Discussion in 'Nominations' started by navalacademy12, Feb 25, 2009.
Are there requirements for obtaining a presidential nomination and how hard would it be?
Your parent(s) have to be active or retired military is one requirment
An academy can have up to 100 appointments in the Presidential category. This category is reserved for children of career military personnel. To qualify, the parent must meet one of the following criteria:
Be on active duty and have served continuously on active duty for at least eight years, or
Have retired with pay or have been granted retired or retainer pay, or
Children of reservists may also be eligible (see Section 12733 Title 10 USC for details), or
Have died after being retired with pay or being granted retired or retainer pay;
For adopted children, proceedings must have begun before the child's 15th birthday.
Children of Deceased or Disabled Veterans
The child of a deceased or disabled member of the Armed Forces is eligible if the parent was killed or 100 percent disabled by wounds or injuries received or diseases contracted while in active service or from a preexisting injury or disease aggravated by active service.
Children of Military or Civilian Personnel in Missing Status
The child of a parent who is in "missing status" is eligible if the parent is a member of the armed services or a civilian employee in active government service who is officially carried or determined to be absent in a status of missing; missing in action; interred in a foreign country; captured, beleaguered or besieged by a hostile force; or detained in a foreign country against his or her will.
Children of Medal of Honor Recipients
The children of Medal of Honor recipients from any branch of the armed services may apply under this category.
Air Force Regular and Reserve Components
Vacancies are available under this category for members of the Regular Air Force, Air Force Reserve and Air National Guard in accordance with Air Force directives available through any base education office. The application form (AF Form 1786) should be obtained through normal Air Force publications supply channels.
Air Force Reserve Officer Training Corps and Air Force Junior Reserve Officer Training Corps
Five students may be nominated to the Academy every year from each college or university AFROTC detachment, as well as honor graduates from each eligible honor high school with Air Force Junior ROTC. College or university students must submit their applications to the Professor of Aerospace Studies. High school students must submit their applications to the Aerospace Science Instructor.
Honor Military and Naval Schools
Any school designated by the Departments of the Army and Navy as an honor school with distinction may nominate five candidates from among its honor graduates. The eligible schools have applications for students.
My husband is active duty and my son wants to go to the AFA.
For the presidential nomination, do you just send the letter to the academy (patterned from the sample on the AFA web site) with the appropriate information? Are letters of recommendation required at a later time or not at all?
He is starting the application process for congressional nominations, so the presidential looks simple at this point.
I have a sample template from the naval Academy Catalog, do i just type that up and mail it or is there maybe and electronic version?
naval academy nomination letters
the links of samples are at the bottom of the page.
No letters of recommendation are required for a Presidential Nomination. It is a service connected nomination based on a legacy of service by a parent.
Contact admissions and they will instruct you on the correct documents needs to secure a Presidential nomination.
Can I can edit out the text indicated by the asterisks, or do I just fill it out as is?
Clarification of service requirements
As I read the instructions for presidential nominations a parent would have to be retired or currently on active duty. When a nominee from my son's high school was presented his appointment at awards night the Air Force Liason officer stuck around afterward and indicated to my son that he should pursue nomination because I had served longer than 8 years (just over 12) in the Marine Corps. Does anyone have experience with this?
The short answer is YES, your DS may qualify for a Presidential Nom. It comes down to your actual service record. I do believe it is 8 yrs AD, but not 100% sure.
The thrust behind a Presidential nom existing is multi-fold, but in the end it is a thank you to the family for their sacrifices serving the nation.
Typically, you will see it is retired or AD because for the candidates they can find themselves behind the 8 ball in the process...folks move them as a rising sr and it is hard to be competitive against candidates that have lived in the area since Kindergarten.
A Presidential nom will have no bearance on your DS's competitiveness when applying. It is tied to the parent! If you qualify then they get one. There is an unlimited amount of noms to be given, but only 100 can be charged. Traditionally, there are over 450 candidates yrly for each SA. Your DS's WCS will still have to be high enough to win the appt, just like an MOC. The difference is the Presidential is national, not regional.
One thing that it does is it gives the SA another place to charge them. For example, DS ranks #3 on his only and only MOC slate, let's say Sen A. No 1 takes Sen A slot, No 2 get Sen B, they can now appt him as Presidential because he was #100 on the WCS. If he did not have the Presidential he could have been SOL.
