PCSM-Logging Flight Time

Discussion in 'ROTC' started by Mayville-Cardinal, Mar 22, 2016.

  1. Mayville-Cardinal

    Mayville-Cardinal Member

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    How does one log flight hours without a PPL? I've read other posts that seem to indicate that simply taking a "discovery flight" and logging that flight time can be used/credited toward a PCSM score ($69 for 30-min ground instruction & 30-min flight in a Cessna 152 at our local general aviation airport). If that's the case, does it matter how many discovery flights you take?
    What about other flight time, can one simply log PCSM-creditable flight hours just by being a passenger in a private plane?
     
  2. noketchup

    noketchup Member

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    You can log hours with an instructor pilot without having a PPL. The instructor will sign off on your hours as the pilot in command, but you still earn hours as a trainee.

    On average, I spend $140-150 an hour for flights, and I am aiming to get 21 hours, which adds points. I should end up adding anywhere from 16-20 pts with that many hours. Ill post a bracket of how hours work into points on PCSM.
     
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  3. noketchup

    noketchup Member

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    Here is a general bracket, it can vary depending on your AFOQT-Pilot & TBAS results.
     

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  4. Stealth_81

    Stealth_81 Super Moderator Moderator Founding Member

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    I doubt that you would get more than one discovery flight at any location. These flights are discounted by the FBO/Instructor in the hope that they will entice you to become a paying student. Even if you could do that, $69 for 1/2 hour of time is just as expensive as working towards your PPL and building hours.

    You cannot log time as a passenger. The creditable time must be either instructional or as PIC and must be in your log book. Your commander or recruiter must attach a letter verifying the hours, and copies of your log book pages must be attached.

    Stealth_81
     
  5. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    Why would you want to keep taking the same thing over and over again? The reality is that if you get Pilot or CSO and you do not have a PPL you will go to IFT, just taking a discovery class enough times to get the hours to give you a bump in your score will do you no good in the long run.

    Being a passenger does not count, as stated by nokecthup the logbook in your case must be signed off by a licensed instructor. In that case, than why would you go up without taking instructions.

    AF is looking at those hours because they have seen that the success rate is higher for cadets with flight time, thus being a passenger in a private plane will do nothing for you when it comes to UPT/UNT. Actual flying with an IP will help you get ready for landing with crosswinds, or learning how to study the BOLD. It will allow you to hit the ground running as soon as you get to IFT or UPT.
     
  6. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    +1. For our DS when he took the TBAS, he had to go to the nearest AFB for the exam. He was required to bring his logbook with him where they verified his hours. He did not have to have a letter from his CoC, just his logbook. While he was taking the TBAS, they did the verification and signed off the appropriate forms.

    OBTW if cost is an issue, than just do the minimum to give you a sizeable bump in the score.

    A final reason why you want those hours is because to get to UPT, that TBAS is going to matter. It is not like the AFOQT where you can do sample exams. You will sign a form stating you will not discuss the materials on the test with anyone, hence you will want those hours to give you an edge on the test.
    ~ At our DS det. not one of the cadets (13 of them) took the test at the same time. They were all sent to the same test location, but at different times over a course of a few weeks.
     
  7. Mayville-Cardinal

    Mayville-Cardinal Member

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    Thanks for the feedback and recommendations. A couple of follow-up questions... My DS has lined up a discovery flight at a nearby general aviation airport/flight school and is working with the CFIs to schedule additional PIC flight time over the next 6 weeks before Field Training. Sounds like the owner and one of the CFI's are former AF and willing to work him into their training schedule. This particular school trains on/with Piper J3 Cub (taildraggers). Also if possible, DS is also considering signing up right away for a sport/recreation pilot certificate (vs. PPL) given lesser training hours and cost. My questions are... does it matter what type of aircraft DS acquires flight time as long as its with a CFI? If DS goes after a sport/recreational certificate, does the flight time he accumulates "count" the same as if he were in a PPL program?
     
  8. noketchup

    noketchup Member

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    Flight hours are flight hours. Whatever license your DS earns does not count towards his PCSM. For example, if you took one cadet who earned 41hrs and has no license, versus a cadet who gets 41hrs and PPL, they will earn the same number of points.

    Separate note however, if he does earn a PPL, he can end up skipping IFS and go straight to UPT after commissioning.
     

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