Reverse a Medical DQ?

Discussion in 'DoDMERB' started by Sgeerling, Dec 2, 2010.

  1. Sgeerling

    Sgeerling Sam

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    I was recently disqualified because I had a subdural hematoma when I was born. When I went in for the actual exam, the doctor said that this should not affect my status. I was never operated on, it went away on its own. Since receiving the DQ letter we acquired a copy of my medical records from the time to send to the Naval Academy, to help in the waiver process. My cousin, a neurosurgeon, reviewed the records and the original CT scan, only to discover that I had never had a subdural hematoma. Instead my skull had deformed while passing through the birth canal, and expanded again at birth. The skull was pushed in and when it went back into shape a space was left between my skull and brain. My cousin said this was normal in newborns. Furthermore the records themselves state that I did notactually have a subdural hematoma, only that it was possible and that I should be kept under observation, and I was. My parents were never told this and were put under the impression that I actually had one. Can I get this disqualification reversed, especially considering I never had the condition I was disqualified for?
     
  2. flieger83

    flieger83 Super Moderator Moderator

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    You'll see it here many times: the ONLY person that can help answer that question is Larry Mullen.

    Read his sticky above, and then send him an e-mail as he directs with your information, etc., and he will get back to you: quickly.

    He is THE MAN on this...

    Steve
    USAFA ALO
    USAFA '83
     
  3. Sgeerling

    Sgeerling Sam

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    As of right now my emails will not go through to him, I am still trying. I was also wondering if, generally speaking, is it even possible to reverse a disqualification?
     
  4. Just_A_Mom

    Just_A_Mom Member

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    You can do this the "old fashioned" way. Gather up all your supporting evidence - medical records, have the neurosurgeon write a letter for you to DoDMERB and you also compose a letter to DODMERB explaining the medical situation and history.
    Ask that the DQ be removed.
    Put it in a packet, make a copy of all paperwork and overnight it to Larry Mullen at DODMERB.
    Include your phone number, email address and contact information. Also include to which accession progams you are applying.
     
  5. usna1985

    usna1985 USNA Alumnus

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    I believe Larry indicated on another thread that he would accept PMs on this forum until his email issue is resolved. You still need to include your full name and last 4 of your SSN, along with your issue.

    See below [from another thread]:

    __________________
     
  6. MullenLE

    MullenLE Member

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  7. AeroMed1

    AeroMed1 Parent of USNA candidate

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    Tell me I am not reading this!

    :thumbdown: So the folks at DoDMERB throw out a DQ over a diagnosis given to a candidate as an infant? It is really frightening that they could so quickly make such a decision. This is often a misdiagnosis in newborns, and in the infants with the diagnosis, a follow-up CT at age 4 weeks would usually show nothing.

    This diagnosis in an older child or adult is different..but as an infant?

    So a candidate can be thrown out so carelessly? Surely this could be reversed and in short order. Unreal. :thumbdown:

    Do these people have a clue about how hard some kids have worked to get to this place in life? :mad:
     
  8. MullenLE

    MullenLE Member

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    AeroMed1- Until you know of what you speak, it's best not to speak at all. It is neither accurate nor constructive:thumb:
     
  9. AeroMed1

    AeroMed1 Parent of USNA candidate

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    will speak

    I stand behind what was stated. I am going by what the OP stated that caused his/her DQ. Yes, I am qualified to address the issue of a subdural hematoma in a newborn. I am strictly responding to what was posted.

    I would think that a knowledgable medical person would dig a little deeper than basing a DQ on a newborn's subdural hematoma. My statement about studies is true. Infants that had a documented subdural hematoma were followed and a follow up scan at 4 weeks showed resolution in almost all cases. In a severe case, one would see seizures, etc. and this would be documented.

    I just know many, many infants whose delivery was assisted by a "vacumn Extractor" and that little suction cup left many a "cupcake" on an infant's head, and dark, dark bruising a day or so later. It was very, very common for years and was used instead of forceps. Occasionally on charts it would be documented that it caused a "subdural hematoma" which was not correct. The OP of this information is not my candidate and I do not know the OP. But I do know that this is a misused term and is a frequent misdiagnosis, especially looking at 17 to 18 year olds.

    THere may be other information that I am unaware of that was reviewed before the DQ. But a DQ simply on that diagnosis in a newborn is ....well I will not say it. I hope that a DQ is based on other reasons not listed here.
     
  10. kp2001

    kp2001 USMMA Alumnus

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    AeroMed:

    I'm going to play nice and explain the system for you as I'm an active duty Navy physician. I will limit my statements to those for the Navy only, but in general they apply across the services.

