Question about 3/2 year scholarship

Discussion in 'ROTC' started by washingtonrunner, Jul 6, 2011.

  1. washingtonrunner

    washingtonrunner Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2011
    Messages:
    10
    Likes Received:
    0
    One of my main backup plans to not getting a scholarship is attending a college and participating in AROTC or NROTC without a scholarship, and shooting for a 3 or 2 year scholarship.

    My question is; when pursuing a 3 or 2 year scholarship, is it solely based on your college performance in the ROTC unit and normal college classes? Or is your high school performance taken into account?
     
  2. Jcleppe

    Jcleppe Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2010
    Messages:
    5,541
    Likes Received:
    842
    They will judge you on your performance in ROTC and college, unless they try and get you scholarship at the beginning of your freshman year, then they will use your high school stats.
     
  3. gonavy2015

    gonavy2015 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2010
    Messages:
    95
    Likes Received:
    0
    Have you ever known this to happen?
    My son has been told by the CO at his unit that there have not been any side load scholarships in the past two years.
    Maybe it depends on the college?
     
  4. The OC Josh

    The OC Josh Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2009
    Messages:
    478
    Likes Received:
    0
    There were 2 & 3 year College scholarships for my Battalion last year. (Army ROTC)
     
  5. Ohio2015Parent

    Ohio2015Parent Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2010
    Messages:
    1,122
    Likes Received:
    58
    There are some 2/3 year scholarships out there - even this year - but with the budget cuts coming and general move to lower manpower numbers be careful when planning to use these funds - A LOT of variables in play.

    DS opted not to count on the campus based funds(he was in the running for one, but then the battalion changed direction and cancelled the board, more or less). This led him to the SMP program with the National Guard, his situation required some financial incentives to assist with his #1 school choice, so it works for him. There are a few threads with other SMP members and Clarksonarmy has a post on his blog about the program. It may be worth looking into for you.
     
  6. Pima

    Pima Parent

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2007
    Messages:
    12,809
    Likes Received:
    956
    I agree with Ohio, for the class of 16 the numbers may even be lower than this yr.

    There are lots of issues that need to be placed into the equation when you investigate the scholarship process.

    1. DoD budget

    ~~~ For FY 11/12 (begins Oct.1) it has been requested that they reduce it by 10%.

    Realistically, it won't come from the operational aspect, thus it has to come from somewhere else. When JCS Admiral Mullens states that pay and bennies for AD are not off the table, expect ROTC to be on the table too.

    2. Competition

    ~~~The longer we remain in a recession while tuition increases, the larger the pool of applicants will become.

    Now add into number 1., you get the perfect storm, more applicants, less scholarships.

    3. Meet the CoC

    ~~~ We are all here to help, but unless you are going to the colleges that clarkson and marist represent, not one of us can give you "true" advice. We can give analogies and anecdotal info. plus that ear to bend.

    Some units are more competitive academically than others, some are less. Only the CoC can give you a true image regarding your chances.

    Even with that, many CoC's are being cautious right now because of my point 1 (budget). When you do the visit, and ask about a 2/3 yr., honestly, all they can do is give historical data of their success rate. This is the reason I say ask the stat., not the number. I.E. school A had 10 awarded, but 100 eligible. School B had 3, and 15 cadets. 10 sounds better than 3, but 20% is better than 10%, hence school B has a higher success rate.

    Now all of that is stated, one thing you need to realize is the more informed you are, the more confident you will feel regarding your path. The way to be successful in ROTC and the military is to BELIEVE. Having second thoughts will occur, that is natural and common, it is what you do when you have the doubts that will impact your life.

    Let's be honest, General Powell had doubts during his career regarding his choices and his path, it was what he did that made the difference between being a leader and a follower.

