Protocol

Discussion in 'Nominations' started by ColtDad, Nov 3, 2010.

  1. ColtDad

    ColtDad Member

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    Hello. New parent here with a quick question concerning nomination protocol.

    First, my son was very fortunate to have just received a Senatorial nomination to the USNA today! He is very grateful and appreciative to have progressed to this point.

    My question concerns the other nomination requests from other MOC's who have not completed the process yet. Do we contact them and inform them of the nomination to USNA? Or do we wait and see if he would be fortunate enough to receive nominations to one of the other SA's also?

    Any thoughts would be most welcome.

    Thanks
     
  2. jennyp

    jennyp Parent

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    Gather all the nominations you can! This gives the academy more than one alternative as to which nomination to use to award your child an appointment. It is possible, and does occur in some states, that the senators will share with each other and the representatives who they nominated so as not to duplicate. You should continue pursuit of all nominations until you have an appointment in hand!
     
  3. PositiveThinking

    PositiveThinking Member

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  4. Christcorp

    Christcorp Member

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    Don't contact them about your existing nomination. Here is my "Train of thought" on the subject.

    1) If the Senator(s) and/or Representative want to know what nominations the OTHER senator or representative have given out, let THEM coordinate and ask the other senator and/or representative who and where they are nominating.
    2) If you can get additional nominations, not only to the other service academies on your list, but additional nominations to the same academy; e.g. 3 nominations to air force; then most definitely GOOD FOR YOU.
    3) While I am Neutral towards ALL applicants that I assist, you as the applicant need to worry about you. Don't worry about what is fair. If you can get all three MOC's to award you a nomination to all three military academies, because that's what you applied for, then again; GOOD FOR YOU. Worry about you, and no one else.
    4) While most people tend to look at senators, representatives, and even the president of the United States as "AUTHORITY FIGURES"; guess what??? They aren't. They are "PUBLIC SERVANTS". They WORK FOR YOU!!!!! You are THEIR BOSS. You are THEIR EMPLOYER. Make them do their job. Obviously you must stay cordial, and even humble, because most of these Senators/Representatives believe that "They are in charge" and they could/would hold an attitude against you. But as your employee, if they don't coordinate with the other MOC's, and they also give you nominations, then GOOD FOR YOU.

    There are some people that think they should tell the MOC's about the other MOC who gave them a nomination. DON'T DO IT. Take care of what's in your best interest. I will say however, that if an individual receives an appointment IN HAND, via a presidential or other non-MOC nomination, then there's nothing wrong with letting your senators and representative know you have already received an appointment, and thank them for their consideration, and let them know that you don't need to continue on with their interviews. Let them know that you hope they can award the nomination to a worthy candidate. Now I know that there are some here that are against this, because they think you should still get more nominations, so the academies can then have the option of juggling nominations around. Well I can't and won't speak for others than the Air Force, but the air force doesn't do this. If you received an APPOINTMENT IN HAND, then they have already credited you with the nomination that was used for that appointments, and has charged it to that source. They AREN'T going to juggle nominations around. Isn't going to happen. So, if you receive an appointment for the air force, and you accept it, then it would be the nice thing to inform your remaining nomination sources that they no longer need to consider you. This will help another individual. But I won't speak for the army or navy.

    Anyway; that's my $0.02848349. Don't tell any of the MOC's that you have a nomination from one of the others. If they want to know, they can call each other. They probably already know. If they don't, then GOOD FOR YOU. Best of luck. Mike.....
     
  5. ColtDad

    ColtDad Member

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    Much appreciated.

    Thank you to those who kindly took the time and iniative to respond. Based on general concensus, we will certainly keep our current nomination on the down-low at this point.

    As a family we are fairly new to this process. Although my son has read a very informative book on the USNA and the process, it appears their are lessons still to be learned....hopefully not painfully!

    It just seems odd that there is a benefit to, or need for, more than one nomination unless the candidate wished to be able to choose among different SA's. Our MOC's all requested the candidates list their order of preference and my son got his first choice. At first glance that would seem to be end-of-story...move on to the next hurdle. Apparently that is not the case.

    Thanks again.
     
  6. Christcorp

    Christcorp Member

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    The "Benefit or Need" to more than 1 nomination that you refer to, is actually very logical and natural. Although, a person who might not understand what and how nominations work, might think it would be odd to have or need more than 1. Here it is, in a nut-shell.