    There is a manual called the 'Manual of the Medical Department', in it Chapter 15 covers physical standards for serving in the Navy. This manual lists all medical conditions which are to be "Considered Disqualifying" for service. It is not a "if you have it now" type of deal, it is, for the most part, a "if you have ever had or have now" statement.

    Now, just because something says it is "disqualifying" does not mean someone cannot serve, it simply means a waiver is needed. This usually involves getting more information so a better determination can be made as to whether that particular medical condition will cause future problems.

    A great and easy example is asthma. For "civilian John Doe" asthma doesn't really matter for a job. If something happens they can get to an ER pretty quickly and they have ready access to inhalers and other asthma meds. Now, take that same "John Doe" put him in a uniform and put him in the middle of Iraq. He hasn't had an asthma attack in several years, but also doesn't live in a desert at home. He now has an attack and is at a forward operating base, or even worse, on patrol at the time. He forgot/ran out/doesn't carry his inhaler and is getting worse and worse. This member now needs an aeromedical evacuation. Guess what, he has just caused the loss of a mission AND put even more service members (helicopter crew) at risk so they can get him and fly him to a base that has the ability to care for him. Now say he was in status and he needs a respirator, guess what, now he's at least going to Germany and we have lost a member to DNBI (Disease - Non Battle Injury).

    Although things may seem minor in the civilian world, things can take on a much greater problem in the military. Sleep apnea anyone??? Try taking a CPAP to the desert and living in a tent without electricity. (not really applicable to applicants).

    Unless you've been in the military or served as a military provider one doesn't quite get the full gist of why things may seem "silly" when it comes to DQ's and the like.

    Anyway, if you want further insight, feel free to PM me, don't want to hijack this thread too much.
     
  11. MullenLE

    MullenLE Member

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    Pls have your candidate email within the next 24 hours. I will be going to a movie, shoveling snow, having dinner, and playing Racquetball during that time. But if the candidate emails me within the next 24 hours, I will respond promptly. My email address is Larry.Mullen@dodmerb.tma.osd.mil :thumb:
     
  12. AeroMed1

    AeroMed1 Parent of USNA candidate

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    Womack must not count? WAMC

    Mr. Mullen no emails until next week. We will give you time to catch up on the ones that you have missed. After everything that I am reading I think any further follow-up would be worthless, although I don't understand being told by DoDMERB per phone that get the records to us and we will decide that day. What a joke.

    kp2001, the asthma I understand completely and I agree with, especially with the lack of a decent propellant in inhalers currently.

    The waiver process I understand, also. I would say for most trying to make the class of 2015, a waiver handed out at this point in the game would be be impossible to attain in a timely manner, especially when other college decisions and scholarship offers require a decision. I think that is a reality that many have to face.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 1, 2011
  13. MullenLE

    MullenLE Member

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    AeroMed1 = "I would say for most trying to make the class of 2015, a waiver handed out at this point in the game would be be impossible to attain in a timely manner, especially when other college decisions and scholarship offers require a decision. I think that is a reality that many have to face."

    This, added to the other statements you've made, confirms you have zero understanding nor willingness to understand the process. If your candidate chooses to email, especially now when I do have the time to respond more rapidly than usual, I'll answer. If the candidate choose to send an email next week or next month, I'll reply. But, there's no getting thru to you and that's OK. No more replies from me, on my own time, to you.
     
  14. Mongo

    Mongo Banned

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    You are going to have to add me to your list of those who have “zero understanding” of the process. This is the time of the year that high school seniors sit down with their parents, put all their ‘cards’ on the table, and decide where they are going to college. We who have been around the SAs for a while know that this is impossible and that those students must plan a two pronged approach, Plan ‘A’ and Plan ‘B’. A waiver requirement does indeed add uncertainty to this approach.

    Next, let’s add more uncertainty. Most who desire to attend a SA wish to become officers so they also apply to ROTC. Remembering that all states do not have colleges with NROTC, perhaps they will have to pursue schools which they otherwise would not be able to afford. Next, many candidates are not service specific. They may apply to more than one SA and to more than one ROTC program. Probably at different civilian colleges. Since they will only be able to afford these based on financial assistance from ROTC, they also need a back up plan if none of the four waivers are successful, hence applying to another college.
    Now let's think about the thousands upon thousands of candidates who have not happened to stumble on this forum and Larry’s super duper overnight guaranteed express service and must rely on the less than instantaneous official channels, where time is measured in weeks and months. Now, we suddenly have at least three colleges demanding financial commitment. This is a reality to most.

