University of Cincinnati Army Rotc

Discussion in 'ROTC' started by Patriot95, Oct 13, 2012.

  1. Patriot95

    Patriot95 Member

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    I'm a junior in high school and I live in Cincinnati, Ohio. I am positive I want to go into Army Rotc when I get into to college and I don't just want to go to any school. I want to attend a university that has a good Rotc program. I was looking at the University of Cincinnati's Army Rotc program and it says on their page that they have been awarded the MacArthur Award and that their Rotc program is in the top 8 of 273. I just wanted to know if anyone knew anything about their program. Also I want to receive a 4 year scholarship if possible and was wondering how hard it is to get one?
     
  2. Melitzank

    Melitzank Member

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    If you`re looking for a good ROTC program, I`d suggest the Senior Military College`s (SMC`s):

    -Texas A&M
    -Norwich University
    -Virginia Military Institute
    -Virginia Tech
    -North Georgia College & State University
    -The Citadel

    I`m not trying to dissuade you from University of Cincinnati, but the SMC`s are considered the best as far as ROTC programs.
     
  3. Patriot95

    Patriot95 Member

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    Do you have to pay for senior military colleges and what is the difference between Army Rotc and the senior military colleges?
     
  4. Melitzank

    Melitzank Member

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    SMC`s do have tuition, but you can receive a ROTC scholarship for that. SMC`s are different from regular civilian institutes because the cadets have to be more involved in ROTC and wear their uniforms to class every day. At every SMC besides VT and A&M, every student has to participate in ROTC. At VT and A&M, they`re civilian schools that have regular students there too who aren`t in ROTC.

    SMC`s are in between ROTC at regular colleges and service academies.

    Here`s a good thread about the differences between regular colleges and SMC`s: http://www.serviceacademyforums.com/showthread.php?t=23622
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2012
  5. gojack

    gojack ....

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    I'm also from Cincinnati, my son visited UC AROTC and was very impressed.
    He spent quite a bit of time w/cadets there, and decided the campus was too quiet on nights/weekends, as many students go home to sleep. Crime is a significant problem around campus as well. (Muggings, many go unreported)

    Depends on what you are looking for, Ohio State, Ohio University, Bowling Green, Wright State, Xavier also have very good AROTC programs... My son was most impressed by OSU and Xavier, of the OH AROTC programs.

    At a SMC you are guaranteed AD upon completion/graduation.
    A graduate from the Citadel and UC both join the Army as 2nd Lt's, their Gold bars are no different.
    No one is going to think a North Georgia Grad is somehow better than a Vanderbilt Grad, but their college experiences would be quite different... what are you looking for?
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2012
  6. kinnem

    kinnem Moderator

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    A Senior Military College is just like any college in that you have to pay for it. Some SMCs offer "free" Room and Board to ROTC students. Some offer in-state tuition rates to ROTC students.

    The main difference between someplace like Cincinnati and an SMC is the military life style. You might think of an SMC as a hybrid between a normal college experience and attending one of the country's Military Academies. Each has a Corps of Cadets. At some (eg. VMI) everyone is in the Corps of Cadets. At others (eg. VA Tech) the Corps of Cadets represents a small but significant percentage of the total student body. Not everyone who is in the Corps of Cadets is in ROTC or even interested in going into the military. VA Tech is an example of a program that includes a "Leadership Program" for such individuals. In any case, if you're in the Corps of Cadets, you'll be in uniform every day, all day. You'll be in regular PT, there are AM formations, study hours, lights out, and "plebe challenges" similar to what you would find at the service academies. For example, incoming cadets at VA Tech are not allowed to make right (or is it left?) turns when walking. (I think VMI does this too). This can sometimes make getting to class or a restroom a bit of a challenge.

    (Edit: adding a little to describe normal ROTC - uniforms 1 day per week, mandatory study hours only if you're not performing academically, 1 military/naval science class a semester, lab (formation) once a week, you go to bed when you want, you still get up at 0'dark:30 for PT, and nothing crazy about whether you can turn right or left.)

    In regard to your earlier question about how difficult it is to get a ROTC scholarship. It ain't bean bag. Many ROTC applicants also apply to the nation's service academies. If you check the service academy web site's for their stats on their incoming class you will get some idea of the competition and what you should be shooting for. That being said, all ROTC scholarship holders do not meet these standards, but they aren't far off either, for the most part. That being said I also know of folks who got scholarships that have me scratching my head :scratch: wondering how. :bang: But then again, those folks usually leave the program during their freshman year.