Spanky - sorry; doesn't quite work that way.
100 appointments are available at USMA, USNA, USAFA each year for Presidential nominations.
The criteria for a Presidential nomination are:
- children of those servicemembers who are or died while retired and retired with pay
- children of active duty servicemembers who have already served at least 8 years
- children of retired reservists who have not yet turned 60 and hence, not yet receiving retiree pay
If you are in the reserves - there is a formua to calculate your service time. The academy will do this when you send in your paperwork.
The nomination itself is a legacy. From all the Presidential nominees only 100 appointments can be made each year.
I may be 1000% wrong in reading your post, and for that I apologize now. However, I hope you understand that the term LEGACY regarding college apps insinuates that they are getting in on the folks coat tails.
You are the go to person on NOMs, but I have to ask for you to clarify this statement:
What doesn't work that way? I ask this because I am confused regarding the statement, additionally, it sounds confusing to lurkers.
Are you stating the ALO was wrong in his advice or me?
If you read his post he served 12 yrs AD, thus the ALO was correct according to your post.
The legacy thing is abrasive.
Sorry, but there is a difference between a legacy traditional university and military. My children went to no less than 8 schools during their public education(K-12)... I think they deserved that special nom for not having a traditional life. Our only child to attend 1 hs is our youngest, he will graduate in 12. Our DD who graduated two days ago went to 2 hs., our DS who graduated 2 yrs ago also attended 2 hs., we only moved 20 months ago. Neither had the option to remain, the AF forced us to move to another state. How many schools does the avg student without military parents go to? 3...Elementary, Middle, High. Military children on the most part move every 2-3 yrs, they are forced to start over and over again their entire life. Hard to be Jr Class President or Varsity Football team when you arrive in August. There are incredible pains that the family endures when orders come down and they are in hs. You can't even begin to imagine the tears and then the frustration working out with the new school their curriculum until you live it, let alone the re-working of their wgpa and class rank.
For many of us this is not a legacy thing. Many of us are STATIONED overseas or in another state during this time period. Worse yet, June-Aug is PCS time frames, thus we don't even know who our Congressman, ALO/MALO/BGO are until we have our household goods delivered, which could be only days before school starts in August. That is behind an 8 ball for SA purposes.
Sorry, but if you want to classify military as LEGACY like Harvard or any other college you are wrong. They deserve this little piece of bread thrown at them, these kids pay the highest toll for their parents sacrifice to this nation. They not only have school stress, peer pressure, but on top of that their parents can be deployed to war zones. Trust me it is in their mind as much as it is in the mind of the parent at home. Many of them become aware of the big bad world at a very young age, and to their honor, they are their ones that enlist or opt for the military.
The military does have legacy children...they exist in the enlisted and officer ranks. They are the children who opt to follow their parents footsteps by joining the forces. It is not legacy, it is honor IMHO.
PIMA definitely brings up a very good point. Technically, a presidential nomination can be seen as a legacy, because the ONLY way it's possible, is if the applicant's parent is directly related to the military via active duty or retired under certain situations.
However, Pima is correct that Legacy might not be the correct word. A civilian college student is almost guaranteed admittance to a fraternity if their family member was in that fraternity. They become a legacy. Basically, they are an automatic. But Pima is correct that the Presidential nominations weren't necessarily designed as a means of "Rewarding" the child of a military member with a "GIMME". It had to do with not being able to build those traditional rapports and relationships that a stable student can do in a community. This information is extremely important to a member of congress who is being asked for a nomination. They want to see what you've done for your school, community, state, neighbors, etc.... Those kind of accomplishments are difficult for many military dependent applicants. I have 2 kids, born in different countries from each other, living in multiple countries and bases.
So yes, a Presidential nomination is sort of a legacy in the respect that you had to have a parent directly involved with the military, and then a nomination is passed down to you. But it's not a legacy in the respect as a normal civilian college would define it. Meaning, guaranteed acceptance. As JAM said, only 100 appointments are given out in each of the academies requiring a nomination, using the presidential nomination. So you still need to be the highly qualified person the academy wants. Just like a congressman can give out 10 nominations. But 10 people aren't going to get an appointment. The air force or other branch may have 500 applicants with a presidential nomination, but only 100 of them will get an appointment using that nomination. That's why it's important to obtain as mainy nominations as you can.
