mind, at the end of the day. I don't want to step on anybody's toes. I am not sure if there is an appropriate way or place to ask the questions or if the mindset is to not question anything, but accept and move on and try again next year.

I'm surprised he wasn't offered NAPS as that is what it's in place for. Maybe your BGO could pull that string but not sure.

 

[PoppapH]

I want to thank you for all of your comments tonight. We got the news on Friday afternoon and have been going through next steps. It helps me stay focused, tomorrow, when I go back to work and not ponder about what I should do or could do. Your feedback was appreciated.

What bugs me a bit here is...I don't see how they can tell you that DS needed an SAT of 1300, unless maybe with the algorithm they use, he needed a 1300 to reach a theoretical magic number...

But then they could have said he needed a higher GPA...or a higher class rank. I know that if they didn't give you ANY kind of feedback, I/you would be frustrated also. Is there any way to really know what they could improve on...next year it could all be easier or harder depending on the candidates.

I was frustrated by DS receiving 2 letters from senators saying that "he had already gotten a nom so they were spreading the wealth" and then hear that there were candidates in the state with multiple noms. Don't say they want to "spread the wealth" and then provide multiple noms for certain candidates. Don't mistake me here...I am all for a candidate getting multiple noms, in fact that is the way it should be. The ones that deserve it should get it, the pool should not be softened by spreading the wealth....

 

[proutsneck2000]

prout,

On many levels, I'm sorry for your DS's disappointment. I can certainly understand your desire to "get to the bottom this."

I am struck most by cavalier vibe and assurances given your DS, knowing that his SAT scores were so low--yes they are low--and knowing how competitive the Academies are. Someone should have flagged the disconnect between and 1130 SAT and a 4.0 GPA. Even more, there should have been a tip off, like low PSAT or earlier SAT sittings. As someone stated earlier, those spots in the lowest 25 percentile are reserved for special cases and I won't speculate on what constitutes a special case other than to say that recruited athlete would fall in that category.

If DS's desire is to try again next year, the standardized tests (ACT or SAT), treated a separate school subject altogether.

Both my DS's did well on the Math SAT, but had problems with Verbal. We used a private tutor for each, for 4-6 hours. He was a law student. BTW, we didn't pay the tutor to watch them take the tests. He taught them the techniques which they employed while taking the practice tests at home. He then analyzed the results with them looking for consistent weaknesses, most of which were correctable.

In both sons' cases, it was intimidation by and dislike of the Verbal section feeding off of each other. Once they learned the "tricks", it became more of a game. There are general strategies for test taking, but also tactics for standardized tests. The SAT and ACT even have their own individual peculiarities. There is a specific way to read each question. There are tricks and tactics which allow you to eliminate answers almost without reading the question. The tactics are few and they are simple. Learn the skills and then employ them with practice tests. After doing that, he will walk into the test looser and with greater confidence.

Whatever he does, don't simply grind through endless practice tests. He'll only frustrate himself. The best athletes arrive at the game with confidence based on an attention to detail during practices which he/she made meaningful.

I have no doubt that if your DS has a 4.0 and AP classes in Math, Science and Lang/Lit under his belt, he can raise his scores considerably.

Thank you for your wise and experienced response. Like I said, it is really nice hearing from people who truly are in the know, either from their own experiences, or just knowing. I will certainly try to find a way to get him to revisit the SAT scores differently.

 

[dvnkmmy]

Thank you for your wise and experienced response. Like I said, it is really nice hearing from people who truly are in the know, either from their own experiences, or just knowing. I will certainly try to find a way to get him to revisit the SAT scores differently.

Not only should you take the SAT but try taking the SAT. I am a college applicant this year. I also had a low SAT score, a 1210 on the 1600 scale; however, I took the ACT and got a composite score of 32. 29 on Math and a 32 in Reading. It may not make a difference to some people, though its worth a shot.

I have also met people who received higher scores on the ACT than the SAT. Again, it is worth a shot to take it.

Good luck!!

 

[usna1985]

I'm surprised he wasn't offered NAPS as that is what it's in place for. Maybe your BGO could pull that string but not sure.

Fortunately or unfortunately, BGOs don't have anywhere near that kind of clout or influence on the Admissions process. If your BGO wants to know "why" someone wasn't offered NAPS/Foundation, he/she has to call up the RD and ask, just as you do.

