nomination question

LineInTheSand said:
No, no, by all means, flash that credential.

1. They are having an outlook, and the outlook for some is "Congressional nominations are dumb." The Coast Guard has had to fight off the push for CGA to have nominations multiple times. Google it. There was on such push in the past few years. I would venture to guess, USMA, USNA, USMMA and USAFA aren't the proponents of Congressional nominations, but they do have to "deal" with it.
2. You want me to hail the congressional nomination process and I won't. There was once an assistant principal at my high school who would actually list his West Point congressional nomination in his bio. Did he get in? No. Everyone who is offered an appointment has a nomination. There are many nominees who are never accepted. I appreciated the process, but please, let's not give it more weight than it deserves.
3. Nominees aren't deserving of anything but a sheet of paper saying you're a nominee. People with appointments aren't any less "deserving" at an academy that requires a nominations than people at CGA, BUT I do think the nomination process doesn't allow the total number of great applications to have a chance to compete for a spot. Basically, I think competition is fiercer when Congress isn't involved.
4. I agree. So I wonder why you had an entire post just attacking mine.
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1) There's 436 congressional districts and another 100 Senators and only 200-250 appointees for USCGA? It just wouldn't add up.
2)No. I did not ask you to do anything. The last I heard of hail, it reminds me of an awkward salute to a leader with a short mustache.
3)As I said, the application process is not perfect. It may very well be but the way it's set up is what we have to contend with. The guidelines and requirements are laid out, anyone who is qualified may apply. Not everyone gets in. If it ever comes up for revision, maybe they can device a better way?
4)By no means was it an attack but an attempt of a rebuttal. If your argument is so strong-then, I may change my position and learn.

Once again, I won't stoop to your level and flash my credential nor rank. I may very well be a lowly taxpayer, nothing more.
 
sheriff3 said:
Just curious.. Why does it require a nomination to get into USMMA and not USCGA?
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to respond to the OP's original question, I recall reading that the reason is simply that the CGA was established in 1790(?), about 50 or 60 years prior to USMA and the Naval Academy, and about 150-160 years before the AFA and the MMA. In 1790 Congress had simply not gotten their act together enough to think to impose the nomination thing. Later (and this is a thread throughout US history) regional differences, partisanship, and even 'pork' made nominations part of the nascent academy process.
It seems to me the real 'act of God' is in the fact that any subsequent notions to add the nomination to CGA that bubble up from time to time seem to be non-starters. That I can not fathom outside of divine intervention.
 
JMS said:
to respond to the OP's original question, I recall reading that the reason is simply that the CGA was established in 1790(?), about 50 or 60 years prior to USMA and the Naval Academy, and about 150-160 years before the AFA and the MMA. In 1790 Congress had simply not gotten their act together enough to think to impose the nomination thing. Later (and this is a thread throughout US history) regional differences, partisanship, and even 'pork' made nominations part of the nascent academy process.
It seems to me the real 'act of God' is in the fact that any subsequent notions to add the nomination to CGA that bubble up from time to time seem to be non-starters. That I can not fathom outside of divine intervention.
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Try 1876 as the Revenue Cutter School of instruction, about 100 years too early on that date... :shake:
 
burnerafter16 said:
Once again, I won't stoop to your level and flash my credential nor rank. I may very well be a lowly taxpayer, nothing more.
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Lucky for you... we're all taxpayers here. some of us (not me, not anymore) just get our money from taxpayers too.
 
USCGA13STN said:
Try 1876 as the Revenue Cutter School of instruction, about 100 years too early on that date... :shake:
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So true. And note, my icon is the crest of the "School of Instruction United States Revenue Cutter Service." It's from a 1908 Tide Rips I found on ebay. Couldn't get much closer to the present day "United States Coast Guard Academy" crest, but you'll notice the crest now has "1876" on the open book.
 
JMS said:
to respond to the OP's original question, I recall reading that the reason is simply that the CGA was established in 1790(?), about 50 or 60 years prior to USMA and the Naval Academy, and about 150-160 years before the AFA and the MMA. In 1790 Congress had simply not gotten their act together enough to think to impose the nomination thing. Later (and this is a thread throughout US history) regional differences, partisanship, and even 'pork' made nominations part of the nascent academy process.
It seems to me the real 'act of God' is in the fact that any subsequent notions to add the nomination to CGA that bubble up from time to time seem to be non-starters. That I can not fathom outside of divine intervention.
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Luigi had an interesting comment on the USMMA thread, that Congress wanted to avoid the appearance of selecting the revenue officers (of the U.S. Revenue Cutter Service, which would one day become the U.S. Coast Guard) charged with enforcing the laws, by the very folks passing the laws.

Maybe! I don't know. I hadn't read that, but could be.
 
This is an interesting thread. I often wondered why the Coast Guard Academy did not participate in the Congressional nomination process.

Just looking around I found this on the internet :


1876-1883 – Capt. John A. Henriques
A New London, Connecticut, native, Henriques (b. 1826, d. 1906) was selected to run the first cadet training ships, the Dobbin and the Chase, and served as the Superintendent of the Revenue Cutter School of Instruction until 1883.

"Unlike the other service academies, admission to the USCGA is solely based upon merit and does not require a congressional nomination. This is due to the fervent objections of Captain John A. Henriques, the first Superintendent of the Revenue Cutter School of Instruction (later the Revenue Cutter Academy). His objection stemmed from years of poor political appointments in the U.S. Revenue Cutter Service's Bureaucracy. Since his objections, it has been the policy of the academy to base all appointments solely on the merits of the applicants."
 