    Good luck

    OBTW, in 09 IS scholarships for AFROTC existed, but due to budget cuts it did not exist in 10, and even for 11 it is questionable. If you opted the IS path as 13 class without a scholarship you would have no scholarship, even though when you applied in HS it did exist. Again, what existed last fiscal yr may not be there the following yr.
     
  7. Packer

    Packer Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2011
    Messages:
    1,877
    Likes Received:
    5
    I would guess the numbers will be smaller. DS received a letter from West Point that said the number admitted to the class of 2016 will likely be under 1200. The class of 2014 had 1375 admitted. I haven't seen numbers for the class of 2015. If the academy class size is going to be smaller, I would expect the number of ROTC scholarships to also be smaller.
     
  8. Pima

    Pima Parent

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2007
    Messages:
    12,809
    Likes Received:
    956
    The AFA went through that this yr. --- reduced incoming apptmts from 1600-1700 to @1350. SA's are required to maintain a cadet size of 4400 or less by law. For yrs. they have asked to be waived that number, but now due to the budget crunch they are accepting the fact that they need to be in that realm. USNA announced they were also reducing class size, and it should be no shock that USMA has announced they are following suit.

    I see a lot of parallels with AROTC and AFROTC regarding scholarships.

    AFROTC in 09 had a delay in board results. AROTC had a slow down in 11.

    AFROTC in 09 started to hand out less scholarships. AROTC in 11 has done the same.

    AFA announced in 10 that 15 would be smaller. WP announced in 11 that 16 would be smaller.

    Army is in a better position than the AF because they are still in 2 theaters (Iraq and Afghanistan), AF isn't. Those manpower needs will change when Obama brings them back stateside.

    My mantra: I saw this back in the early 90's and I am willing to bet that we are going to repeat it again now. The warning signs are there. You can choose to ignore them.

    1. Unemployment rate ~~~ impacts those who want to dive after commitment is up. No jobs, they will stay.
    2. Stock Market/Housing problems ~~~ investment aspect... how do you pay for college without assets? Scholarship!
    3. DoD budget cuts ~~~ Deficit means cuts!
    4. Leaving operational theaters ~~~ Too many troops coming home, equates to not enough jobs for them at their permanent post/base, which equates to cutting manpower needs.

    ***Remember in a pinch they can utilize OTS/OCS. At least for the AF, the majority of enlisted do use TA, (AF pays 75% of the cost for education). They can grab them faster than paying 100K for 4 yrs.

    I think it is important to understand that currently if you want to obtain a scholarship, you need to accept the fact that what occurred ly most likely won't occur this yr.

    I keep saying if Mullen (JCS) has stated that pay is on the table for AD, you need to comprehend that means scholarships too! If Gates in his final speeches stated that medical bennies for retirees who served 20 yrs+ are on the table, ROTC scholarships are too.

    Our DS is AFROTC scholarship class of 12 (non-tech), and forgive me for repeating myself, but he has stated that in HPO he would not have received any scholarship, that should tell you something.

    People rush their application for submission. This is not the time to do that IMPO. This is the time to make sure you have edited/re-edited/re--edited again the essays. This is the time to submit the PFA that is as close to maxing as you can get. This the time to toot your own horn regarding your ECS.

    If it takes you 2 more weeks, than take the 2 more weeks.

    If you are applying as a tech major only because you believe that increases your chances, be prepared to be miserable because you can't be successful if you only did it for the money.

    If you try to work the system for A/NROTC scholarship regarding schools (safety) than you are going to be the same as the student who works the system regarding majors.

    I won't speak for the Army or the Navy, but I can tell you for the AF, the ALO's will quickly see through you if you are applying for a scholarship to pay for schools. Honestly, I am betting the Army (ROO?) and Navy BGO see it too. It is easy to see.
    ~ Why the AF?
    ~ What are your career intentions?
    ~ What if you don't get that career?
    ~ At what age did you think of joining the military? Tell me about that memory.
    ~ How does your family feel about your decision?

    ALO's write recs. That interview is not for sheaats, grins and giggles.