As for getting multiple noms . . . in some areas it's possible, even likely. In other areas, rare or impossible. The SAs are aware of how this works. I realize that it gives some candidates more slates to "win," but that's the way the law is written -- USNA didn't write it, Congress did. In the end, if USNA really wants a candidate who doesn't win his/her slate, that person will be selected out of the National Pool.

 

[vamom]

I've not been on this forum for a while, but upon seeing this thread, thought I would comment. Three years ago,our congressman awarded his Prin Nom to a college freshman who was in ROTC, as was his practice. When the 2nd semester college grades were released, the cadet no longer met the minimum reqs. His nom was pulled and another cadet was placed in the prin nom position. No negotiation or discussion.

 

[suddensam]

I on the other hand, have questions and feel that I deserve some answers, especially if there are other candidates with lower scores accepted and attending. I am reaching out here, because I really don't know who or what to ask.

Did you reach out to your BGO? S/he is the local representative of the Candidate Guidance Office and should be able to answer your questions. There are several other BGOs on these forums, including me, who could help. But it is probably more appropriate to reach out to your assigned BGO.

One of the posters above said it well:

Unfortunately, you can't really compare to others that have been accepted because there are so many variables. The candidates who had the same SAT scores may be coming from an under-represented area of the country, or they may have other attributes that the Academy may be looking for.

I would also add that subjective assessments, e.g., teacher recommendations, do play a part. I had one promising candidate this cycle who received two very mediocre recommendations from his teachers (they both contacted me). He was ultimately not found to be Board Qualified.

 

[nodiva]

The USNA super scores only 2 of the ACT tests: English and Math (not Reading as indicated above). I highly recommend your DS take the ACT.

 

[kent2015]

While on the topic of principal noms, does the same theory of the "next in line" so to speak on the congressional slate get appointed if a principal nom turns his/her appointment down? As mentioned by an above poster this is true for Principal noms who aren't found 3Q'd, just curious if it applies for those Principal noms who get appointed and choose to go elsewhere for college.



(PS I totally recognize that in the end it does not matter, and I will hear back eventually, but while I'm waiting this is an amusing question)

 

[proutsneck2000]

Thank you again for all of your feedback. It really helps to be able to talk to people who have either the experience with the process, the experience with not making it, and the experience of trying again. It has all been very positive. I am not one to keep things bottled up and suffer in silence and feel like you all answered my questions.

As far as the BGO, I got the impression from my son that it would be very inappropriate for me, the parent to reach out. He is following up. I would love to talk to him, but I do have to respect my DS's position with this, as he has done his research too.

 

[kinnem]

Thank you again for all of your feedback. It really helps to be able to talk to people who have either the experience with the process, the experience with not making it, and the experience of trying again. It has all been very positive. I am not one to keep things bottled up and suffer in silence and feel like you all answered my questions.

As far as the BGO, I got the impression from my son that it would be very inappropriate for me, the parent to reach out. He is following up. I would love to talk to him, but I do have to respect my DS's position with this, as he has done his research too.

Your son is correct. It is inappropriate for you for you to contact him or her.

 

[pknguyen44]

Your son is correct. It is inappropriate for you for you to contact him or her.

Concur, let him take care of it all. It'll show the BGO that he's committed to it and taking the lead to make things happen. Same goes if he decides to call RD.

 

[payitforward]

Concur, let him take care of it all. It'll show the BGO that he's committed to it and taking the lead to make things happen. Same goes if he decides to call RD.

What's worse is that if YOU call, it looks like you're taking the lead on this instead of him. It's his life, his future, his career. If he wants this bad enough he's the one who'll do the calling.

 

[proutsneck2000]

Thank you for the information. I never even thought about calling, until I saw all the posts that suggested to do so. My son made it clear, that everything in this process had to be done by him, and it was. He would always talk to us afterwards about what had happened and how he felt he did. We totally have relied on his feedback in this whole process. By the way, really liked the SAT strategy approach comments, since he is smart and a great student, just not so strong on his standardized tests, right now. I talked to him about getting a tutor and doing something different, then he had in the past. Some of my friends at work have helped me find something that is good for learning the strategies and tricks for taking the SAT's. I am wondering how the scores are going to be different for qualification, when they roll out the new SAT's next year (this coming up school year). Any insight into the new SAT's and what the scores might have to look like?