National Defense Service Ribbon

Discussion in 'Military Academy - USMA' started by Pkirk618, Aug 28, 2013.

  1. Pkirk618

    Pkirk618 Retired Army

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2012
    Messages:
    63
    Likes Received:
    0
    I was watching the ring ceremony and pictures thereafter. Some of the cadets were not wearing their NDSM and I began wondering, when are they are (officially) awarded these to begin with? Not to mention, when did it become optional for some of cadets to wear or not wear their decorations? :) Unless it's like Class B optional....but I don't think so.

    I remember sporting my ASR with pride :)

    Cadet input? Anyone?
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2013
  2. BigBear

    BigBear Class of 2015

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    699
    Likes Received:
    1
    If someone isn't wearing it, it's probably because they didn't feel like buying the ribbon. Last year, the TAC teams gave them out to all the Plebes at Plebe Parent Weekend, but I'm pretty sure we qualify to wear the NDSM as soon as we complete CBT.

    Another reason some people don't wear it is because we really don't do much defending. We go to school.
     
  3. MemberLG

    MemberLG Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2011
    Messages:
    2,807
    Likes Received:
    444
    It's optional.

    AR 670-1

    29–2. Authorization
    a. Commanders may require the wear of awards on the following occasions.
    (1) Parades, reviews, inspections, and funerals.
    (2) Ceremonial and social occasions.
    b. Awards are worn at the option of the wearer when not prohibited during normal duty hours. Personnel also may
    wear awards on appropriate uniforms when off duty (see para 29–4, below). Personnel are encouraged to wear
    authorized awards on the service, dress, and mess uniforms.
    c. Soldiers may wear awards on the class B uniform during duty hours and when off duty, at their option.
     
  4. Pkirk618

    Pkirk618 Retired Army

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2012
    Messages:
    63
    Likes Received:
    0
    I know the reg. This occasion seemed to fit the bill for awards as not optional if your SI, commandant is wearing theirs. It's probably not optional for this ceremony.

    And the ndsm is issued to soldiers, fighting or not You earn it, (in support of) you wear it. Or, you're out of uniform when its mandatory. Im reading the commanders intent as such for this occasion. Besides, senior cadets should feel the need to be uniform across all ranks.

    Enough about that....so plebes should have theirs already?
     
  5. WIT84

    WIT84 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2012
    Messages:
    92
    Likes Received:
    0
    Are ROTC cadets eligible to receive the ribbon as well? How about recently commissioned ROTC 2LTs?
     
  6. BigBear

    BigBear Class of 2015

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    699
    Likes Received:
    1
    No, they won't get them until the Spring (at PPW).
     
  7. lotrjedi13

    lotrjedi13 _

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2008
    Messages:
    203
    Likes Received:
    2
    By USMA regs, wear of awards is required on PT, ACU, Dress Gray, White over Gray, and Full Dress uniforms.

    Practically, though, the reg is little enforced, out of a combination of:
    - not wanting to seem arrogant
    - the hassle of tracking down ribbons/awards
    - the extra 5 minutes it takes to switch awards between uniforms.
     
  8. scoutpilot

    scoutpilot Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2010
    Messages:
    4,275
    Likes Received:
    607
    ROTC cadets are not. 2LTs are.
     
  9. LineInTheSand

    LineInTheSand USCGA 2006

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2007
    Messages:
    8,755
    Likes Received:
    1,004
    It must be hard to track down a ribbon or two. And if it's taking 5 mins to switch awards between uniforms.... someone maybe in need of remedial award switching...
     
  10. Jcleppe

    Jcleppe Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2010
    Messages:
    5,541
    Likes Received:
    842
    The only ROTC Cadets that are allowed to wear the NDSM are those that are SMP cadets and have completed both BCT and AIT. Green to Gold cadets also wear the ribbons they have earned while enlisted.

    As Scout said, all other ROTC cadets do not wear any service ribbons other then those given by ROTC.
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2013
  11. MemberLG

    MemberLG Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2011
    Messages:
    2,807
    Likes Received:
    444
    I am sure you experienced it before your retired - the "new" Army, where things we took as the normal in our earlier days are not.
     
  12. MemberLG

    MemberLG Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2011
    Messages:
    2,807
    Likes Received:
    444
    If the reg is not enforced, it's a failure of leadership or another sign the Corps has (kidding about the Corps has part). I think my class was one of the first class in recent history to get NDSM for serving during the time of first Gulf War. Most of my classmates didn't wear NDSM.

    Does in ranks inspection still happen? If so why are awards on uniform not checked?

    To side track, do cadets still get the Recondo badge after completing CFT? I think it started back up with my class, most of my class didn't want to wear it as the requirement was to just finish CFT to get it.
     
  13. BillSL

    BillSL USMA Class of 2016

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2011
    Messages:
    910
    Likes Received:
    1
    Yes, but there are standards that must be met (I think everyone is required to complete all Recondo events - at least my company was - but you need to perform at a certain level to get the Recondo badge).
     
  14. BigBear

    BigBear Class of 2015

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    699
    Likes Received:
    1
    We still have in-ranks, but the uniform is Full Dress under arms (parade uniform) so no awards
     
  15. Aglahad

    Aglahad Member

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2011
    Messages:
    1,234
    Likes Received:
    5
    For ROTC:

    NDSM: After commissioning
    ASR: After BOLC
    GWOT: After BOLC? Really confusing regs on this one some BOLCs give it out to new grads others don't
     
  16. WIT84

    WIT84 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2012
    Messages:
    92
    Likes Received:
    0
    Appreciate the responses, will pass along to DD.
     
  17. scoutpilot

    scoutpilot Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2010
    Messages:
    4,275
    Likes Received:
    607
    Schooled.

    But what about haircut inspection?
     
  18. Pkirk618

    Pkirk618 Retired Army

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2012
    Messages:
    63
    Likes Received:
    0
    Speaking of haircuts, I had to tell my own kid to get himself a haircut. I literally inspect him over video chat. When I saw him on A day, his belt buckle looked oxidized and looked like it was slapped around his waist. I know he had to get passed all kinds of cadets, officers and NCOs before getting to me and I was slightly put off. Eh, I know they are in school and stuff like this might take more of a back seat but checking yourself and soldiers needs to be conditioned as part the daily routine. When you look good, you feel good and it becomes contagious. What I see are simple corrections that need attention. I used to tell my soldiers, "if you pass a correction, you just set a new standard".

    So with regards to this award, I say wear it--whenever you can. Pride, regardless of reason will infect others positively. Half the awards many of us wear are not always for personal achievements. But I bet when you all have a few, you'll take the time to throw on the NDSR in all its glory.

    Respect yourselves enough to positively influence your soldiers. They'll thank you for it later.

    As for my son, he is on top of things---he better be!
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2013
  19. BigBear

    BigBear Class of 2015

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2011
    Messages:
    699
    Likes Received:
    1
    we wear as for class or ACU's for haircut inspections (they are right before breakfast/class). I don't know what the reg is for ndsm with as for class, but I have never seen it done.
     
  20. jake s

    jake s USMA Cadet

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2009
    Messages:
    325
    Likes Received:
    0
    USCC 670-1 mandates all awards worn on ACU's, White over Gray, Dress Gray, Full Dress, and India Whites. No awards for Parades or while in the field. Awards on PT's and As For Class are optional (no one wears anything on PT's anymore and priors occasionally wear their unit insignia on AFC but that's it).

    I think if you go back roughly 10 years people used to wear awards on AFC, but now it's more in line with the ASU "Class B" policy for simplicity's sake.
     

Share This Page