    The AF system is different than A/NROTC, but I think you get the gist. The questions are very leading. I would assume that because A/NROTC are connected to the school, unlike AFROTC, they will hit you with additional questions, like:

    ~ Why this unit?
    ~ What if you get accepted to the school, but no scholarship?

    Flame on me, but as my days dwindle here, I hope that at least I can expand the conversation to the point where other posters take the baton and explain, there is SO MUCH MORE THAN GPA/SAT/ACT regarding the process.

    I am not trying to be Janie Raincloud. I am trying to be Rita Realistic.
     
  9. Mongo

    Mongo Banned

    Joined:
    May 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,444
    Likes Received:
    0
    Where did you see this?
     
  10. Pima

    Pima Parent

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2007
    Messages:
    12,809
    Likes Received:
    956
    Mongo,

    It was on this site a few months ago when you weren't here, I believe it was during the mass mailing time in March, maybe just before it or after it. There was a link, I can't tell you if it was on the AFA as a blurb or Academy/Military news, or on a ROTC post, it was there. I fell upon it.

    I won't also swear the numbers...it could have been 50 or 500, please note I didn't speculate on the numbers of appointments offered. You are the USNA BGO, so I bow to you. AFA and USMA are acknowledging that they are over the 4400 number, is USNA over that number? Will they be requesting a waiver to maintain that number from the DoD? If they are over 4400 would you not agree, that they maybe like the AFA and this yr announce that they will be offering fewer appointments?

    Please inform the NROTC candidates regarding this, because as a BGO, I am sure you know that as I have stated the majority of SA applicants apply for ROTC as plan B. As a BGO you have that double secret handshake knowledge.

    This is not a Navy VS other branch issue. This is explaining how an SA applicant with ROTC as plan B may impact the ROTC scholarship candidate Plan A.

    My point has always been to the candidates that if they want to be TRULY competitive for a scholarship, look at the chance me threads on this forum for the SA's and gauge from there. ESPECIALLY for N/AFROTC since these 2 branches use the method of tech V non-tech in awarding scholarships. IMPO if you want to feel more confident/secure for a scholarship use the SA chance me as a predictor.
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2011
  11. Mongo

    Mongo Banned

    Joined:
    May 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,444
    Likes Received:
    0
    USNA has always maintained end strength in accordance with Congressional directives. Therefore, there is no need to 'announce' cut backs this year (or any other year).
     
  12. Christcorp

    Christcorp Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2008
    Messages:
    4,963
    Likes Received:
    872
    I haven't read title 10 in a while, but I thought that without waivers, the air force, navy, and army academies were suppose to have no more than 4400 cadets; and graduating/commissioning no more than 1000. According to most navy reports, navy had 1006 graduates this year in the class of 2011. Now; in all fairness, it's possible that some of them were international students and not "Commissioned". However; most articles mention 1006 becoming ensigns or 2lt. And maybe because some are commissioned as marines, that makes it different. But the 2011 class did start with 1202 cadets. Point is; unless i can find something saying the contrary, I'm sure the navy has had more than 4400 cadets at one time, and more than 1000 graduate/commissioned. Maybe not as many as army/air force, but I don't believe they are operating 100% IAW congressional directives, differently than the other academies.
     
  13. Mongo

    Mongo Banned

    Joined:
    May 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,444
    Likes Received:
    0
    Absolutely no directives about graduating less than 1000. And yes, they can legally have more than 4400 so long as the size of the Brigade is under 4400 the day prior to graduation. The Navy does indeed meet these directives. Interesting line of argument though. Since the AF is unable to follow directives, it stands to reason that the Navy does also. LOL.

    I do think you have countered your own statement though. If the entering classes are within a handful of 1200 and the graduation is around 1000 and we know that at least half of those who quit, do so in the first two years, the size of the Brigade will therefore be around 4400.
     
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2011

Share This Page