Sat/Act Superscore

The way I see it, the SAs are doing candidates a favor by admitting those with well above minimum ACT/SAT scores. Candidates need to remember that the SAs are academically intense. All cadets/midshipmen take rigorous classes of calc, chem, english, & history the first two years -- 17+ credit hours/semester (my cadet had 5 classes 1st semester; another 5 2nd semester). That's quite a bit higher than the average college student at a civilian school, who can get by with 12-15 credit hours/semester (3-4 classes) and still be considered full-time. (And yes, there are exceptions at civilian colleges, but doesn't the average civilian college education take 5-6 years now? SA students don't have that option.) Even those SA students with 30+ ACT scores may find some classes challenging. At WP they use the Thayer method of teaching, which has taken my cadet some time to get used to. And unfortunately I am hearing about quite a few Plebes that are up for academic review after their first semester (having failed one or more classes). Add to the daily grind a sport/athletics, study time, tutoring, inspections, ECs, academy-wide events, and illness/injury, homesickness, stress .... while some candidates may see themselves primarily as leaders and athletes, they need to remember that academics are at the forefront and a required success for graduation.
 
Well said ca2midwestmom!! The surprising thing to me is that USNA seems to be lowering their minimums based on the class profiles that are published every year. People say that they are the "best and brightest", yet many of those admitted would never even be close to getting into an Ivy school with their test scores. Would love to know if USNA is lowering their standards to allow for athletes and underrepresented groups. If they really want the "best and brightest", all admitted students would score an ACT 32+ on both the Math and English.
 
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Would you want your son/daughter fighting in battle under someone who "does not do well under pressure"?!?!
I would not. I am curious if you believe the standards are being lowered for the athletes and underrepresented groups?
I happen to believe that athletics (as well as academics) can help a person under pressure. Imagine the pressure of kicking a field goal or stopping the opposing team on your 1 yard line for a win or hitting the shot at the last second for the win! There is pressure in all areas of life.
 
I believe that there has to be a balance of great athleticism and academics. What I meant by that comment is that when they publish the class profile, I am guessing that the lowest 25% in terms of standardized test scores may be recruited athletes and underrepresented groups. I think the ideal candidate would be an excellent athlete AND show excellence in academics. If the academy can't find 1200 candidates across the whole US that fit that category, then that is a real problem. I currently have a firstie who played football and who happened to be very gifted academically. (Not my doing, he excelled all on his own). He was dismayed by many of his classmates who could not even begin to comprehend plebe math and science. Many just barely made it through with C-, and many had to attend summer school because they failed classes. He also said there were some that breezed through the classes, but could not pass the PRT. (That is the physical test that they have to pass every year). Seems like that academy would want to find those candidates who would excel in both areas... the "best and brightest", right?!
 
Well said ca2midwestmom!! The surprising thing to me is that USNA seems to be lowering their minimums based on the class profiles that are published every year. People say that they are the "best and brightest", yet many of those admitted would never even be close to getting into an Ivy school with their test scores. Would love to know if USNA is lowering their standards to allow for athletes and underrepresented groups. If they really want the "best and brightest", all admitted students would score an ACT 32+ on both the Math and English.

I think they try to strike a balance which I am sure is very tough. If they accepted only the brightest (ala Ivy League stats) there would not be enough people who had the other attributes that are needed, like athleticism, leadership etc. On the other hand if you choose people who are exceptional with respect to the latter attributes then there wouldn't be enough of a pool of candidates who were also in the top percentiles academically/test score-wise.

If you look at the mid 50 percentile test scores, for example, you will see that the NA is still very high, just not as high as the Ivies etc. (which I wouldn't expect them to be). USNA has a middle 50%ile range of 1180-1380 for math and CR combined. By comparison, UVA is 1250-1460 and Penn is 1360-1550. That is not a big difference. If you go by percentages, then the average NA appointee is in the 84th percentile for math and 82nd for CR. For UVA it is 87 and 91. Penn boasts a 93rd and 90th percentile.

