Which is the best public military college?

Discussion in 'Publicly and Privately Funded Military Colleges' started by armyman736, Feb 8, 2011.

  1. armyman736

    armyman736 Member

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    I was just wondering which is the best public military college is? I am interested in the Citadel, VMI, and Norwitch. Does anyone know which one of these is the hardest academically? Thanks in advance.
     
  2. patentesq

    patentesq Parent

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    Armyman, Norwich is private, not public.

    I also don't think anyone affiliated with either of these schools will say their school is any better than the other.
     
  3. SF49ers

    SF49ers Member

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    VMI and The Citadel are pretty similar academically from what I understand. I think their admissions data may actually be a bit higher (SAT score, high school GPA) but the experiences should be comparable. Both schools are small and allow cadets to really get to know their professors. You can make as much or as little of it as you want. The Honors Program at The Citadel is exceptional, and there are many opportunities for high achieving cadets, including the Star of the West Summer Scholarship, which fully funds 20-25 cadets to study abroad each summer.

    Texas A&M and Virginia Tech both have Corps of Cadets within the larger school. These offer a different atmosphere, but academically I would expect them to be comparable to that of any other student there. Both are great educational institutions.

    North Georgia College & State University is the last of the Senior Military College's that is public. It's not as academic as the others, but still offers a solid education in my opinion. Again, students are more limited by their own drive than by their school, particularly in small schools.

    I'm assuming that you are excluding the academies and Norwich with this assessment. As for the two year military colleges, I can't say that I know too much about them.
     
  4. armyman736

    armyman736 Member

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    Thank you. I am really wanting to go to West Point, but I am looking for alternatives in case I do not get in.

    I have an Unweighted GPA of 3.83, class rank 9 of 53, ACT composite of 23, cross country captain and varsity letter, over 190 service hours, member of youth group, student government, and in all honors classes and currently taking 3 college credit classes. How competitive would you say I was for Norwitch, VMI, and the Citadel? Thanks in advance.
     
  5. bjkuds

    bjkuds Parent

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    :eek: Well you are about to get varied opinions..I'm a parent of one that is debating between Norwich and VMI..accepted to both.. IMO all are great, but they are different than one another IMO not better or worse. My DS applied to Norwich and VMI. Both schools have teachers that want the kids to succeed and are available to help you moreso than a large campus.
    DS spent an overnight and we met the faculty at both. VMI admission standards are a little higher with SAT/ACT, GPA scores. Citadel was a little bigger than both VMI and Norwich, and my son wanted to go to a smaller school. We heard great things about the Engineering depts at both schools, that is why we chose to look at those 2. Big difference is Norwich has civilian students and VMI does not, which brings with it a different atmosphere on campus. I think both will pretty much kick your tail physically, and mentally..plus and your ROTC detachment will also vary a little depending on the branch. I suggest visiting them if at all possible. And they all have great web sites with their admission standards, videos etc. Good Luck
     
  6. bjkuds

    bjkuds Parent

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    I have an Unweighted GPA of 3.83, class rank 9 of 53, ACT composite of 23, cross country captain and varsity letter, over 190 service hours, member of youth group, student government, and in all honors classes and currently taking 3 college credit classes. How competitive would you say I was for Norwitch, VMI, and the Citadel? Thanks in advance.[/QUOTE]

    Your stats are similar to DS and he has a choice to make so I think you are in good shape.:thumb:
     
  7. bruno

    bruno Retired Staff Member

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    You are going to be very competitive at all of them. Your ACT is a little low (but not off the charts-) my advice would be to take it again.
    Unless they are an admissions officer , no one will be able to give you an answer with certainty, but I will tell you that I would feel pretty good with your record . One way to judge yourself is to look at the profile of the current freshman class.
    I've attached a link to the VMI class of 2014 profile so you can see for yourself how you measure up against the average of this years Rat class.