Sandbar said:
This is an interesting thread. I often wondered why the Coast Guard Academy did not participate in the Congressional nomination process.

Just looking around I found this on the internet :


1876-1883 – Capt. John A. Henriques
A New London, Connecticut, native, Henriques (b. 1826, d. 1906) was selected to run the first cadet training ships, the Dobbin and the Chase, and served as the Superintendent of the Revenue Cutter School of Instruction until 1883.

"Unlike the other service academies, admission to the USCGA is solely based upon merit and does not require a congressional nomination. This is due to the fervent objections of Captain John A. Henriques, the first Superintendent of the Revenue Cutter School of Instruction (later the Revenue Cutter Academy). His objection stemmed from years of poor political appointments in the U.S. Revenue Cutter Service's Bureaucracy. Since his objections, it has been the policy of the academy to base all appointments solely on the merits of the applicants."
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An interesting perspective, do you mind if I ask, can I see your source for that quote?
 
You know, that does sounds vaguely familiar.

The Henriques Room in Hamilton Hall was once a library, but now a slightly scary place (as far as I'm concerned). I've watched a pretty major mast and an Article 32 hearing there.
 
LineInTheSand said:
You know, that does sounds vaguely familiar.

The Henriques Room in Hamilton Hall was once a library, but now a slightly scary place (as far as I'm concerned). I've watched a pretty major mast and an Article 32 hearing there.
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My best friend got disenrolled during a mast in the Henriques room.

Not to mention it's where the Honor Board convenes... that's fun... -_-
 
Wikipedia is your friend. I was just looking at that and was going to post it myself. Under the USCGA entry. There are no refs for the Captain's objections, but it seems to have held ever since. The last line in the above quote is not in the Wikipedia entry, so maybe that is from another source.
 
USCGA13STN said:
My best friend got disenrolled during a mast in the Henriques room.

Not to mention it's where the Honor Board convenes... that's fun... -_-
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It's where a lot of our friends have been disenrolled. And it is where Honor Trainings are held during Swab Summer.
 
Oh, please tell me Iceman is a friend of yours and 2018 isn't the year he/she hopes to do something important!
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We really need to add a like button to the forum. :thumb:

Iceman, what exactly are your credentials again? Oh right, you're still in high school. I don't see anyone making snide comments with respect to your posts (this post being an exception). So what gives you the right to do that to anyone else? I mean, was "BFD" really necessary?

I know STN here at the Academy and he stated that not to brag or to seem as though he was better than others, but to show where he may draw his opinions from. Trust me when I say that most cadets do not think themselves better or more qualified than anyone else.

Anyway, this is one of those topics that can be debated forever and the only people who truly know the reason why are in DC. And we all know how forthcoming they are. Personally, USCGA appealed to me because it didn't require a nomination to be considered. The idea of everyone having an equal chance at an appointment was ideal. It is one of those things that is just different. Personally, it doesn't make sense to me that USMMA also requires a nomination as it is the same size as CGA and, as someone pointed out previously, the number of districts and representatives greatly outnumbers the allotted enrollment for one class.
 
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LineInTheSand said:
Oh, please tell me Iceman is a friend of yours and 2018 isn't the year he/she hopes to do something important!
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I must unfortunately inform you LITS that I do not know an iceman, but it's nice to know that he thinks that I'm such a Big Deal! :shake:

I'm not sure who's he's with but I for one will gladly state that :stupid1:next time I see him!

And LITS, by the way, I just read your letter to the editor. It was priceless.
 
It seemed pretentious to berate a civilian poster and flash rank but it was in poor taste to say that "you're a big deal". It seemed hilarious at the time. My bad.
I congratulate you and your fellow C1Cs on your upcoming graduation and commission.:groupwave:

r2d2-beep.jpg
 
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iceman2018 said:
It seemed pretentious to berate a civilian poster and flash rank but it was in poor taste to say that "you're a big deal". It seemed hilarious at the time. My bad.
I congratulate you and your fellow C1Cs on your upcoming graduation and commission.:groupwave:

r2d2-beep.jpg
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C1C isn't what they're called at CGA.

It wasn't pretentious... it establishes some credibility. Believe me, cadets don't "flash rank."

Your reaction "BFD" reminded me of one of my trips home. I went to play paintball with a friend of mine from high school. While we were there a snotty little kid decided he wanted to talk about how much better... I don't know, the Air Force, or the Marine Corps was. I listened for awhile, but all I could think is... buddy, you're not even close to any of those things.

From everything I can tell, Iceman, you're not a cadet. You're not an officer. And I guess you're not a veteran. You're not active duty. You're not reserves. You're not guard. You're not even a parent of any of these.

You're window shopping.

So instead of claiming "BFD", or "I'm with stupid." you should probably just hope, at some point, you're able to be "with stupid." Because, right now you're not. You haven't even earned the right to be "with stupid."

Is that harsh? Maybe. But you don't want to be that snotty nosed brat playing paintball.

Hopefully you become a "BFD" too.

When I was a junior or senior in high school I had the chance to talk to a 3/c cadet from the Coast Guard Academy. The guy answered my questions. He wasn't the coolest person in the world, in fact many of his classmates didn't like him (I would one day find out), but he took the time to talk to me, in uniform, while he was on spring break. Was he a BFD? Nope. He was only a 3/c. But to me, at that time, he was a BFD, because he was somewhere and something I wanted to be.

Down the road, maybe a 3/c didn't seem like a BFD. But when you are where you are Iceman, any cadet or midshipman talking to you better come off as a BFD to you.
 
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