    In my 15 years of counseling hundreds of candidates, most of my distraught parent’s phone calls involve DoDMERB and waivers/remedials. Most often they are unable to even ascertain whether or not they have even received the amplifying documentation, much less acted on it. You will get distraught parents on this forum. Don't run them off.
     
  15. KP13Mom

    KP13Mom Member

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    There is a difference between being distraught and being rude.
     
  16. Just_A_Mom

    Just_A_Mom Member

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    When frustrated and distraught it's easy to be perceived as being rude.
    There is some truth to the frustrations that AeroMed is expressing.

    To be clear - DODMERB does not make the decision to waive a DQ. That decision is made by the officer accession program. i.e. Academy or ROTC

    There is plenty of time for a waiver to be sought and granted - even if remedial tests are required. That said - the process can take months and months. As we move toward spring this issue can and will be an issue for some people.
    Imagine being offered a ROTC scholarship later in the spring and not yet having a waiver by May 1 when college decisions are made.
    This situation does happen - while it is how the system works and not a fault of any one individual or the organization - it is frustrating and causes a great deal of angst. None of which should be dismissed as 'not understanding'.
     
  17. lovethenavy

    lovethenavy Member

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    The thing that was difficult for some of us to understand was that Mr. Mullen continually asked them to have their candidate email him within 24 hours, as he had the time, on his own, to help them out. They repeatedly said that their candidate would not be doing so this week as it was the holidays. I get that this is the holiday season, but if you want an appointment to an SA, if it is your lifelong dream, certainly you could take a few minues to plead your case with Director Mullen. Would it help? I guess we will never know. That was what frustrated me the most. I remember our DS up at all hours of the night at this time last year, updating his file online, checking his status, asking me if anything had come in the mail that day....it is all part of everyone's process.
     
  18. buff81

    buff81 Moderator

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    The whole waiver thing can be frustrating - lived through two!
    I understand frustration but not rudeness and there is a difference.
    At West Point - waivers have to be cleared by April 15 or your file will be closed. Throw that into the equation when it is April and there is no waiver news and the anxiety level goes through the roof. :eek:

    As far as what to do about Plan 'B' and Plan 'C', you just have to cough up the deposits. You can accept the ROTC scholarship, you can accept the offers from other colleges but you have to be willing to lose the deposit $$ if the Appointment comes through. It's hard writing out those checks HOPING that you will lose them but it does relieve some of the anxiety knowing that Plan B is in place if Plan A doesn't work out. We ate a several hundred $$ in deposits while waiting on the waivers but it was well worth it. The schools that we sent deposits to knew that USMA was the first choice and that the Appointment would be accepted if offered.

    BTW - if anyone finds themselves in the position of it being April and no waiver decision yet, make sure you contact your RC.
     
  19. MullenLE

    MullenLE Member

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    What I tell all applicants when asked.= If this is something YOU really want to do (not your parents, friends, etc), then apply to a few Service Academies, ROTC programs, and a few civilian schools. Better to be a senior in Mar and receive 9 acceptances and NOW the work really begins as to which one to select, than to be a senior in HS, it's March, and you haven't applied to any colleges.

    Clearely, that is both ends of the spectrum, and the middle is where most applicants find themselves, but if you apply to nothing else than Academy X, you are putting all your eggs in one basket. In the 19 years I've been doing this, I've seen many an applicant who was susbstantially surprised and severely disappointed by not expanding thier opportunities.:thumb:
     
  20. MullenLE

    MullenLE Member

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    ****And lest anyone be misled or misguided here, let me point back to the original posting by Seegerling.
    1. He said on his history he had a subdural hematoma when he was born.
    2. He then said that was incorrect and per discussions with me, we asked him to send in those additional medical records.
    3. Upon review and confirmation that the information he indicated on his history was incorrect, DoDMERB susbsequently qualified him...no waiver required.
    4. This was a UNIQUE case and the point of all my postings is to let folks know that each case is different.
    5. The best example of the converse was several years ago. The applicant was diagnosed, treated, and even hospitalized for respiratory issues. The does NOT meet medcial standards was applied by DoDMERB and Academy X denied the waiver. Then, the extremely well-credentialed physician, hospital attending and faculty member @ a leading university, who had treated the applicant since birth....once he found out that this friend of the family was being denied the opportunity to attend the Academy, wrote a letter saying the diagnosis for all those years was incorrect. This is NOT an indictiment of the physicians in the least. It IS a statement that often, physicians are folks too... and they hate to see someone they've known and obsereved for years, "miss" an opportunity. Even though many of them haven't served in the military, they honestly believe that Johnnie/Susie will actually be able to succeed and that their "condition," should not hold them back.:thumb:
     

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