    http://www.vmi.edu/Admissions.aspx?id=58&rsm=7115
    Class Rank
    Top quarter 122 (40%)
    Second quarter 139 (46%)
    Academic Profile
    Mean SAT Verbal score: 565 Average ACT Composite score: 25
    Mean SAT Math score: 580 Average High School GPA: 3.47
    Extracurricular Activities
    Officer, student body/class 55 (11%)
    Team Captain 236 (47%)
    Student government 69 (14%)
    National Honor Society 143 (29%)
    Athletic team (2 years) 442 (88%)
    Boys' State/Girls’ State 63 (13%)
    Eagle Scout/Gold Award 59 (12%)
    Club Officer 151 (30%)
    JROTC or CAP 101 (20%)
    Band 113 (23%)
    Chorus 28 (6%)


    you might find this VMI video informative.It's a recruiting pitch for sure but it is still pretty good and might give you a few things to think about.
    http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=524226878439&oid=135020398504&comments
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2011
  8. armyman736

    armyman736 Member

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    Thank you everyone for your help. I have two more questions:

    1. What is the difference between private and public military college if you have to apply and be accepted go both?

    2. If I receive an AROTC four year scholarship would I have to pay anything out of pocket? (I do live in a state with any military college)
     
  9. patentesq

    patentesq Parent

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    From the perspective of the student, there isn't any difference. The public/private distinction relates to things like corporate governance, funding sources (and ability to extend those funds to in-state residents), etc. I wouldn't worry about whether a school is public or private in making your school choice.

    Yes. Room and Board is the big one, unless the school has a policy to provide free room and board to scholarship students. There is a sticky on the ROTC board. You should spend a lot of time there and read up on the issues (e.g., some folks use scholarship for room and board with potential tax consequences, etc.).
     
  10. armyman736

    armyman736 Member

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    Okay, thank you for your help.
     
  11. NMMI PREP DIRECTOR

    NMMI PREP DIRECTOR Member

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    You may want to check out the Early Commissioning Program at the Military Junior Colleges also. I agree that your ACT (23) is low when looking at "competitive" West Point candidates. Then again, with other things in your favor, the Association of Graduates at the USMA may offer you a one-year Prep scholarship.

    You are wise to have back-up plan that you can implement should you need it.

    Good luck!
     
  12. sprog

    sprog Member

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    Private schools are not controlled/managed by a government entity. Public schools are. Often you hear public colleges referred to as "State schools," because they are run by the respective State. Private colleges can be run by religious organizations/people or by secular private citizens/institutions.

    The big thing here, is that private schools almost always cost more than public ones. This is particularly true when comparing an in-state public school to a private university. State residents get a discount at their home State university, but if they choose to go to an out-of-state public school, the costs may well be similar to a private college tuition. I still think it's safe to say that even out-of-state at a public school is cheaper than a private school, although that is a generalization which may not hold up as much anymore. VMI costs over $25k for a non-Virginia resident, and that is up there.

    If you live in a state with a military college, and that school is public, it'll be cheaper in costs. If the military college in your state is private, then it makes no difference if you live a minute from campus or on the other side of the country-tuition is the same.

    Norwich is private, and so is Mary Baldwin College (which is only for women). Texas A&M, VMI, Citadel, VPI, and North Georgia are all public schools.
     
  13. patentesq

    patentesq Parent

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    sprog, I respectfully think it is not "safe" to say that. Private schools are much more liberal about financial aid than public schools (which is likely why you indicated this "may not hold up as much anymore"). The only way someone can learn about the real pricetag for education is to simply apply.

    Case In Point: For a family earning less than $130,000 per year, Yale University is basically free. Harvard University similarly has a policy of not requiring families to pay more than 10% of their income to attend. For the same family, however, the cost of attending Penn State University is at least $25,000 per year.

    My advice is that everyone looking at applying to military colleges should just apply. The distinction between "public" or "private" means nothing, unless you are talking about a U.S. Service Academy. You should see what scholarships you get, visit the schools, talk to alumni, talk to cadets, talk to the ROTC departments. After you have all of your FACTS together, including receipt of the financial aid award letters from each of the schools (these letters are typically issued in the spring, well after the application deadline), only then can make an educated choice about which school to attend.
     
  14. Cehrt414

    Cehrt414 Member

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    I decided to look up the price of tuition for each of the SMC just out of curiosity and I figured I could post my findings.

    This is just a list of the out-of-state tuition prices.

