Obama reviewing ban on photos of coffins

Ah, you're probably right. I'm sure that the fallen service members want to be USED by the media to further liberal media bias.
 
oldgrad said:
And to jump in and answer LITS question to JAM, I think TV coverage would be the last of my concerns at the time. Again, I feel Congressman Jones has a point. It could be looked on as the nation paying it's respects to a fallen comrade.
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If it ever takes on a "respectful" tone, you let me know. If you listened to the question by the reporter at the briefing who brought this up....there wasn't much respect in his voice.
 
You've got to love when statements like; "The American people have a Right To See". How many times has the constitution and "Rights" been used as a loophole for an agenda that has nothing to do with preserving rights or the benefit of the citizens. In the news media world, it's a dog eat dog world. The media doesn't care 1 bit about the fallen soldiers, their families, or even the war itself. They just want to be the one that breaks a story or has some exclusive. It make them more popular in their business and gives them more notoriety and fame. What about news media who have taken pictures of dead people at an automobile accident. Yea, that's really tasteful.
 
I am going with LITS

Here's my question ...how many of you have stood by the grieving member...how many of you have had the immediate reaction to crawl into the arm pit of your mate and scream while the thunder is over your head...how many of you have actually had your body jolt in shock from the 21.

I have been there ...done that...and raised a toast to them.

When it is your loved one, IT IS PERSONAL, IT IS PRIVATE...They gave their life, the least we can do is allow them to mourn in their own way. IF they want the media they can call them...your parent, spouse, child dies wouldn't you just want some privacy.

They were protecting the rights of the media, give somme common courtesy

Side note..let's see how far this goes when Obama places a troop surge in Afghanistan...i.e. Bush's Iraq...will he want the media to be given access, b/c that will be his watch.

Respect the fallen soldiers families let them mourn privately for giving their life in the honor of our country.

SJAFB is in Jones district, I sold a home to his staff member, he is very admirable, but I believe his true belief of this act is to only have accredited photogs, it would not be opened to everyone.
 
Christcorp said:
How many times has the constitution and "Rights" been used as a loophole for an agenda that has nothing to do with preserving rights or the benefit of the citizens.
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I'll exit the thread here. :eek:

Any time the rights of citizens under the Constitution are described as "loopholes" is a good chance for everyone to see that every side has an agenda.

:thumb:
 
Luigi59 said:
I'll exit the thread here. :eek:

Any time the rights of citizens under the Constitution are described as "loopholes" is a good chance for everyone to see that every side has an agenda.

:thumb:
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I never said that constitutional rights were loopholes. I said that sometimes rights are USED as loopholes. In other words, the media has a tendency to use their right of freedom of speech for their own agenda and not for the purpose of informing the people of news. They most definitely have the right to do so, but it shows a lack of professionalism or integrity.
 
Again, this thread has veered off topic. A chance to bash the media instead of discussing the issue at hand. We cannot have it both ways. We bemoan the fact that the civilian world does not understand the military, does not understand the sacrifices we make. Yet when a suggestion is put forward which would exemplify this in the most poignant manner, we attempt to shoot both those who propose it and those who implement it.

If you feel that the American public would allow the media to accomplish this in a disrespectful manner, perhaps we aren't worth fighting for.
 
The ISSUE at hand is the MEDIA'S access to fallen service members caskets. The discussions are on topic Oldgrad.
 
I think a good compromise would be if the names of the deceased was made available to the media; which it is; then they can contact the family members and ask if it would be permissible for them to film/take pictures of the arrival/ceremony of the returning caskets. Basically, if it's OK with the family, then it would be OK. If not; even by 1 family; then the answer would be no. The family should have final say. Not the media or anyone else. Not even the REST of the American Public.
 
oldgrad said:
Again, this thread has veered off topic. A chance to bash the media instead of discussing the issue at hand. We cannot have it both ways. We bemoan the fact that the civilian world does not understand the military, does not understand the sacrifices we make. Yet when a suggestion is put forward which would exemplify this in the most poignant manner, we attempt to shoot both those who propose it and those who implement it.

If you feel that the American public would allow the media to accomplish this in a disrespectful manner, perhaps we aren't worth fighting for.
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I want to assume you do, at some times, tune into the media. If you don't think we, the public, "allow" the media to show them in a disrespectful manner already, I would suggest watching some more TV, turning to a Gen Betray-Us reduced rate "advertisment" or follow the coverage by some major news agencies. I would also recommend you talk to those currently serving.
 
Okay guys - Thanks to everyone who posted a thoughtful response.
First, I have mixed feelings and can see both sides. Guess that is why it's controversial- huh?

I remember the news footage from Vietnam and seeing the coffins lined up - or are they "transfer cases"? I didn't see a lot of it though since my mother forbid us from watching the news. I was fascinated by the war coverage and wanted to learn about it - what, why, who, the protests etc. I have to admit at the time I was very insulated, especially the year my own father was stationed in Saigon flying combat missions.
The media coverage (of the war, not just the coffins) did bring the Vietnam war into the living rooms of America. As for me and my siblings - we older three were old enough to have lived it and had zero interest in anything military. I have to admit I am confounded that the baby I rocked during the first Gulf War and was so thankful she was a "she" and would not get drafted is in the Army.
But I digress.

