What does this letter mean?

Discussion in 'Military Academy - USMA' started by Big B's Dad, Dec 11, 2011.

  1. Big B's Dad

    Big B's Dad Member

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    We received a letter from the WP Admissions office this week. It was a bit cryptic in meaning. It says the following:

    "...has reviewed your application and you have been found fully qualified."
    "Although fully qualified, we have not yet received a nomination for you."
    "No offier of admission is possible without a nomination."

    The candiate did interview with both Senators and our Congressman this month. He was told not to expect any word for several more weeks on the nominations.

    So what it the meaning of this letter? His SLS buddies he talked to told him the LOA's are done and this is a "next phase" LOA and that he is accepted at WP pending a nomination. The letter is from the Great Lakes Regional Commander.

    We don't want to jump the gun but the letter did give us pause and we want to put it into perspective and understand what it means. Any thoughts? I don't want to call the Black and Gold Officer over it......just curious.
     
  2. Dgood102293

    Dgood102293 Member

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    From what I understand, a letter of this type is considered a 'qualification' letter. A Regional commander may chose to send these letters out to candidates once their file has been reviewed. I did not receive one, as my regional commander may have chosen not to send them out this year. The letter basically means that the candidate is fully qualified but does not have a nomination. It is NOT an LOA.

    I am just a candidate, however, and do not know this as absolute fact. Hope this helps.
     
  3. buff81

    buff81 Moderator

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    ^^^^ is correct.
    That is a 'you are fully qualified' letter and is in no way related to a LOA.
    IOW - the candidate is 3Q'd.
    3Q'd + nom = qualified for an appointment - but does not mean you will receive one. Many 3Q'd with a nom don't receive appointments as there is not enough room in the class to give all those that are qualified for an appointment, an appointment.
    While waiting to see where your candidate comes out in the nom process - have them continue to update their files with any and all achievements, honors etc since filling out the CAR. If candidate ends up on the NWL, they want to have as many WCS points as they can.
    The absolute best way to increase your chances of an appointment, if not the MOC slot winner, is to continue to raise SAT/ACT scores.
     
  4. xenarian

    xenarian Cadet, Class of 2015

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    Confirmation

    I confirm Buff81's response. I was admitted, and I neither received a Letter of Assurance nor one of these qualification letters.
     
  5. BigNick

    BigNick Member

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    Very simple - you have been found fully qualified by West Point. Great news! However, you must have a nomination. You must have BOTH (qualified AND nomination) to get in West Point. This is NOT a LOA. All you can do is wait for the nomination.
     
  6. buff81

    buff81 Moderator

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    BigNick - I know that you know this but just want to make this clear to others.
    A nom + being fully qualified (3Q'd) is the formula for an offer of appointment
    BUT
    you can have a nom and be 3Q'd and NOT receive an offer of appointment.
    There are simply more '3Q'd + nom' candidates than there are slots in a class.
    All candidates on the NWL are fully qualified with a nom but unfortunately, not all get an offer.
    Admissions calls those candidates QNS (Qualified but Not Selected).
     
  7. BigNick

    BigNick Member

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    buff81,
    My meaning is that if you are the principle nominee of a congressman and are 3Q'd you are in.
    Some congressmen choose to not specify their principle nominee but "nominate" 10 people for his one slot and lets WP decide which one gets in - those 10 do NOT really have a legal nomination. A better explination in this case is that the congressman "identifies" 10 good candidates and lets WP pick the one that gets his REAL nomination. This is the way my congressman and a RC explained the system to a parent group.
    In short - there is a BIG differnece between being declared as the principal nominee by a congressman vs being one of 10 "nominated" by the congressman (for WP to consider and pick the one who gets the REAL nomination)
     
  8. USMA2016

    USMA2016 Appointee - Class of 2016

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    I'm not sure if this is correct. As a member of a congressional district where the principle nomination system is not used, I have to disagree with you. I have been nominated by my congressman and that nomination gives USMA full legal authority to tender an appointment. There's nothing fake about it.

    I think what you're referring to is the congressman's "slots" at each academy. I believe they're each allotted 5 cadetships at one time so, in a normal year with a nomination list of 10 candidates, one of those candidates will receive an appointment (assuming 3Q). The rest are still nominated but they just remain in the purgatory that is the NWL.
     
  9. BigNick

    BigNick Member

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    USMA2016,
    The fact is that a Congressman can have 5 total Cadets in each academy. Normally each year a congressman has one slot but he could have two in a given year.
    NO MATTER HOW MANY HE "nominates" up to 10 - he can only send to WP the number he is authorized. If a congressman has one slot ONLY ONE will get in from that congressman. Others in his district that are 3Q might get in through other ways (Presidential, NWL etc) but that congressman can not send more than he has slots for.
     
  10. GAdad

    GAdad Member

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    This is incorrect. However, while the candidate DOES receive a legal nomination, it does NOT guarantee an apointment. It does provide the candidate with an opportunity to receive an appointment if he/she is fully qualified, either by selection in the slate by the Appointment Committee at West Point, or in the pool.
     
  11. USMA2016

    USMA2016 Appointee - Class of 2016

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    Please note that I addressed this.

    Quoted my earlier post below:

     
  12. Packer

    Packer Member

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    And they were put on the NWL by virtue of that very real nomination they received.
     
