Side load scholarships

Discussion in 'ROTC' started by jiller59, Jan 31, 2013.

  1. jiller59

    jiller59 Member

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    This is kind of related to kinnem's thread about summer training cuts. My DS told me last night that the college programmers in his NROTC unit are being told that there will not be money for college programmers to get scholarships.

    I explained Advanced Standing to DS, to help him understand that lack of scholarship doesn't mean the college programmers will necessarily be out after sophmore year (he has made friends with a college programmer in his batallion and will be his room mate next school year). I also mentioned what we are constantly reminded of on this forum - what happens this year could be different next year.

    At any rate, this must be very disheartening news to those who have taken the college programmer route. :frown:

    Any other words of wisdom?
     
  2. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    I am not shocked to hear that with the DoD cuts looming. Let's be honest Panetta only announced a few weeks ago because of sequestration he wants detailed plans on how they will accomplish this.

    ROTC scholarships and summer training are easy cuts compared to training missions for AD members.

    Great example, decades ago, AFROTC had a program called Fish Pod (Flight Screening Program). Cadets went their rising sr. yr if they had a rated slot. In the 90's when we had the last hard budget cuts, that program was killed, and they created IFS (Initial Flight Screening), this occurred after commissioning prior to UPT.

    AF has now stated if the UPT student has a PPL, they will waive IFS starting this yr. It saves them money all around. IFS is a TDY, so you have that budget issue, more importantly JP8 fuel is not cheap. A student with a PPL already has solo'd 3 weeks at Pueblo should not be a make or break for them. It was truly a cost benefit analysis.

    People tend to forget that although their mission is to protect this country, they operate like any business and it comes down to dollars and cents, best bang for their buck. When they don't have money, they have to cut. ROTC is an easy target.

    As far as any words of wisdom, timing is everything. Ask anyone who survived the 90's budget cuts with VSSP, RIF and SERB, there were great officers let go for no other reason than the yr they commissioned was on the chopping block. There were crappy officers that stayed in because their yr was not on the chopping block.

    They had no control over the yr they entered this earth. It is just part of fate.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2013
  3. vadad

    vadad Member

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    Poking around the web I found this information for Navy option NROTC. I can't find anything current for marine option though. The services all did quite a few RIFs in the mid 80's (86-87) courtesey of Graham Ruddman (sending ROTC graduates to the reserves, curtailing training etc.).

    Source: NSTC Notice 1533 12/12/12

    Document also includes "Side-load" target scholarship numbers for YG15,16 and 17

    YG 15: 202 2-year
    YG 16: 51 3-year and 119 2 year
    YG 17: 93 3 year and 119 2 year
     
  4. kinnem

    kinnem Moderator

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    It is sooo sad to hear this. I think you're correct that the thing to do is hang in there and shoot for Advanced Standing. You're right that things could be different next year - or not - but if its the dream, you have to keep shooting for it and hope a way turns up. If budget cuts impact Advanced Standing next year then backup plans would include PLC and OCS for Marine Options. Even if it comes to that, the time spent in ROTC would be an added benefit and be a leg up over others in these commissioning programs. If things truly go from worse to worse I suppose there is always enlistment after college and then working your way to a commission through the ranks.

    Things look pretty grim right now, but in this uncertain world things could change overnight. There is always a chance the sequester won't happen. And I'm pretty sure peace will not be breaking out everywhere anytime soon. I expect the cuts will probably be reversed out of necessity at some point - only question in my mind is when. Keep your eyes on the prize. :thumb:

    I know this isn't very cheery or helpful, but the midshipmen need to focus on what they can control and not worry about what they can't control. And all this is clearly out of their control. All that being said, with 20,000 Marines being cut over four years, the need for 2LTs is going to drop. Hopefully, most of that cut will come from PLC and OCS for Marine Options and Advanced Standing will be used to reward, and retain, the best. I have to feel it's the faint of heart who will drop by the wayside. The competition will be fierce and if possible one will need to dig a bit deeper to make the grade. Where there is a will, there is a way! :thumb:

    Edit: Even if budgets remain cut, priorities within those budget constraints can change.
     
