Basics of Becoming a Pilot

[kp2001]

Originally Posted by mombee

Docs and pilots are both valuable resources. To allow either to forego a commitment and train to be the other seems like both a waste of govt money and squandering of valuable assets. When trained aviators who have honored their commitment and gone to medical school on their own dime are willing to come back into the service as flight surgeons, it would not make economic sense for the govt to pay for the same result. And I am sure the new GI Bill will augment these ranks even more.

The new GI bill will have little to no impact on physician recruitment.

People who go to medical school on their own dime don't come back into the military with rare exception. There are very few physicians in the military who did not receive either the HPSP scholarship or attend USUHS. I would put it at around 5% or less. In my time in the service I have met three:

1) A cardiothoracic surgeon who was on the cover of Time magazine ( http://www.time.com/time/covers/0,16...841210,00.html ) who came into the Army as an O6.

2) An internal medicine physician who wanted to become an anesthesiologist so joined the Navy to do that residency.

3)A pain managment specialist who joined the Navy specifically to be a flight surgeon.

[Pima]

MOMBEE,

It may be it may not be. To go Med, after UPT I am assuming that there is an additional committment. The flight doc now has a better understanding of what a pilots body goes through compared to the flight doc that never went through UPT. I.E. Hornet who plans the pilot route will now have a better understanding why flyers will live with an ear infection before they would see the doc, why they will reset their own broken fingers or toes, why not to be rude or disgusting would swallow their own vomit...all of those things means DNIF. The last could mean DQ and loss of wings. As a pilot who has that experience, maybe, just maybe they can see the smaller signs and make a difference before they become big glaring signs.

I am not sure if I agree or disagree with you, but what I do know is that flight docs were there for us in the very worse health issues that our family endured, that includes diagnosing our DS at 4 with ASD (arterial septeral defect-heart), calling us at the ER at 10 at night to see what he could do, after our CC called him to say Bullet's daughter was bit 3 x by a copperhead (her 5 day check up was at the base, and Doc B, had called the hospital while she was still there to have her records transferred). It included coming to my home when I got chicken pox at the age of 33 to give me meds. I have many more stories, but the point is if that is what it takes to have top rate docs, than I am all for it!

[mombee]

Originally Posted by kp2001

In fact these are usually people who were prior pilots who then got out of the military to go to medical school and then came back in the military as physicians. The Navy has plenty of former pilots/nfo's as flight surgeons, there were actually three in my class alone.

Originally Posted by kp2001

People who go to medical school on their own dime don't come back into the military with rare exception.

Make up your mind. You are confusing me. I have known many pilots who have seen the handwriting on the wall that either their CO thinks they are unsafe getting aboard the boat at night or who have scared themselves enough to quit who still like to be around Naval Aviation and are smart enough to go to med school. Any many who get out within a few years regret it. With the new GI bill, it is kind of like an aligning of the stars. You might be surprised.

[kp2001]

I'm not waivering...I simply left out all of the details in the first post:

by pilots getting out and going to medical school I meant they get out and take the HPSP to attend a civilian medical school or attend USUHS. They will also at times be required to take a year or two betwen this happening because they either need to retake some classes that have "expired" for application purposes or never had them in the first place.

The new GI bill will have no effect for physician retention. There are already scholarship programs in place which allow you to still retain your GI bill benefits for future use. Those who use the GI bill for medical school won't come back in the military because they won't have any obligation to come back in the military. There is a huge difference between a pilot/nfo getting out, trying the civilian market and not liking it and an aviator who gets out and goes to medical school.

There is a world of difference between life in the line community and life in the medical corps when it comes to many issues. One is pay disparity. For most specialties you will make about 1/3 of the pay you would make in the civilian sector. There have also been financial analysis done showing the break even point for those who take the military scholarship vs those who don't. I think it is about the 7-10 year mark that a civilian physician will have overcome and surpassed the financial benefits you gain from taking the medical school scholarships. There are tons of reasons people aren't becoming military physicians, but they are getting into "the weeds" and not really the point of this thread. I'll try to stick with aviation.

The reason I say there are "plenty of prior navy pilots/nfos" who are now navy flight surgeons is because the Navy doesn't use the pilot-physician in the same way the air force does. In fact the Navy does not currently support this program. The Air Force continues to have them and I have met one who flew combat missions in Afghanistan. In the past the Navy has used this type of person as a test pilot or instructor pilots. These programs can really mess with a persons promotion rate as well. (as an aside)

[mombee]

Originally Posted by kp2001

I'm not waivering...I simply left out all of the details in the first post:

by pilots getting out and going to medical school I meant they get out and take the HPSP to attend a civilian medical school or attend USUHS. They will also at times be required to take a year or two betwen this happening because they either need to retake some classes that have "expired" for application purposes or never had them in the first place.

I guess this is what threw me:

In fact these are usually people who were prior pilots who then got out of the military to go to medical school and then came back in the military as physicians. The Navy has plenty of former pilots/nfo's as flight surgeons, there were actually three in my class alone.

This implied that they were out of the military while in med school while, in fact, those attending HPSP or USUHS are actually under military contract and have been in the military during their med school sojourn so I would consider them "in" instead of "out" while in med school. Just semantics I guess. Sorry for misinterpreting your post.

Originally Posted by kp2001

The new GI bill will have no effect for physician retention. There are already scholarship programs in place which allow you to still retain your GI bill benefits for future use. Those who use the GI bill for medical school won't come back in the military because they won't have any obligation to come back in the military. There is a huge difference between a pilot/nfo getting out, trying the civilian market and not liking it and an aviator who gets out and goes to medical school.

I wouldn't be too quick to make this statement. I think it will, in deed, have an effect on military aviators coming back into the military as MDs. Whether positive or negative, I am not sure. And whether or not ex-military aviators, in themselves, are an asset or detriment to military medicine, I have no idea but my speculation would be that it would be a positive asset to flight surgery.

In the past, HPSP or USUHS was basically the only avenue for a mid-career service academy aviator to get decent compensation while attending med school. Now, there is a very viable alternate. Actually, if there are med schools with comparable tuition to what the VA will cover, the stipend package for VA is better than HPSP, and the GI Bill could become the favored. Also, federal law allows only one military contract at a time, so, with VA, the individual would not be precluded from continuing flying with the active reserves. I guess one could argue time restraints but I know a dentist and an ophthalmologist who have continued their active reserve aviation careers both through med school and into their new civilian careers. And by using their GI benefits, they retain the choice of military or civilian medicine when they graduate. If all MDs are in it only for the money, there will probably be a drop in Naval Aviators with a flight surgeon second career. They will all go civilian. If all mid career naval aviators go to med school simply to remain in the Navy in what they consider a more satisfying and viable career path, the numbers will probably go up. If it is somewhere in the middle, the results could be where one might basically say "It had no effect".

However, a very interesting topic. I have heard a few mid career Naval Aviators discussing this very item. Should have paid more attention.