    Use the service academy stats as a guideline on what to shoot for in terms of scholarship/leadership/athletics. Figure out which ROTC program you would be interested in. Apply online in the spring of your junior year. The process is lengthy and its best to get started in the spring so you can line up teacher recommendations, etc. prior to your summer break. Selection boards begin meeting in September (depending on the ROTC program) so you want to get your application in during the early autumn.

    Oh yeah, visit the schools you'll be interested in this year or over the summer. Try to meet with the officers in the ROTC units and get an idea about their programs. In essence, within a service branch, each program is essentially the same. The cadets/midshipmen actually run the program under the leadership and guidance of the officer/enlisted cadre stationed there. One school may have more opportunities for field training due to the proximity of a base near their college. Others may have more emphasis on the drill team compared to another college. Undoubtedly unit size and enthusiasm will vary, as evidenced by Cincinnati's MacArthur Award.

    ROTC is not for the faint of heart. The time demands, especially as you take on more leadership responsibilities will test your time management skills. You will be getting up at 0'dark:30 for PT and your body will be physically tested. But the rewards for going through this are priceless. And if you don't get a scholarship, you can still enroll in ROTC and try to get an in-college ROTC scholarship.

    Investigate further and if you're still interested go for it! :thumb::thumb:
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2012
  7. Aglahad

    Aglahad Member

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    How are SMCs better than regular ROTC programs in terms of officer quality. Please enlighten, because I sure didn't notice a difference at LDAC.
     
  8. Melitzank

    Melitzank Member

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    No, that`s not what I meant at all. I`m sorry it came across as that way :redface:...he has previously asked about West Point, and now he asked about ROTC, so I was just suggesting a happy medium in case he hadn`t heard of them before, as I thought maybe he`d be interested in maybe the more of a service academy environment, but without the low acceptance rate of the service academies. I didn`t mean they produce better officers; both good and bad officers come from all commissioning sources. I just meant that the SMC`s offer a more rigorous environment, and might be good if he doesn`t want so much as the normal college experience and wants the structured environment of the SMC`s. I never meant that regular ROTC programs produced inadequate officers or anything like that.
     
  9. dunninla

    dunninla Member

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    I understand why you might feel this way, but I call BS on your lame backpedal that what you really meant was that it was meant to apply to THIS poster.

    You are perfectly OK to have this opinion, but "are considered" is short for "are considered by the majority". So, why to you think SMCs are considered by the majority to be better than ROTC at other colleges?
     
  10. Pima

    Pima Parent

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    I think they are better, and my DS did not go to an SMC.

    I believe they are better for many reasons, but the biggest reason is the fact that SMC's require the cadet/mid to be in the Corps. This requirement at a young age is important because they get a glimpse into their sister service's mission.

    As an O3/O4 in the AF they will be looking for a jt assignment/PME school. They will have spent 4 yrs training together, doing push ups at FB games together :wink:. Traditional ROTC cadets don't interact with other branches like they do.

    I am not disagreeing that ROTC units at traditional colleges aren't amazing. I am saying I agree why some, including me feel that for the best bang for your buck, they are the best asset we have for training future officers.
     
  11. cravius

    cravius Member

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    I'm going to have to disagree with you there. Sure Senior Military Colleges are more immersive in the military lifestyle, but they are by no means the best as far as ROTC programs go. For example, out of the top 10 cadets on this years OML, only one was from a SMC. The best indicator in my opinion, for good programs, is the success rate from LDAC and the % of cadets that get AD, branch of choice, ect. Remember, at an SMC you are competing for contracts from a much larger pool of candidates as well.
     
  12. Melitzank

    Melitzank Member

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    Dunninla, I didn`t mean it just applied to this poster, and I understand it might come off as a lame BS backpedal, and I was backpedaling a little--to be sure it was clear I didn`t think that regular ROTC programs produced inadequate or bad officers compared to the SMC`s. What I replied to was part of what Aglahad had said:

    What I had then written was referring to the fact that I didn`t think one produced better officers than the other.


    At the end, it does sound like I was saying that I thought that SMC`s aren`t better than ROTC or vice-versa. I believe that the SMC`s are better than regular ROTC, but I never meant that they produce better officers necessarily. Sorry if I offended anyone or made it sound like I was trying to please everyone by backpedaling and whatnot.

