We tend to discuss extreme options only, but there are acceptable 1/2 solutions. I am not suggstion background check on all members or monitor posts, but if moderators can notice that a forum is getting too personal, modeators can investigate certain posters (As they have full discretion).
Stolen Valor
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We tend to discuss extreme options only, but there are acceptable 1/2 solutions. I am not suggstion background check on all members or monitor posts, but if moderators can notice that a forum is getting too personal, modeators can investigate certain posters (As they have full discretion).
Is it relevent? Do we ask other posters why they joined? There is a member that wrote a book about SA admission process, did she join the forum to sell her book, from the forum got the idea to sell the book, or join the forum to conduct research. I DON'T CARE why she joined or how she used her membership to this forum.
Regardless, why TASheehan joined, he or she has much rights as you and me to post with the rules of the forum. I see more than likely this forum getting shut down pretty soon because "it has run its course," "it's not helping candidates," or "getting 'nasty."
I think this discussion will make this forum better as we are asking some tough questions about this forum.
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Unless the by law is changed, moderators have full discreation. I see as something like a child "demanding" to her parents that she should allowed to stay up late instead of asking to stay up late. We have no levearge.
If I remember correctly (and remember I'm an old man!) Justin Facts was the initial poster that exposed TPG. And if I remember correctly both Justin Facts and TPG were banned. I could be wrong but that's what I remember.
As far as the entire forum running it's course that would be a shame. I know that I have personally received help on the SA process from this site and yes there is a social element because we are human and we do tend to make that connection even if its on a online forum.
TASheehan thank you for making this post. I think if we stick to the discussion of these goals (in a friendly manner) I think we can have a good discussion that may help the moderators make their decision. I strongly believe that the moderators are discussing the options and will address the concerns with TASheehan. It may take a while but I think they will but it may not be what we all think the answers should be. At that point it is up to us to decided if we want to stay around or leave.
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And we're to believe "Justin Facts" wasn't a TASheehan related person? A plant?
NorwichDad
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How bout them NY Mets!
TASheehan
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Almost correct, but good. Yes, Justin Facts was the original poster that voiced his concerns to the owner/admin/moderaters. Justin Facts was banned and cited the reason "Too many private messages to the admin/moderators." This was just after he was told that TPG was free to keep posting, entirely up to him. TPG was never banned. As I said, TPG may now have been banned now because of member suggestions in this thread.
We feel that it was the right thing to do to bring attention to TPG in private and felt confident it would be handled internally. We were shocked when Justin Facts was instead admonished and banned, while support for TPG continued citing a policy of not getting involved in disputes between posters. We never really had a dispute as the post that Justin Facts made was immediately removed which consisted of a respectful inquiry to TPG for more information as things he was saying did not line up with the facts. My belief is that since TPG was an established member and the claims made against him were hard to believe, banning Justin Facts was the quickest route to putting this all behind them. I feel that there was opportunity to handle this better.
Now, after much work was put into this vs. resolving it quickly... TPG was exposed and I'm questioned about my presence here. We're here to offer suggestions to how this can be prevented in the future. Some may call them "demands", sure, but we believe we're in a position of strength and have some bargaining power.
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TASheehan
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That's good. ;-) Do you have aspirations to be an investigator? My rule of thumb is 'Never ask a question that I can find the answer to myself.' Usually when I do ask a question I already know the answer, I just want to see how they respond to the question.
Google is your friend.
Am I reading this tread correctly in that this entire SA forum is in jeopardy of being shut down due to the false postings of some idiot and the demands of the person that exposed him??? W in the TF is that about??? I have no clue who these two are and I frankly don't care. This is to the MODs, GODs or whoever in charge of this forum: THIS FORUM IS INVALUABLE, INVALUABLE TO THOSE SEEKING ADVICE REGARDING SA’S, ROTC PROGRAMS AND DODMERB. Without this forum I am not sure my son would be in ROTC. The information gleaned here regarding his DoDMERB DQ was very, very helpful in helping him get his DQ waived. I will also say the information I have been able to pass on to others via PM has made their journey much easier navigating the DoDMERB DQ process. I have no doubt that literally hundreds of cadets, midshipmen and their parents owe a debt of gratitude to this forum and its posters for its guidance. It would be a travesty to shut this site down.
Freda'sMom
10-Year Member
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Hence my disappointment at the actions of the forum. Stolen valor should never be tolerated, and the whistle-blower should not be subjected to such harsh treatment for doing something we all (I hope) approve of - exposing a phony war hero and phony disabled US Marine.
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That's not a whistle-blower...
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No, I didn't Google you. I'll walk you through my thought process, but before I do, I need to state again that I'm fine with TPG being exposed and banned from this site.
