USMA's New Ranking - #4

Discussion in 'Military Academy - USMA' started by AKH, Aug 11, 2010.

  1. AKH

    AKH Member

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  2. Iwheel

    Iwheel Parent of

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    This #4 is still a powerful rank, well deserved.:thumb:
     
  3. Peter

    Peter Member

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    Just think about all the schools it ended up surpassing...the prestigious Harvard, Yale, Stanford, and it even placed ahead of its two sister schools...Navy and Air Force.
     
  4. edhvoice

    edhvoice Founding Member

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    4th

    The new ranking is great. The key is to hold it in the top 10. Great job doing that. The rankings placed USMA above many traditional elite schools. All of the service academies did very well. I am pleased that USMA got such an outstanding ranking, however I am also impressed with USAFA at 11 and USNA at 29. While it is great to "Beat Navy" it is also great to appreciate that all of the academies are providing top top tier educational opportunities to the future leaders of the United States of America.
     
  5. Iwheel

    Iwheel Parent of

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    USMA may not sound as prestigious to anyone. But look the % of its graduates earned graduate degrees from Harvard, Yale, Stanford etc. you know USMA has always been up on the top.
     
  6. freedomtruck

    freedomtruck Member

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    And the name is contending with the Ivy Leaguers as well. Especially overseas in other countries, just mention "West Point" and peoples' eyes will light up.
     
  7. scoutpilot

    scoutpilot Member

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    I never found that to be the case, actually...
     
  8. Iwheel

    Iwheel Parent of

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    Really? You know, it is possible that many USMA graduates stay in the uniform and never apply for the civilian ivy schools. But for those who do, they are grabbed almost right away. Here is an example of what I found out on Harvard:

    There are many West Point grads who go to the top B-schools.

    Quote: "Consulting the database of Harvard Business School, I get the total number of MBA alumni who went to the following undergrad programs. What is even more impressive is that the academies can have such a large number of HBS alumni despite not having lots of students. For example, Army and Navy are almost as well represented as Berkeley and Michigan despite being clearly dwarfed in terms of total undergrad population.

    Harvard University (3257)
    Yale University (1485)
    Princeton University (1301)
    Stanford University (1200)
    Mass. Inst. of Tech. (995)
    Penn., University of (884)
    Dartmouth College (771)
    Cornell University (743)
    Brown University (732)
    Calif, U of,Berkeley (546)
    Mich, U of,Ann Arbor (466)
    U.S. Naval Academy (439)
    U.S. Military Academy (438)
    Duke University (429)
    Williams College (423)

    Although WP ranked 13th place, please remember many of other schools graduate way more students (except Williams) than USMA. For example, Cornell, UMich and Berkley has each 5x the graduates or more of that of USMA. So their acceptance rate to Harvard is effective 1/4 to 1/5 of USMA. This is not even counting the fact that fewer USMA students even apply to HBS because a good % will just stay with the Army. If we can normalize the above list with the number of applicants (or undergraduates), USMA will jump the rank. That, my friends, is the "true" ranking of West Point in the eyes of HBS admissions. Other Ivies are similar. USNA also does well here.

    So ranked #4 is about right, so was #1 in 2009 :)
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2010
  9. scoutpilot

    scoutpilot Member

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    I was referring to your assertion that "USMA may not sound as prestigious to anyone."

    Most graduates will get a degree from a civilian school in their lifetime.
     
  10. Iwheel

    Iwheel Parent of

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    Ooops, I misunderstood.

    You know, it is true that WP is more known out of the US than inside. I don't know why, thanks partly to Newsweek's ranking that put the SA's to various small ranking categories. If I remember correctly, WP was listed as a liberal Arts college, UNAFA was under some regional college list, etc. Anyway, kids don't see them easily when they pull up the "main ranking list".

    So Scoutpilot, are you also going to a civilian graduate school? How do you feel they "treat" a WP applicant?
     
  11. scoutpilot

    scoutpilot Member

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    I hardly think that's "true" either. West Point is not exactly beneath the radar of the American consciousness.

    I am not attending a civilian graduate school, currently. I am still on active duty and will not settle for a nighttime degree.
     
  12. KidFromNYC

    KidFromNYC Member

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    From my experience, USMA really is better known outside the US than inside. Take for example... my parents are very, VERY Asian (they can barely speak English.) When I told them I wanted to join the military, they flamed with disaproval. Once "West Point" came up... good skoo bring the famry much aunah. Ok, maybe not exactly like that but they were overall supportive.

    About the Forbes ranking... These rankings weren't done by Forbes but actually by the students ie. how content they are with the institution etc... Heck, the title says:

    "America's Best Colleges
    David M. Ewalt
    The best public and private colleges and universities, from the student's point of view."
     
  13. scoutpilot

    scoutpilot Member

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    I'm not quite sure what that's supposed to prove.
     
  14. pedro4

    pedro4 Member

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    USNA Ranking

    I wonder if the ranking there vs. USMA and USAFA reflects the recent scandals with football players. The onfield success may come with a price.
     
  15. Chockstock

    Chockstock "Forever One Team"

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    If your parents want you to go West Point because its West Point and not because its the military, you are wrong. If you are going to West Point because your parents want you to and you just want the degree, you are WRONG!
     
  16. Iwheel

    Iwheel Parent of

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    You got it somewhat wrong. It took WP years to establishes its name. It is MORE than just military. It is the nations "premier leadership institution." That is why it is ranked #4, not #11 or #29, or ranked same as a ROTC program.

    I am sure you didn't go to WP just because it is military, but because it's WP, a famous school with a lot of heritage. I bet if you put this idea in an essay, wp will not object it. Agree?
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2010
  17. scoutpilot

    scoutpilot Member

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    You seem to fancy yourself quite the expert on West Point and its exact role and place in the universe. I'm not quite sure why that is, and I certainly think that much of what you've said so far is unfounded. It is ranked #4 because that is where the votes shook out. The poll didn't rate ROTC programs. It rates institutions. There is a world of difference.

    Chockstock, your point was very good. We cannot view West Point as a college without also accepting its status as "the military." You are quite right...candidates had better understand the whole deal, not just the prestige. Fortunately I think KidFromNYC does.

    Nonetheless, no one has yet made an argument of any substance the WP is better known outside the country, or that WP is not thought to be "as prestigious" as the traditional high-caliber schools. As the brother and husband of two Ivy League folks (Yale) and the nephew of a third (Brown) and a WP grad myself, I have found quite the opposite to be true in my travels.
     
  18. Iwheel

    Iwheel Parent of

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    I don't fancy myself as an expert here. I am simply saying that Forbes ranks colleges of all kinds. The ranking has very little to do with it being military but everything to do with its quality and teaching.

    We have read much warning about not applying for WP because of its name, etc. In fact, you mentioned it many of your posts/threads. But this is a thread of its ranking and its fame, not whether one should apply for its name or for it because of is military.

    Except for the lack of tuition, being a military college has nothing to do with its Forbes ranking #4. That is just my 2 cents, no expert.
     

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