  13. AikiBudo

    AikiBudo Member

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    Theoretically a MOC could have 50 (maybe more) nominees at an academy at any one time. They are allowed to nominate 10 per open slot and have 5 slots available. If one nominee is chosen by the academy to fill a slot the other nine could go into the national pool and theoretically all be offered and accept appointments. The other nine would have a legitimate nomination from that MOC but would not count against the 5 slots. I have heard (not confirmed) that there are some MOCs that have 10-20 nominees at an academy at one time. I wonder what the record is? Has someone actually hit 50?
     
  14. hawk

    hawk ButterBar Dad

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    Seems folks are forgetting about the impact of LOA's.... I know one senator who had 5 appointees just last year. One as his "charged" nom, 4 others as non-charged via LOA's. But all had to be nominated and on his slate.

    My impression is that this is fairly common for that senator (and his counterpart) just due to state competitiveness. It would not surprise me at all to find this Senator has 20 nominated cadets at USMA at any given time.

    We all stumble a bit about the word "nominated", in some contexts it only applies to the 1 or 2 charged slots each year. Other times it applies to be the slate of 10.

    We can say that non-charged appointments are not really nominees, but without being nominated they most likely would not have received that appointment.
     
  15. AikiBudo

    AikiBudo Member

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    Hawk your right - 10-20 nominees at one time would not be that unusual and might be common especially in competitive areas (our Congressman had 4 to USNA last year) I should have said 20-30 - that's what I get for multi-tasking while typing. But I'd still like to know what the record is.
     
  16. BigNick

    BigNick Member

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    I had a long talk with a senior admissions officer at West Point today about what a "nomination" is and is not. There is room for confusion.

    Lets say a congressman has one slot this year for West Point. The congressman has several options.
    1.He can desgnate a slate of a primary, 1st alternate, 2nd alternate and 3rd alternate candidates. If the primary is 3Qd that candidate WILL be admitted to WP. If not then you go to the 1st alternate. If that 1st alternate is 3Q he/she gets in. If not then to the 2nd alternate etc.
    2. Alternatively, the congressman can "nominate" up to 10 people and let WP admissions decide which one of those 10 will get the congressman's single slot - his principle nomination. They are know as the "vacancy winner" in that congressional district. If that person is 3Qd they will get in WP.

    The other 9 people who were not the "vacancy winner" in their congressional district are still "nominated" and will be put on the National Waiting list if they are 3Qd by WP. WP puts the people on the NWL in a rank order from #1 to the bottom of the list (exact order of the list is kept secret). There can be 1000-2000 people on this list. By Title 10 law, at least 150 people must be admmtted from this list. Lately, that number has been as high as 450 people. Hundreds of people from the NWL will not be admitted even though they are 3Qd and have a "nomination". Clearly, having a "principle" nomination vs a "nomination" is vastly different. There are many things happening on the NWL right up to R-Day. Admissions is trying to find a way to get the best people on the NWL in WP. They can use unfilled congressional slots, slots from people who turn-down their WP offer etc. Lots of "horse trading" here to get the best people in.

    Of course, people with Presidential nominations, service members, etc have a little different path but they must ALL be nominated by some legal source and be 3Qd.
     
  17. Packer

    Packer Member

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    Thanks for posting this. That is my understanding of the process and it is good to hear the same thing from another source.
     
  18. USMA2016

    USMA2016 Appointee - Class of 2016

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    Alright; this is what we've been saying.

    However, I think the quotation marks around the word 'nomination' are misleading because they lead on to believe that that type of nomination isn't really a nomination when it really is.
     
  19. BigNick

    BigNick Member

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    This is tricky. I put " " around "nomination" because if you are not the primary nominee (vacancy winner) then your "nomination" only puts you on the NWL with 1000-2000 other people. If you are high on the NWL you will get in, but hundreds of people on the NWL will not get in even though they are 3Qd and have a "nomination".
    In reality, there are different types of nominations. If you have a primary nomination(vacancy winner) and are 3Qd you are admitted -end of story. If you do not have a primary noimination, you are put on the NWL and have less than a 50-50 chance to get in.
    Now, if you have an LOA and receive any kind of nomination, WP will get you in one way or another - they have either saved a slot from a congressman or one of the NWL slots for you. Therefore I agree, LOA+nomination and you are in.

    A congressman with one vacancy can get only one person in with that slot. However, several of his nominees (other than his vacancy winner) could get LOAs from WP or be high on the NWL ranking and get in thru the NWL. I have seen cases where 4-5 people from a congressional district got in. My son got in thru a Presidential appointment with an LOA which does not count against that congressman's quota.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2011
  20. jlwilkes101

    jlwilkes101 Member

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    This is information I recieved in an email: 550 candidates will recieve appointments from primary nominations, meaning they are the vacancy winners for their specific MOC. 300 candidates will recieve appointments from service-connected nominations. At the time, the letter stated that 350 would then recieve appointments off of the NWL; however, if the class size has been reduced from 1200 to 1150, then I'm guessing that number shrinks to 300. Anyone who gets an appointment off the NWL must have a nomination; because they are on the NWL, that probably means that they were not the vacancy winner from their district. But as USMA2016 said, their nomination is still a nomination; without it, they could not be appointed to West Point.
     

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