    VMI-$30,320
    Norwich-$28,738
    Georgia State-$26,908
    Citadel-$24,800
    Texas A&M-$22,817
    Virginia Tech-$22,648


    I have applied and have been accepted to Norwich and I am waiting to hear back from Texas A&M, those are the only 2 SMC I applied to. So far Norwich has been great about scholarships. I think last year they gave about a quarter of a million away in scholarships. Norwich has scholarship competitions and I attended the one in November(I wasn't accepted at the time) but didn't receive any money,ha, but I was notified around Christmas that I received a $68,000 scholarship for something else. They also invited me to another of the scholarship competition and I am sure their will be more. But basically don't apply based on money because schools always have scholarships to compete for. And if given the opportunity go to a scholarship competition at any of the schools,if they offer one, do it. Even if you don't get and money you still get an awesome experience at the school. Like many others I am still waiting to hear back from AROTC, so hope for the best there for everyone then its on to deciding schools.
     
  15. bruno

    bruno Retired Staff Member

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    That doesn't appear to be correct- for example:
    Total cost at VMI is $37,652 (Tuition, room &Board, Uniforms and Fees) and Tuition for Non-Virginians at VMI is $24,016 http://www.vmi.edu/admissions.aspx?id=4294970458&ekmensel=fb5d653b_20_307_btnlink
    Total cost at the Citadel for an out of state cadet is $37,878 - (they don't break out tuition in that total) The Citadel does drop by about $5000 after 4thclass year because of uniform costs. http://www.citadel.edu/treasurer/tuition.html#Tuition
    Total cost at Norwich is $41,719 including tuition of $27,256 http://www.norwich.edu/admissions/financialaid/tuition.html
    Texas A&M is too time consuming to look up- however it is important to note that I have read (don't have a link) that Cadets in the Corps are granted Instate tuition rates at A&M
    Again- most of the Maritime Colleges have agreements with multiple states to offer in state or in region tuition to residents of those states covered by the agreements. Like at Texas A&M - this is a significant cost advantage if covered , something like $13,000 lower than charged to an out of state Cadet. Massachusetts for example has agreements with CT,&RI, DC,DE,GA,FL,MD,NC,NH,NJ,PA,SC,VA,VT (http://www.maritime.edu/index.cfm?pg=416)

    Bottom line- it's expensive anywhere if you are an out of state Cadet at the State SMCs or a Cadet at Norwich. But I know that Norwich has been very liberal in offering scholarship aid and I know that both the Citadel and VMI have Scholars programs which offer some significant financial assistance to those who qualify.
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2011
  16. Cehrt414

    Cehrt414 Member

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    I used collegeboard to find just the tuition. I didn't do the total cost with room and board and all the other fees.
     
  17. bruno

    bruno Retired Staff Member

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    yes but it's not right- The VMI tuition shown is off by over $6000. You really need to go to the school site itself.
    It's not that critical- the point is that unless you are an in state student at a public school, College is likely to be an expensive proposition, but there are sources of funding available. Patentesq has given pretty good advice IMHO- apply to as many as you can and when accepted, work the system to develop any and all sources of financial assistance.
     
  18. armyman736

    armyman736 Member

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    I know I have asked this before, but I need to make sure. For any public or private military college, I will only have to pay for room and board/uniform fees as long as I have a 4-year AROTC scholarship? (once again I do not live in any of those states)
     
  19. bruno

    bruno Retired Staff Member

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    For ANY COLLEGE at which you are awarded an ROTC scholarship- your scholarship will cover Tuition, fees, books plus your monthly stipend. It does not typically cover Room & Board.
     
  20. bjkuds

    bjkuds Parent

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    Bruno is accurate as usual. To add a point Norwich offers free room and board to ROTC scholarship recipients as well. I say apply to all that interest you and see what offers you get for grants, scholarships etc.. Then you can make a decision based of facts. At both Norwich and VMI the average family income is 90k yearly of the students that attend, and both schools stats indicate that the average student graduates with under 25K in debt total for 4 years. So don't look at the sticker price and automatically assume that they are not affordable. Even if some debt is incurred these schools graduates are highly sought after so I say you can't lose investing in a good education IMHO
     

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