What feels like long ago a new member, "Justin Facts" I guess, joined SAF. He immediately started questioning TPG. Now, from my understanding "Justin Facts" was an applicant. He was a kid working on a project. I don't remember get into the history threads so, while I took a look, I didn't really follow where it went. I found it interesting that the "kid" came out of no where, and instead of diving into the service academy aspects of this site, asked questions, which seemed innocent enough, but then provided more information that I would expect a high school student to have. That's essentially where I left it. I wasn't aware that TPG or "Justin Facts" had been banned. I saw the signature change on TPG, but I thought it was some kind of joke.
I have no idea how long ago this was…
and now TASheehan joins SAF, and immediately lights into it too. Now, maybe TASheehan is "Justin Facts" and wasn't happy about being banned. Or maybe TASheehan is associated with "Justin Facts" in some other way. No matter what the relationship between the two screen names is, the approach was the same, drop in here…. and go to work. TASheehan seems to think people enjoy being snooped around on…. that people appreciate "it took our team 10-15 minutes to discover you…." or that TASheehan has some kind of authority or credibility here.
I guess, I question motive. TASheehan states he/she came from other forums. OK, that's fine. What brought TASheehan here? A search of TPG maybe? So, did TASheehan arrive to SAF as "Justin Facts"? Did TASheehan pose as an applicant to get TPG to did his hole deeper? Well, it's certainly an approach, however dishonest it may be. Did TASheehan set a little trap (not to be confused with entrapment, but that's an interesting road to go down) for TPG to fall into?
And if TASheehan was associated with "Justin Facts" why not mention that fact when TASheehan reappears on SAF? Why play dumb? "Our organization….. we….. our team….." as if it's one giant, dishonest organization. Why not "Hey, TPG was a liar, now you know."
With that knowledge, do you think anyone is on TPG's side here? We don't like being lied to. I no more appreciate TPG's lies and TASheehan's half-truths.
And honestly, is this a case of "the ends justify the means?" Maybe. I'm not sure. TASheehan plays a game of deception to out a deceiver. That doesn't mean those of us standing on the sidelines will appreciate it. Sorry.
But at the end of the day, I come back to motivation. Was TPG gaining anything here, from his lies? I don't think so. If he figured out how to monetize his time here, I'd sure like to know his secret. So, if the only thing TPG gained here was some sense of accomplishment, inside, well, that says something. And the damage he did? I think he hurts the credibility of all posters here. I think we'll all second-guess what we hear (as we probably should…. this is the internet). I think applicants could be led astray by TPG. But I also wonder, what is TASheehan's motivation? Is it to out a liar? Boom, that's been done. Is it to save SAF users from misinformation? Boom, that's kind of been done now too. Is it to drive site traffic somewhere else? Is it to highlight the other things TASheehan has done?
If I went to a random site, which I had not been a member of a week before, with the idea that it was time to out someone, and then got defensive about people questioning my motives, I hope you would take a closer look. If I wanted you to be interviewed by the press, I hope you'd ask what my angle was….
Maybe it's a personal project. Maybe there something a little more concrete at work here. I don't know. I know I'm OK with TPG being banned. I know it's good to be informed someone is doing something like TPG did. I'm not sure I agree with the means to that end.
So, that's been my thought process here. I'm confused. Maybe that's the point. I think when someone wants to be transparent and clear they can be. When they're bobbing and weaving questions, and giving cryptic responses…. they're either hiding something or hoping to appear they have something to hide.
EDelahanty
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I applaud the effort that went into exposing tpg's apparently fictional autobiography. Most of us were gulled. Regrettably, tpg also provided advice on various schools, if i recall correctly. If I am not mistaken, tpg's posts have been removed, at least those that were not incorporated into replies by other people.
I am fine with tpg being banned. Unless he is a major nuisance, I have no problem with Justin Facts being unbanned. An exception to that is if his middle name is Bieber.
I am fine with tpg being banned. Unless he is a major nuisance, I have no problem with Justin Facts being unbanned. An exception to that is if his middle name is Bieber.
Pima
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In essence the way I read it is you are holding this site for hostage.
I get your position, truly I do, but I disagree with your method of creating fear now among posters. To recap, and please correct me if I am wrong you want the following to be completed by the owner of this site:
Now here is my question for you: Is this site violating any law? If so, which ones and what are those laws?
If not than the way I see it is SAF is TN's baby and he has the right to raise it the way he chooses. IE. If you say that they are not according to a law that a disclaimer must be placed, than I think you are in the right, but if it is not than impo it would be the equivalent of telling a parent that they must send their child to pre-school.
~ Good suggestion, but by law you can't enforce it.
I am kind of awe struck at all of this. In almost a decade of being around, and only 1 poster that was a poser out of over 20K, you have decided to make it an all attack on this site. JMPO, and with $ 2.07 you can get a small cup of coffee at Starbucks, this has more to do with your anger/issues with TN. You have decided to draw a line in the sand and if the members here pay the price, so be it, not your fault in your mind. In your eyes TN did it.
