USNA Wait List–Information?

808DAD, I'm guessing there are several cans of worms sitting on Admissions table.

FUBAR, CYA, or both...?
 
808DAD, I'm guessing there are several cans of worms sitting on Admissions table.

FUBAR, CYA, or both...?

I don't agree. The nomination process is only part of the application. The academy will select the candidates that best meet the needs of the academy.

In 808DAD's case, there is some conflicting information coming out of the MOC's office as I have seen a nomination letter from that MOC that says the nominees were unranked. Being ranked first out of 50 applicants from Hawaii is also in question since each MOC submits a list and they are not coordinated to say one MOC's nominee is ranked higher or lower than another MOC's nominee.

Good luck to all those still waiting.
 
Ok, setting aside the Hawaii situation for a moment. If for some reason, that can be explained by some mis-communication, what about the other principal nominees that have reported here that they've been wait listed?

I would love to hear from a BGO as to their take on this.
 
Re No. 2 above, I have read the law and while it addresses the three possible ways in which the MOC can submit his or her slate of candidates (Principal, Ranked, and Unranked), I couldn't find any specific language which stated that the Academy had to accept the Principal nomination. If I missed something, could someone please point out where in the law this is written.

TennisDad, You are absolutely correct, I haven't been able to find anything under Title 10 U.S.C., either.

Or is it simply the norm that the Principal is offered an appointment and, as such, people assume that it is the law?

Seems so. However, I have had MOC offices tell me that principal noms MUST be appointed (if 3Q'd), as well. Has it been such the accepted norm, for so long, that even MOC's have blurred the letter of the law, with the spirit of the law? :confused:

not sure about the law, but have found it stated in a couple of places.

"Nominees may be submitted in three categories: without ranking, with a principal candidate and nine ranked alternates, or with a principal candidate and nine unranked alternates. When the Member specifies a principal candidate, that individual will be appointed to a DOD academy as long as he or she meets all other admission criteria. If the principal candidate is disqualified, the service academies will appoint the first fully qualified, ranked alternate, if specified by the Member. In circumstances where Members do not specify a principal candidate or ranked alternates, one individual from among the Member’s nominees who is found to be fully qualified will be appointed by the academies to serve as a cadet."

"An applicant selected for a principal nomination requires the Naval Academy to use the nomination vacancy for that applicant if the applicant is qualified."

COmom: The verbiage you cite above, (where I, too, have seen numerous places) seems to have originated from the 11/30/12: "Congressional Research Report for Congress; Congressional Nominations to U.S. Service Academies: An Overview and Resources for Outreach and Management" which describes statutory requirements for allocating congressional nominations to US service academies. However, where the researcher obtained his lawful facts in that report is what's in question.

As TennisDad states, the verbiage (so as stated by the researcher in that report and in regards to principal nominations) is not found within the governing Federal Law: Title 10 U.S.C. Subtitle C - Navy and Marine Corps, Part III - Education and Training, Chapter 603

So, hopefully a BGO or long time poster can answer: does the absolute acceptance for principal nomination winners boil down to accepted norms, academy regulations, legal history, or what??
 
I would love to hear from a BGO as to their take on this.

+1 Mista!

Also, you asked (in another post) about the principal nomination winner that I know, he is my DS's good friend... and in another twist to this whole scenario, his TWE letter did NOT have any verbiage that he had been waitlisted. :frown:
 
I don't agree. The nomination process is only part of the application. The academy will select the candidates that best meet the needs of the academy.

In 808DAD's case, there is some conflicting information coming out of the MOC's office as I have seen a nomination letter from that MOC that says the nominees were unranked. Being ranked first out of 50 applicants from Hawaii is also in question since each MOC submits a list and they are not coordinated to say one MOC's nominee is ranked higher or lower than another MOC's nominee.

Good luck to all those still waiting.

You're correct. It was a rhetorical question, and a statement created out of frustration for those who are principal and 3q'ed.
 
So, hopefully a BGO or long time poster can answer: does the absolute acceptance for principal nomination winners boil down to accepted norms, academy regulations, legal history, or what??

This seems to be what it boils down to. I know when our BGO interviewed my son, he said the Academy preferred unranked slates because they want to choose themselves, not be bound by what the MOC wants. So, certainly that was implying that ranked slates would be honored.

Also, with the timing of these notifications to principal nominees, something just seems . . . funny. I don't know. This is only our first go-round, but this situation with the principals seems to go against the understanding of most here, and that notion has not been disputed by BGOs, to my knowledge.

Aveon, I'm sorry your DS's friend was one of those affected. And to not even have wait list offered, I'm sure that must be extremely disappointing.
 
Great Reading...Nomination and Selection Process...

The following link is to a Naval Post Graduate School masters thesis providing in-depth insight into the selection mindset of the Admissions Board. EVERY applicant should read this to better understand how the Board is working to improve and ensure the quality of the naval officer corps, and how they assess you as a potential academy candidate and potential naval officer. It includes in-depth explanation of the Whole Candidate Score (WCS) as a tool implementing the Whole Candidate principle of selection. Great reading!