I think you can sum it up by saying that NA appointees are, [strong]on average[/strong], very, very intelligent but not geniuses. If you set the minimum at 32 ACT (or 1400-1430) you would certainly have the "best and brightest" but that standard would far eclipse even the average Ivy League school (Penn's average, for example, is only 1380 but in your example a roughly 1420 would be needed for a minimum admission). I just don't see that as being possible.

Edit- cross posted with CAmid
 
I don't know any kids with 32+ ACT scores that really do anything of note outside of academics (Im sure in other towns there are). I have a 1350 SAT (not a bad score), that doesn't mean i'm "less intelligent", I simply had to devote more time too athletics, Boy Scouts, EMT service, ect. Does being well rounded not make me "the best and the brightest"... I guess thats the age old question. You can have great academics, or you can be more well rounded. For those who have achieved both, more power to you :D
 
I don't know any kids with 32+ ACT scores that really do anything of note outside of academics (Im sure in other towns there are). I have a 1350 SAT (not a bad score), that doesn't mean i'm "less intelligent", I simply had to devote more time too athletics, Boy Scouts, EMT service, ect. Does being well rounded not make me "the best and the brightest"... I guess thats the age old question. You can have great academics, or you can be more well rounded. For those who have achieved both, more power to you :D

I do.

My comment was aimed more at setting up candidates (future cadets/mids) for academic failure. Since we all know GPA is subjective by high school, which directly influences class ranking at each high school, using the ACT/SAT puts everyone on a level playing field since the same tests are used nationwide. So a candidate who may have done well in high school with a 4.0, taking up to pre-calc or even calc, but getting an average math score on a standardized test is still going to take the same math classes at the SAs as the student who was able to take AP Calc BC in high school. Same goes for English and chemistry classes. There is some wiggle room with the first class level a cadet/mid may start in at the SA, but being thrown into a calc or pre-calc class when math isn't your strong suit, along with 4 other classes and all of the other requirements and distractions I listed above, is not going to be easy. I think some candidates don't realize how tough the academics are or can be once you get into a SA. Yes, there is tutoring and additional instruction available, but those things are the responsibility of the cadet/mid to work into his/her schedule along with everything else. I think candidates who receive appointments need to go into this with eyes wide open -- if you received an appointment with average/above average grades & test scores, you will need to work harder than you ever have academically. Good luck to all 2019 appointees!
 
a couple of disagrees.

I don't know any kids with 32+ ACT scores that really do anything of note outside of academics :D
My son had a 36 Math ACT and 34 English ACT and was the Goalie on the team that came in second in the nation, (a travel team so spent every wkend in a different state). He was president of clubs, 4.3 GPA. 200+ service hours blah blah blah. You will find at the Academy these kids are a dime a dozen



I am truly not trying to "stir the pot" here, but I think many studies have shown that the standardized test scores (especially if they have been taken multiple times with similar results) are a good indicator of academic success at a certain level.
My oldest tests exceptionally well in Math. In fact he took the ACT ~8 times but his Math score only varried from 34 to 36 on all of these tests. He entered USNA with a math ACT of 36. This was not an indicator of how well he would do at Math at the Academy. He is a slightly below-average-kid in a smart-kid major and is just 'hanging in there.' and he has to stay up all night studying just to be able to 'hang-in-there' Now he could quit his sports team, or he could change his major, but instead he is trying to do it all and it is simply ok. This is Not reflective of a 36 math ACT really.
 