The other side is the censorship of Americans losing their lives - keeps the war out of the living rooms and the lives of the American public.

"We" complain that the average American has little concept of military service or the sacrifices that our military is making in fighting two wars. Out of sight, out of mind.
Last spring/summer it was as if America had forgotten we were fighting two wars -the economy was on the minds of Americans. One could make the case that keeping the media at bay is disrespectful. That it is nothing more than an attempt by the President to manipulate the media in covering the war and that it is a way to pretend that the sacrifices are not "real".
Let's face it - when a soldier from your hometown is lost - the first article will show a formal military photo, if one is available and the name. You probably feel a twinge of sympathy for the soldier and his/her family. A few days later - if the paper covers the funeral - the photo of the casket draped in a flag drives home the point.
How does one get America and American's on board with a war if we go through our daily lives pretending that ultimate sacrifices are not being made?

Even the families have mixed feelings. Some feel that it is a way for the nation to show respect and recognize the sacrifices their sons/daughters have made.

As far as the "media" using photos in a disrespecful manner - I doubt it. I am fairly sure Fox News would be at Dover in a heartbeat if the ban is lifted. If a rouge organization wanted to use photos to promote anti-war propaganda - there are plenty of photos out there that are easy to get a hold of. Arlington is not closed for funerals - one just needs a telephoto lens. It's not that difficult.

Some history if anyone is interested -
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2003-12-31-casket-usat_x.htm
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/236385_newthomas14.html
 
tpg said:
In my experience, it is not the reporters, but the editors back in the states that causes the grief.
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Agreed.


Also keep in mind TPG, I'm talking about the surviving family and loved ones, not the dead.
 
Just_A_Mom said:
That it is nothing more than an attempt by the President to manipulate the media in covering the war and that it is a way to pretend that the sacrifices are not "real".


How does one get America and American's on board with a war if we go through our daily lives pretending that ultimate sacrifices are not being made?



As far as the "media" using photos in a disrespecful manner - I doubt it. QUOTE]


1. First statement I quoted....at least we know your spin....as if it wasn't obvious before.

2. The draft. There have been PLENTY of photos, but heck, they'd rather watch CSI, The Hills, The OC, Friend, and Letterman.

3. You doubt it? You might want to brush up on some past coverage.



You're on the wrong side of this, and unfortunately, the ones who will suffer are your child's comrades, and their families. At least you can let them all know how you felt when their dead child is being moved from a plane.
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Man, I have been reading this from the start. It is all very interesting. I'm with Pima and LITS here though.

They shouldnt be allowed to take photos especially with the way that the media is these days. Even if the reporters are respectfull it comes down to the editors like TPG said. Since they are the ones who wont show the news respectfully then thats when you draw the line.

Just my two cents :thumb:
 
This continues to be about the media instead of the subject at hand.

Dover is a closed facility. The military has total control over everything that happens on the flight line. The manifest of the planes is privileged information. The media would either play by our rules or they would not play. Simple enough.

LITS, first with JAM, you say that it is only about family with children in the 'real' military, then you imply that only those on active duty have a right to an opinion. Make up your mind.
 
We bemoan the fact that the civilian world does not understand the military, does not understand the sacrifices we make. Yet when a suggestion is put forward which would exemplify this in the most poignant manner, we attempt to shoot both those who propose it and those who implement it.
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Death is poignant, but does that mean we should exploit somebodies pain.

We also bemoan the abortion issue...should we start taking pictures of everybody walking out of an abortion clinic? It is a time for common decency and respect as a fellow human being

Again, in the end I will respect Obama's decision...he just better be careful, because if he puts a surge into Afghanistan he might wish he kept Bushs rule
 
Ok here's a story for you all.

I go to school in a town of around 3000. I wouldn't say everyone knows everyone, but families are close. One middle school and one high school will make classmates closer.

Anyway, we have 2 local papers. When I was a freshman, we had a graduate who died in combat in Afghanistan. He was a Corporal in the Army. This hit hard because he had just graduated a few years before. All the teachers knew him, and everyone said he was a great kid. It really had an impact on everyone.
In those two newspapers, there was not a single photo from the funeral. No flag-draped coffin. But guess what? There was a picture of him in uniform, and his graduation picture. He was smiling. They told his story.
The point hit hard without the use of the picture of a coffin.

All I'm saying is that you can honor the fallen without disturbing a funeral, or taking pictures of coffins.
 
Pima said:
We also bemoan the abortion issue...should we start taking pictures of everybody walking out of an abortion clinic?
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I guess if we want to honor the sacrifices of all those unwed mothers who sacrifice their all by having abortions, we should start honoring their sacrifices by photographing them. As you can see, Pima, I am not quite following your analogy.

The fallen troops died for all of us — they died for the nation, they died for the cause. It's a right for all Americans to pay their respects for those who made the sacrifice. It is not a right held exclusively for the families themselves.
 
How are we honoring them by showing a casket in the newspaper or on tv. Personally I love reading soldiers stories, they influence and fuel mr to be who I am. This is how they should be honored, by the media telling us their story like matt said earlier
 
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