    1. An average academy, say the air force academy, will have approximately 10,000 initial applicants or prospects. But there is only room for approximately 1300-1400 cadets per year.

    2. The various military academies like air force, west point, etc... are "FEDERALLY FUNDED" by tax payer dollars. Therefor, the "STATES" have the "RIGHT" to be equally represented to the best of the academy's ability, when selecting the 1300-1400 appointees for that year. (Yes, that means that a selectee from one state, could possibly have a lower overall package score than a non-selectee from a different state, but each state has the "RIGHT" to be equally represented. It's not perfect, but it IS the most fairest).

    3. Each senator/representative gives 10 nominations "PER ACADEMY THAT REQUIRES ONE" each year. So, with 453 representative, and 100 senators, that's 5530 nominations. Then there are a few more nominations separate from these, that are afforded as a "BENEFIT". E.g. Military members, in HONOR of their service, are authorized that their child be given a nomination from the president for the military academy.

    4. Even with these 6000+ Nominations total, that's still more than the academies can admit. They can only admit 1300-1400 appointees.

    5. There is no way that the senators, representatives, president, vice-president, ROTC, and other nominating officials can tell who is the "MOST QUALIFIED" applicant. These individuals don't have the time, nor the knowledge of the overall "Whole Person" attributes that the academies are looking for and are scoring for. Therefor; the academy has these nominators provide a SLATE of 10 nominations (For senators and representatives), and the academy is generally allowed to "CHOOSE" which person on that list of 10, should receive an appointment. Same for the presidential and so on. Once one from each list of senators and representatives have been chosen, and the others for president, vp, etc... are chosen, there will be about 500 additional slots available.

    6. These remaining slots are chosen by taking ALL the remaining nominees from each of those senator's and representative's lists of 10, who didn't receive that initial appointment, and they are placed in a pool for the academy to choose the remaining 500+/- from.

    7. (Now, the reason for needing multiple nominations). By federal law; because each state is authorized the RIGHT to be equally represented, that means that each senator and representative, can ONLY have 5 cadets charged to their slot, at the academy at any one time. So, you might have a representative's nomination, but another individual on that list of 10 from the same representative, may have been chosen for that slot above you. Well, you missed out. HOWEVER, if you also have a nomination from the senator, and they have slots available at the academy, you might be the highest ranking on the senator's list, and you could be chosen for an appointment off of that list.

    8. Basically, a little more than HALF of each year's class, is filled by nominees representing either their state, congressional district, military parents, rotc, active duty, reservists, etc... You have a much better chance (1 in 10) competing with someone just in your district or state, then you do if you go into the general pool. By the time the general pool is chosen from, there can be approximately 5000+ people in this general pool. ALL with a nomination, and ALL competing against EACH OTHER for the remaining 500+ slots. Yes, the odds "SEEM" to be the same as competing for the 1 in 10, at your district/state, but at the local level, if you have more than one nomination, you're competing against others generally with the same educational, social, economic, etc... background; compared to others from different backgrounds.

    Anyway, that is about the MOST OVER SIMPLIFIED way to explain it. "Please, no one argue with me about "DETAILS". I was speaking VERY GENERAL to explain why it wasn't actually odd, and why there was some reasoning behind trying to have more than one nomination". It isn't a matter so much of determining if you're worthy to be at the academy. It's more a matter of approximately 60% of all appointments MUST be given out and accounted, for allocations prescribed by law. If you can't USE the nomination you have because that "Slot" is filled, it's good to have another one to use, PRIOR to having to be considered in the general pool. Best of luck to everyone. Mike....
     
  7. Mongo

    Mongo Banned

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    You know I couldn't do that. Actually, it was pretty good. Maybe a little wordy. I would only change the following:

    The odds are that only in the very small states with the ratio of Senators to Representatives being higher or equal will someone be more competitive on the Senator's slate than on the Rep's slate so I would have flipped the sources for the example.
     
  8. ColtDad

    ColtDad Member

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    Thanks again, the clarification is much appreciated!
     
  9. usna1985

    usna1985 USNA Alumnus

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    Short answer . . . I would not volunteer it but, obviously, if you are asked whether you have another nom, you must be honest.
     

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