  5. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    FWIW, I don't think sequestration will happen. Thank you elected officials, especially Congressman. Their political future is on the line. If you think MD/VA, TX, or CA will put party over their survival I have a bridge in NY to sell you.

    One of the things already announced is GS employees will be furloughed for 22 work days. More than a month, and if it has to be completed by Sept 30th, it is basically every 6 weeks and 1 week of no pay. In VA/MD you basically will feel the wrath. Most bases have more GSs than you can imagine. I believe the total for GS is 880K employees. That is a lot that can't get unemployment, and will be digging into their savings to pay the bills. Mtg rule of thumb is 1 week, that equals what they will lose. For Bullet, he was forced to convert to GS because of Obama's decision back in 10, and now we will have to dig into our own savings because he is now a GS. It wasn't his choice to leave L3, it was the politicians if he wanted to keep his job in 10. It will now be the politicians that decide if we are out a months salary as a GS 15. My MOCs are D's. I won't blame the R's, I will blame my MOCs that played chicken with me paying the price. I am betting Gerry Connolly gets the wrath he will be feeling if he plays chicken.

    They are now messing with constituents livelihood. It becomes even more of an issue since many are retirees, and Tri-Care premiums increasing are also another option. In essence, they will not pay them for a month and to keep their insurance pay higher premiums. Pitiance regarding premiums, but when you lose pay, that premium matters.

    ROTC is the easiest cut for the DoD to get through the Hill.

    ROTC is college related with little impact on the economy except for the recipients that have the scholarship. Colleges will survive.

    Kill the 35, which the Navy and Marines both are on the hook for, impacts the towns that make the 35. Yes, Lockheed is the builder, but they sub-contract too. Paint, fiberglass, computer chips, parachutes, leather seats, etc are made all across the country. There will be MOCs that will work across the aisle because the main employer in their district relies on the F35 contract for employment.

    Hence, why I see the DoD budget/sequestration will become a factor in the
    debt ceiling equation.

    I do see Hagel with his beltway experience cutting for the Just In Case as the SoD. What we don't know his how he views reactionary forces, like kinnem stated the constraints can change. He may decide he wants more emphasis on Marines and less on Army. He may decide Navy is the way to go and cut AF.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2013
  6. terp1984

    terp1984 Member

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    Don't take what someone heard as the absolute truth. The NSTC directives are only 45 days old and I don't think are incorrect. There may not be money for all college programmers but I don't believe they would cut all side loads. In fact for my sons class of 2014 they added additional side load scholarships. This of course IMHO.
     
  7. jiller59

    jiller59 Member

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    Any idea how side-load scholarships are allocated across all schools?

    DS is YG16 - perhaps his battalion has information that they will not be getting any of the 53 3-year scholarships available and that is why DS heard "no scholarships". His friend would be looking for one of the 3 year scholarships.
     
  8. kinnem

    kinnem Moderator

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    Is it possible that it's just no sideload scholarships for Marine Option? I would also add, anything can change at anytime.
     
  9. Jcleppe

    Jcleppe Member

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    The loss of a 277 million dollar ship, plus the cost to cut it up, doesn't help the Navy's budget woes much either.

    I agree, this is going to be a tough year in terms of scholarships and training until the budget mess gets handled. MOC's sure like to let us all dangle in the wind while they make the Sunday morning talk show rounds.

    Best of luck.
     
  10. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    I agree with Jcleppe.

    I am sure they have a "floater" regarding the budget like we have with our checking accounts, but 1/4 of a BILLION is going to hurt the budget. Add in replacement cost for the ship, equipment costs to try to salvage it, costs to cut it up, and guarantee security from a Navy Intel issue, plus the cost the Phillipine govt are charging the US for damage to the reef, that tally will be much higher.

    Every penny adds up. IF the final tally is 500 MN, and they only had 400 MN, 100 MN is short.


    You are a CFO, where do you find the money, while you also know cuts may or may not becoming. You need to maintain personnel level at the same time.
     
  11. kinnem

    kinnem Moderator

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    I spoke with DS tonight and he was unable to confirm the statement that opened this thread about there being no sideload scholarships this semester. Their Lab was this afternoon so if they were going to make a general comment I would have thought it would be then. Of course they might be informing folks individually.
     

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