~ FWIW, in my eyes and mind, it was your fault. I wouldn't blame TN at all.
Finally in response to this post:
1. Social club:
~ Many of us have created friendships.
~~ OMG kill us for laughing and joking around with each other! As you know the military life is unique. Many of these posters don't have friends or family that understands this life.
~~~ I indeed am proud to be part of it. I have had posters celebrate holidays with my family because they show up in this area and can't go home for the holidays, instead they come to my home.
~~ CC is known here to be at Thudgate.
2. Mean and ugly
~ Kind of funny that you say that. If I read your posts right aren't you being mean and ugly to this site and their members with that post? Did you not try to pick off posters here with the lure of media attention to go against TN and this site?
3. Low level of discourse
~ Seeing as I am probably one of those people you are talking about, I can say and swear on my Myrtle that I have seen them do the following:
~~ Fair warning folks stop the personal attacks, if you don't we will lock the thread.
~~~ Followed with this thread has run its' course and is now officially locked. Only happened last week on the SA parents FB thread.
4. Showing professionalism vs food fight to younger posters:
~ See above.
~~ The funny thing is if you have lurked on the USAFA forum you would see references to baseops.net. Please do me a favor check it out. They have a ROTC forum there. So while you are up in that ivory tower looking down, maybe you should see this is a very kind site and spoon feeds posters compared to other sites. Heck, have you started to investigate baseops.net for their posers or is it just SAF that you have it in for?
Now finally, my personal story and why I believe in this site and TN. Years ago, a poster personally attacked in a pm. They suggested that we should do the honorable thing like Admiral Boorda. Google him. Imagine opening a pm and reading that! I pm'd the mods, and received a pm from TN apologizing for that pain. He was banned immediately. He came back, and shortly after people put 2+2 together and banned again. He tried again for a 3 rd time, and immediately banned.
All that keeps running through my mind is WHY? If we all moved on over this subject why do you honestly care? You have stated you have no child attempting to attend an SA or ROTC. We have no problem with no disclaimer. Heck, most posters, me included will start a response that we do not sit on any board. I doubt anyone thinks there is any connection.
~ You know what I am now going to start a poll to see if I am right.
TN and mods, you asked on the community feedback about this new set up compared to the old. I think you might want to go back to the green, yellow and red dot next to the posters name.
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"WE feel that it was the right thing to do to bring attention to TPG in private and felt confident it would be handled internally. "
TA Sheehan, who is this "we" from your quote?
TA Sheehan, who is this "we" from your quote?
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And TA SHeehan, how many of your children have attended any US SA? (Do you know what that acronym means?)
If some of us are social with each other, what do you care, and what business is it of yours? If you want to come over to the Steeler Nation and enjoy a Yuengling on my porch, you may, but be prepared totally defend any poop you're shoveling.
Mean and ugly? Oh, I forgot. These aspirants want flowers and unicorns, because that's all they need to protect and defend our great nation.
Go over to College Confidential; they tend to be a bit nicer there and you'll feel right at home.
If some of us are social with each other, what do you care, and what business is it of yours? If you want to come over to the Steeler Nation and enjoy a Yuengling on my porch, you may, but be prepared totally defend any poop you're shoveling.
Mean and ugly? Oh, I forgot. These aspirants want flowers and unicorns, because that's all they need to protect and defend our great nation.
Go over to College Confidential; they tend to be a bit nicer there and you'll feel right at home.
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TASheehan
Banned
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That's not true. There was no misrepresentation at all and it is unfair of you to suggest this. Justin Facts immediately identified himself and his intent behind the scenes to the owner/admin/moderators.
The rest of your post is a fishing expedition. I'm not biting, sorry.
I've given you many answers to your questions, which are usually prompted by the fact that you are confused or you insinuate wrongdoing on my part so I must come clean or be guilty of X, Y and Z. If you want more answers, do some research. You'll trust what you are able to discover far more than what people tell you anyway, unless you've known somebody for years and a trust is established.
I'm used to being on forums where we know who each other are. There is no need to be cryptic and talk in code. Here, according to rules set forth, it is the nature of the beast. Although I don't understand the need for it, I'll learn to appreciate it and abide by it. Maybe this understanding will come over time.
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I was trying to find the old posts but they're gone. I certainly don't remember Justin Facts being anything close to direct. I just wish I could go back and look.
That said, you've done nothing to make anyone here trust you. That's not my fault. It's yours.
And unless you choose to change that, I can't see there being anything other than a question mark next to your name.
That said, you've done nothing to make anyone here trust you. That's not my fault. It's yours.
And unless you choose to change that, I can't see there being anything other than a question mark next to your name.
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TASheehan, you accuse LITS of fishing? OMG, you are the one with the rod and worm.
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