Whoops..... McChrystal recalled to DC

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Tennyson: "theirs not".:thumb: Not individuals but all together.:biggrin: Noble six hundred.
 
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Temper that with legality.

"Just following orders" is a poor excuse when the order is illegal. As a future officer, it may be up to you to make that determination in a bind, and it may cost lives no matter which side you land on.

The quote was from "The Charge of the Light Brigade" by Lord Tennyson. I meant it as a reference to the General's comments.
 
Okay folks - 3 meetings this morning for the General. Heard he has or will offer his resignation.

So...... now what?
IF he resigns/is fired who will replace him?
What does this mean for he mission in Afghanistan? Obama will have replaced two generals in 13 months.
Can any of you make a case for Obama keeping McChrystal?

BTW - when McChrystal was chosen for the job his naysayers said he was the wrong person as he was too much of a renegade. I am willing to concede this point. McChrystal has been mired in controversy before - in hindsight this was no surprise.
If anyone wants to read the article (which might be Pulitzer worthy) here is the link:
http://timeswampland.files.wordpress.com/2010/06/r1109mcchrystal.pdf
 
The logical pick would be Rodriguez, his deputy. McC may be deemed too big to fail though, as the strategy is deeply linked to his capabilities.
 
The quote was from "The Charge of the Light Brigade" by Lord Tennyson. I meant it as a reference to the General's comments.

Oh, I know! I wasn't challenging you on it.

My comment was intended for the new breed of Cadets and Midshipmen who may hear it and not dig a little deeper.

Sorry if I wasn't clear. :redface:
 
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Personally, McCrystal should be decorated and thanked, not forced to retire. All I can "HONESTLY HOPE FOR" is that there will be a different CIC before our cadets graduate and start serving.
 
Personally, McCrystal should be decorated and thanked, not forced to retire. All I can "HONESTLY HOPE FOR" is that there will be a different CIC before our cadets graduate and start serving.

Well, I can sympathize with that, but we have to keep one thing in mind...

Members of the military (especially officers, and especially SENIOR officers) are forbidden from disputing or disrespecting the Commander in Chief, the VP, the SECDEF, and a slew of others in civilian positions of authority, and with good reason. The American military is rightly subordinate to the elected civilian government. It matters little that the current CINC is an inexperienced, arrogant, incompetent, socialistic, enemy-coddling, lying, thug of the highest order. Sufficient idiots in this country voted for the bastard, and that means the military does what he says (provided it is legal). Period.

I hated Clinton too, and I thought the entire Haiti operation was just a sop to a political constituency (and it was), but when I was ordered to saddle up and go, I saddled up and went. No questions, just an "Aye aye, sir!" and off to the harbor...

McCrystal should be disciplined "as a courts martial may direct" (that's the UCMJ, not me), or he should resign. THEN he can tell the whole world what a bumbling moronic spoiled-brat petty tyrant we have sitting in the White House, but NOT while the general is still in uniform.

OTOH, I keep thinking that maybe McCrystal, upon retiring, should be awarded that new medal for "heroic restraint" for not having *****slapped Obama during his meeting today. :thumb:
 
McCrystal should be disciplined "as a courts martial may direct" (that's the UCMJ, not me), or he should resign. THEN he can tell the whole world what a bumbling moronic spoiled-brat petty tyrant we have sitting in the White House, but NOT while the general is still in uniform.
Retirees remain under UCMJ.
 
Retirees remain under UCMJ.

...and are never prosecuted for their comments.

Recall all the retired Generals that criticized George W. Bush (funny how they were hailed as heroes and whistleblowers, unlike McCrystal, but that's a different issue).

Of course, we ARE dealing with a Stalinist in the White House, so anything is possible. :rolleyes:
 
...and are never prosecuted for their comments.

Recall all the retired Generals that criticized George W. Bush (funny how they were hailed as heroes and whistleblowers, unlike McCrystal, but that's a different issue).