One either needs to be retired (or deceased after retirement) OR currently Active Duty with at least 8 years of service.
Those in the guard/reserves have a complicated point system to determine if they have enough service.
Pima my dear, this is not a college application now is it?
The term legacy in this context means that the applicant does not have to meet any specific qualifications themselves. The nomination is their birthright.
As are Presidential nominations. They are automatic. If you qualify, you get one.
"Legacy" is an accurate description of a presidential nomination.
(We're not talking about an appointment - we are talking about the nomination.)
It's based 100% on the parent, not the applicant/candidate.
However, as for the academy, the "Legacy" of a presidential nomination doesn't automatically get you an appointment. Hence the reason the word "Legacy" can be a bit misleading. My cousin, who died a couple years ago on active duty, left a child behind. His mom, (My aunt, and the baby's grandmother), was under the impression that because he died on active duty that his child would be authorized an "Appointment" to Westpoint. I tried to explain that the child would be authorized a "Presidential Nomination", but that doesn't automatically mean they get an appointment. She didn't understand. (And with the baby still being 15 years out from applying, I really didn't want to argue with here. It isn't important at this time in her life and grief). Anyway, point is, while a "Presidential Nomination" can be viewed guaranteed as a legacy because your parent was associated with the military (accordingly), an "APPOINTMENT" is not guaranteed based on a legacy. And that is the difference between that an the example I gave concerning a fraternity in college. The fraternity, you ARE guaranteed admittance into the fraternity based on legacy. (Assuming no outstanding infractions of the charter would preclude such induction).
I have a few questions on this.
Does it have to be the child of Armed Forces or can it be any of the uniformed services such as NOAA. Also if they switch services from Navy to NOAA would their children still qualify as long as they served more than eight years or how would that work?
I'm not positive, but I'm pretty sure that a presidential nomination is only for the children of the Armed Forces. And, the 8 years has to be "currently". I.e. the parent is CURRENTLY Active Duty, with more than 8 years in. In other words, they couldn't be in 10 years and gotten out and went on with their lives. So, it's active duty currently with more than 8 years, or retired. There's also other caveats for those who have died active/retired. But I don't believe NOAA counts. At the bottom of my signature is a link to the air force academy brochure. There's a section directly on presidential nominations. It doesn't mention anything other than military service. Feel free to click on the link.
Which is why it has been reiterated to death that the nomination is a legacy (which iit is) and the appointment is not.
Are cadets and midshipmen active duty?
Listen to grandma. She is probably correct. The Secretary of each service is authorized to appoint those who are children of servicemembers killed in action, with 100% service connected disability, or who died as the result of a service connected disability (wounds or injuries received or diseases contracted in, or preexisting injury or disease aggravated by, active service). Don't know about the other academies, but in the past USNA has made every effort to accomodate these youngsters. Show them a died in the line of duty DD214, 3Qed and they are in. Close and they get NAPS. The Navy takes care of its own. Don't know about the AF or Army.
Not to pick nits nor get into a discussion about the definition of service connected death or disability but I don't think children of those who die on active duty, no matter how long, are eligible for a Presidential. This is to preclude those whose deaths are found not in the line of duty to reap the benefit. So, 6 months in the Navy, killed in an automobile accident while driving home from work, a guaranteed appointment if 3Qed. Nineteen years nine months, stealling the skippers car at his retirement party, crashing through the front gate into a bus load of school kids, killing himself and a few others, no SecNav, no Presidential, no nothing.
midson1996 - the law specifically state you must be the child of a member of the armed forces.
Christcorps - my condolences about your cousin. However, your aunt is likely correct.
The child would NOT be eligible for a Presidential nomination.
He would probably be eligible for a Sec nomination as one of 65 allowed at each Academy who are sons and daughters of service members who suffered a service connected death or disability.
There are 3 different 'legacy' or 'birthright' APPOINTMENTS for children of members of the armed forces:
1. Presidential - the most common and 100 are appointments are allowed each year
2. Death/disability - their is allowed a total of 65 in the entire corps (about 16/year)
3. Medal of Honor winners - unlimited.
Separate names with a comma.