I believe that there has to be a balance of great athleticism and academics. What I meant by that comment is that when they publish the class profile, I am guessing that the lowest 25% in terms of standardized test scores may be recruited athletes and underrepresented groups. I think the ideal candidate would be an excellent athlete AND show excellence in academics. If the academy can't find 1200 candidates across the whole US that fit that category, then that is a real problem. I currently have a firstie who played football and who happened to be very gifted academically. (Not my doing, he excelled all on his own). He was dismayed by many of his classmates who could not even begin to comprehend plebe math and science. Many just barely made it through with C-, and many had to attend summer school because they failed classes. He also said there were some that breezed through the classes, but could not pass the PRT. (That is the physical test that they have to pass every year). Seems like that academy would want to find those candidates who would excel in both areas... the "best and brightest", right?!
My plebe just finished his first semester at USNA. His his company class finished 25th out of 30, up from 28th at the 12 week mark. They had 3 kids with 4.0's, but also 3 mids under a 1.5. They have lost cell phone privileges during study period and have to be in an academic building for that period. They have 9 out of 30 that are unsat right now. He was shocked at how many kids were struggling. He also said they have one of the highest number of recruited athletes in his company. He said the reality is that different standards apply to different groups. He said he doubted he would have received an appointment if he hadn't had a principal nom and he had a 720/770 superscored SAT and all the other stuff. He feels very ordinary compared to most of his shipmates.
 
On my application I sent in my ACT and it only should my Math and Reading scores, and yes they superscore them. I'm certain for the SAT they only look at Math and Critical Reading!
USNA Candidate

I asked my admissions counselor on the phone about if the ACT is comprised of only the reading section and math section. Is this true? I can't find it anywhere on the web unless they just changed the rules this year? I talked to him over the phone, so I feel that there might have been misinterpretation in the conversation. I kept saying this isn't English, this is reading. He said it was reading so I took his word for it. Please tell me it's not the English section and that it's the reading section like he told me... Math and reading section for both act and sat?

Thank you in advance.
 
My plebe just finished his first semester at USNA. His his company class finished 25th out of 30, up from 28th at the 12 week mark. They had 3 kids with 4.0's, but also 3 mids under a 1.5. They have lost cell phone privileges during study period and have to be in an academic building for that period. They have 9 out of 30 that are unsat right now. He was shocked at how many kids were struggling. He also said they have one of the highest number of recruited athletes in his company. He said the reality is that different standards apply to different groups. He said he doubted he would have received an appointment if he hadn't had a principal nom and he had a 720/770 superscored SAT and all the other stuff. He feels very ordinary compared to most of his shipmates.

Hearing the same from my firstie. My son received an appt with an ACT 35 Math and 34 English. He had all the other things to make him stand out (captain of two varsity sports, took every AP class offered, 4.3 GPA, tons of service hours, etc., etc., etc... So he was a "rock star" in high school, and yes, at the Academy he is "average".
 
My son had his CVW in September, and I had a chance to meet dozens of Plebes and Midshipmen at differing years of attendance. While having dinner in Annapolis, we were fortunate enough to be setting next to a large table of 4 Midshipmen seniors and some parents. A conversation started and they found out that our DS was a candidate at USNA in for his CVW. The first question that the senior Midshipmen asked was what my sons ACT was, and I told them 30, 31 superscore. They all laughed, I asked why? They had all received a 30, and one them, was the number 4 Midshipmen in the senior class academically.

You can be a great success at any of the academies with a good ACT/SAT and the ability to know how to study and use your time appropriately. If your DS or DD has made it this far without rejection and still waiting on LOA or BFE, they are special and have the ability to be very successful at the academies.
 
I was just trying to give some insight into the ACT numbers. I didn't really talk with them about their lives before the academy. They were from all over the country and were fine young men. I had the chance to talk with numerous young men and women at both USNA and USAFA, they were all excellent representatives of our country. I was more interested in life at the Naval Academy, so we talked at length about that. I asked every young man and woman the same question, what is the best thing about being here? 99% answered the essentially answered the question the same, the other young people they attend with. There is a very strong bond amongst them all.
 
It is the English and Math score for the ACT, not the reading. Ask anyone who is a current candidate to check their portal to verify. English is what shows up on the application portal when you send your scores from ACT to USNA. Best of luck. Keep taking the test, and if it is a hardship get a waiver from your guidance counselor so you can take it again.
 
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