    I think SMC`s are better because you`re in the Corps Of Cadets 24/7, wearing your uniform every day to classes, and I think that it`s a more rigorous environment than regular ROTC. And while some of them like A&M are also large civilian schools in which not everyone has to participate in the Corps, you still have wearing the uniform every day, PT every day, and that type of thing. Does this mean I think one source produces better officers? No, not at all. Some of the very best officers have come from regular ROTC, while other have come from SMC`s. Personally, if I don`t get accepted to USNA, I think my first choice for a ROTC unit will not be at a SMC. If I really thought that SMC`s produced better officers, then I don`t think I`d want to attend any regular ROTC unit-I`d want to attend a SMC.

    In my reply to Aglahad, I had written that I didn`t think SMC`s produced better officers, so Dunninla, while I understand it seemed like a BS backpedal to try and say I didn`t think they were better, that wasn`t my intention. I was trying to say I didn`t think the SMC`s necessarily produced better officers. Ultimately, in my opinion, I think it`s up to the person. The best ROTC unit in the entire world at a regular college or SMC, couldn`t always produce the BEST officers in the world...it`s up to the cadet/mid, on the effort on which they put into becoming and being an officer, and how they do it. ROTC trains civilians, but that doesn`t mean it automatically makes them good officers. SMC`s offer better immersion into the military environment, which I think can be very helpful, especially for perhaps someone who doesn`t know for sure if they wish to be in the military. By going to a SMC, that can help them decide on whether or not they really want to be in the military. I feel like I`ve dug myself a hole by writing my previous posts :eek:, but honestly, all of what I`ve written above is the complete truth. No BS, just hopefully clearing up on what I think about the SMC`s vs. regular ROTC, and that when I replied to Aglahad`s post, it wasn`t my intention to backpedal and mean that I didn`t think the SMC`s were better, because I think they are.

    cravius, I respect your opinion, but I stand by what I said.

    I hope that clears up my stance on this subject. :thumb:
     
  13. clarksonarmy

    clarksonarmy Recruiting Operations Officer at Clarkson Army

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    Two things...every school is going to tell you they are the best/number 1/highly ranked/ the cat's pajamas. Clarkson is ranked #2 in the nation in percentage of students that participate in ROTC (by Washington Monthly). The McArthur award is given to the top school in each Brigade each year (8 brigades, hence top 8 for Cincy). Niagara is still touting the #1 ranking they got in 2004. You need to talk to and visit schools and make sure the school is the right fit. Being at a top program at a school that isn't a good fit is a recipe for disaster.

    On the subject of SMCs. A cadet at a normal ROTC program has to make a lot of decisions and choices on a daily basis that his peers at the SMC's don't have to make. In my mind the myth about the superior military experience provided by the SMC goes right along with the myth that going to basic training is going to make you a better officer. I just don't see it. But of course my view is from the Northern frontiers of freedom.
     
  14. cravius

    cravius Member

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    Believe me, I have spent a lot of time at A&M, and I got accepted and almost attended TAMU, but it is in NO way better than my civilian AROTC school. If anything, I feel that going to an SMC is a disadvantage, because you learn things the hard way at a civilian school; motivation must come from within, not because an upperclassmen is telling you when to study, eat sleep, ect. Again, it is hard to argue with results, and i you could provide some sort of metric showing the "advantage" of an SMC that would be great.
     
  15. Aglahad

    Aglahad Member

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    In order to not deviate too far from the original purpose of this thread I will say to the OP that wherever you go your ROTC experience will be very similar so you can't really make a bad decision nor can you go off of MacArthur Award winners (my school was one a couple years ago) to find the best school.

    For SMC I think they are better for certain types of people but I will repeat myself in saying that they do not produce any better cadets/officers than any other institution. A regimented lifestyle, more D&C and a 24/7 military environment just doesn't equal better or more experienced.

    Now for me personally I couldn't last at a SMC. Why? Not because I don't think I could hack it but in fear that I would become bitter about my 4 years of traditional college going out the window and the 24/7 military lifestyle. I like being around civilians and people that have differing ideas that don't involve the military (yes I do realize some SMCs have civilian contingents but it's still different) I don't view the military as a identity and I like separating myself from it. University ROTC provides that opportunity for me.

    As I said above, you can't really make a bad decision just think about what type of college experience you want.

    97133M,

    "Better" is a vague term to be thrown around here and explication is definitely needed if you want to say SMC>ROTC for any reason. It might be better for some but definitely not all.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2012
  16. Moosestache

    Moosestache Member

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    I think better may not be correct, but different is probably accurate. Some of those colleges are regarded top flight schools, some are not.
     
  17. HonorDutyCountry

    HonorDutyCountry Member

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    Great post
     
  18. HonorDutyCountry

    HonorDutyCountry Member

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    And that top 10 cadet, was placed #3. A product of VMI!:cool:
     

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