Of course, we ARE dealing with a Stalinist in the White House, so anything is possible. :rolleyes:

Nice one, Zaphod. How true... and pathetic. :mad: What's being done, I mean, not the comment. The comment was good.
 
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Actually, deep down inside, I don't blame Obama for any of this. Even as the President, he should not be expected to know everything, and always be 100% up on everything. That's why he has people that work for him. And McCrystal has people ahead of him. He has the JCS (Joint Chiefs of Staff) and he also has the secretary of defense. BOTH of those groups have become more concerned with politics than the military and our mission. They are the ones who should be held accountable. They are the reason McCrystal couldn't do the job the way he thought it should be done. If we had a SEC Defense and Joint Chiefs who weren't worried about politics, none of this would be an issue. Where are THEY in all of this. But knowing that bunch, they probably threw McCrystal to the wolves. If the commander had a problem with one of my troops, I guarantee you that I'd be in the middle of the a$s chewing. Why aren't the Sec Defense and JCS in the middle of all this?
 
Actually, deep down inside, I don't blame Obama for any of this. Even as the President, he should not be expected to know everything, and always be 100% up on everything. That's why he has people that work for him. And McCrystal has people ahead of him. He has the JCS (Joint Chiefs of Staff) and he also has the secretary of defense. BOTH of those groups have become more concerned with politics than the military and our mission. They are the ones who should be held accountable. They are the reason McCrystal couldn't do the job the way he thought it should be done. If we had a SEC Defense and Joint Chiefs who weren't worried about politics, none of this would be an issue. Where are THEY in all of this. But knowing that bunch, they probably threw McCrystal to the wolves. If the commander had a problem with one of my troops, I guarantee you that I'd be in the middle of the a$s chewing. Why aren't the Sec Defense and JCS in the middle of all this?


Let's assume for the moment that everything you've said here is 100% true.

It doesn't matter.

McCrystal, whether intentionally or not, allowed criticism of the President to break out into the open. That cannot be permitted. Period. As much as I DESPISE Obama, he is the duly-elected (if utterly incompetent) CINC, and as such the General is out of line.

Now, regarding the politicization of the office of SECDEF and the JCS, what can I tell you? The former is a politically-appointed position, and the others are adminsitrative (and therefore political) positions. You wouldn't expect them to defend a Warrior-General like McCrystal and possibly lose their own hides in the process. Also, in this case the JCS isn't even in the chain of command. McCrystal is an operational commander, not an administrative one.

Where Obama and the SecDef CAN and SHOULD be held accountable is for is providing a rationale for not following what McCrystal recommended. He called for more troops, and Obama waffled for months and then only sent half the requested number. That's not McCrystal's fault, and if Afghanistan falls apart due to a lack of troops or lousy ROE, then it's the President's fault.

We'll see. I just hope a bunch of good Americans don't have to die in the process....


ETA: For those who may be wanting to think this is unique to The One, I'll remind you that not much time after Clinton was innaugurated, some Air Force General cracked a joke at an official function along the lines of, "Whoever would have thought we'de be taking orders from a lying, womanizing, dope-smoker." Despite the fact that he was 100% correct, he was still forced to retire within a week. The CINC is the CINC, and when you sign the dotted line to join the Armed Forces, one of the things you abrogate is yout First Amendment right to say whatever you want about the clown in office.
 
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General McChrystal has been relieved of his command. General David Petraeus will take his place.
 
General McChrystal has been relieved of his command. General David Petraeus will take his place.

Ouch, not that the relief was a surprise.






On a side note..... Petraeus, eh?

I wonder what MoveOn.org and the rest of the "Genral BetrayUs" crowd will be saying this afternoon? :yllol:
 
Especially the current crop of detached a**holes in the White House. :mad:

That said, it is never wise to publicly dis your boss, no matter how correct you may be. This is especially true for those in the military.

It looks like sore losers remain sore losers after they get whooped in two successive elections.
 
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