THE DEVELOPMENT OF CAREER NAVAL OFFICERS FROM THE U.S. NAVAL ACADEMY: A STATISTICAL ANALYSIS OF THE EFFECTS OF SELECTIVITY OF HUMAN CAPITAL, Matthew G. Reardon, June 1997.

www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a333414.pdf

For those still wrestling with the questions of the role of Principal Nominations in the selection process, the answer remains the same.

See Chapter II, Section D, Sub-Section 2. Nominations

"A principal nominee is assured appointment..."

I really don't want to try to convince anyone either way, that is not my intent. Form your own conclusions. All I suggest is that you research the topic as deep as possible. As far as 10 U.S.C. 6954, re-read it from the perspective it was written, Congress is authorizing the creation of Naval Positions (its sole authority), with conditions attached. The President is not bound by Congresses conditions, except that if the President chooses to not adhere to the conditions, then Congressional authorization for the affected Midshipmen positions is void...in other words, if the Navy wants Midshipmen positions, they must (are mandated) to adhere to the conditions, including nominations sources, type of nominations, number of appointments from a source, etc. There are countless examples of similar conditions imposed in law, including labor law and regulations of federal funded projects or programs. Remember the federal 55 MPH mandate imposed on state...no 55, no federal highway funds...but of course the states were free to do as they wanted. Right...sarcasm intended.

Thinking of everyone while awaiting the USNA Class of 2018 fate of my DS.
 
There is definitely some confusion going on here in Hawaii. I have a nomination letter from the MOC in question in front of me and it says:

"I have chosen to use the competitive method of nomination. Under this method, up to ten nominees are submitted to the United States Naval Academy for each vacancy. The Academy will make an Offer of Appointment from this list and will notify the applicants directly."

I'm not sure how one can be a primary when the MOC sent in the list using the competitive method. There could be some other reason why one cadidate was chosen over another that we just don't know. I'm sure all ten candidates listed on the nomination slate are very deserving and it's up to the academy to decide who to take. There are several pieces of the application that the MOC does not see.

Good luck to all waiting!

If you go back to post #29, I have written word for word what was written on my DS's nomination letter blocking out the names and phone number for privacy. I am unable to attest on any other letters my senator my have sent out. My DS's nomination came in a large manila envelope cased in a blue jacket with the Senator's seal embossed on it. If you would like I could send you a picture of it of course with the names and phone number blacked out for privacy purposes. I think if you have an more questions regarding the nominations our Senator gave you should call his Hawaii office. The coordinator was willing to answer any questions I had regarding nominations and appointments to service academies.
 
https://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/RL33213.pdf

"Nominees may be submitted in three categories: without ranking, with a principal candidate and nine ranked alternates, or with a principal candidate and nine unranked alternates.8 When the Member specifies a principal candidate, that individual will be appointed to a DOD academy as long as he or she meets all other admission criteria. If the principal candidate is disqualified, the service academies will appoint the first fully qualified, ranked alternate, if specified by the Member. In circumstances where Members do not specify a principal candidate or ranked alternates, one individual from among the Member’s nominees who is found to be fully qualified will be appointed by the academies to serve as a cadet."


This is from a Congressional Research Service report to Congress that is the information provided to MOCs regarding service academies.

"The Congressional Research Service (CRS) works exclusively for the United States Congress, providing policy and legal analysis to committees and Members of both the House and Senate, regardless of party affiliation. As a legislative branch agency within the Library of Congress, CRS has been a valued and respected resource on Capitol Hill for nearly a century.

CRS is well-known for analysis that is authoritative, confidential, objective and nonpartisan. Its highest priority is to ensure that Congress has 24/7 access to the nation’s best thinking."

This is probably why MOCs use the language they do in their letters to principal nominees.
 
Hello all I just joined the forum and am an ongoing candidate for class of 2018. I am now the fifth person on this forum to be given a waitlist to NAPS with a PRINCIPAL nomination.


Sent using the Service Academy Forums® mobile app
 
Congrats reh16. You will be so far ahead of the others after a year in NAPS. Have heard the plebes all look up to Napsters! Enjoy your year at Naps!
 
Did you receive an explanation for the wait list with a principal nom? Some of the others were a little puzzling.
 
Reh, so sorry about those with principal noms who did not receive appointments. I hope you have a backup plan. I thought I understood from another poster that 3Qed principal noms on the WL were offered spots at NAPS. Seems like that is not the case. You are now on the NAPS WL instead?


Sent using the Service Academy Forums® mobile app
 
Correct, I am on the waitlist for NAPS and didn't receive an explanation. However my plan b is an army ROTC scholarship to University of Vermont! But USNA is truly my dream


Sent using the Service Academy Forums® mobile app
 
Back
Top