United States of America Service Academy Forums  

Go Back   United States of America Service Academy Forums > Other Sources of Commission > ROTC


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 13th March 2011
lsredmond lsredmond is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 100
Default Is Chemical engineering not an option for AFROTC

My DD received a type 2 AFROTC scholarship but the list of technical majors does not have chemical engineering. The website lists is but her paperwork does not. Does anyone know about this discrepancy? I guess she can choose chemistry as a major but she was hoping for ChemE.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 14th March 2011
Pima's Avatar
Pima Pima is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Nokesville, VA
Posts: 10,410
Default

Most likely she chose Chem and ChemE for her intended major. Just contact Maxwell. It shouldn't be a problem to change it to ChemE since she staying in a technical field. It only becomes an issue when you change from tech to non-tech.
__________________
Raising kids is part joy, part guerilla warfare - Ed Asner.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 14th March 2011
patentesq's Avatar
patentesq patentesq is offline
Parent
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 1,587
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pima View Post
Most likely she chose Chem and ChemE for her intended major. Just contact Maxwell. It shouldn't be a problem to change it to ChemE since she staying in a technical field. It only becomes an issue when you change from tech to non-tech.
Pima, DS's Type 2 says it is for "Any Major". Are there different levels of AFROTC Type 2 Scholarships? I thought the major only came into play for Type 1 scholarships.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 14th March 2011
Pima's Avatar
Pima Pima is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Nokesville, VA
Posts: 10,410
Default

Actually it exists for every scholarship..you are placed in as tech or non tech. Not major per se. In other words if you applied with an intended major in tech (Chem, EE, CS, etc) and wanted to switch to History, you need to get their approval because you are going tech to non-tech. Now if you enter in as a Chem major and wanted to switch to EE, you just inform them that is your new major since you are staying in the tech field.

The other thing to be cognizant of is, let's say you are going Chem and that is a 4 yr program, but want to now do EE which is 5 yrs, you need to contact them. The reason why is the AF is expecting you to graduate and enter the AD world in 4 yrs. 5 yrs places you into a different manpower yr for AD. Traditionally, they don't have an issue, but now a days with the force shape re-structuring it is not something I feel comfortable saying that if you are a scholarship cadet you will get the all clear.

Our DS was home this weekend and he stated they were just informed that 13 is going to be hit hard this yr, harder than 12 for SFT. LY they had 34 out of 63 C200's go to SFT, basically 50%. This yr they expect only 20 out of 60 getting the slot.

Now what does that mean to them?

It means that if they don't get SFT and are on scholarship, their scholarship is in jeopardy. They won't get to become a C300, which means they won't meet the AFSC board, and if they wanted rated, they are now boffed. They will go up for SFT again next yr, but here's their problem: Why would the AFROTC board select them when they were passed over the yr before, especially as they are downsizing?

That means the AFROTC scholarship can disappear because they can decide to cut them loose. Hard to pay for college when you relied on the scholarship, and now you are a sr.

I cannot pound into every posters cranium enough, be happy for the scholarship, but with that scholarship comes a very big burden. In this day and age, you can't go to school and think I have it for 4 yrs and party/mess around. As hard as you worked in hs for these grades, and ecs, you will need to keep doing it. This is no longer about getting a scholarship, it is now about keeping it and getting your dream career.

The AFROTC board doesn't draw a line and say all scholarship recipients go to SFT, and non-scholarship fight for the remaining positions. They clear the slate and you all start from scratch. Scholarship is what they call "masked". They do not know who is and who isn't. All they look at it is major, rank, gpa, PFT and AFOQT.

For some who lost out on a scholarship they can actually get SFT over scholarship, because the college may have offered merit and tied that merit to the gpa. I believe the min gpa for AFROTC is 2.8 or 3.0. Now take that cadet who has the AFROTC scholarship and the kid at VT with merit that reqs. 3.2 and no AFROTC scholarship, you can see how the non-scholarship cadet could get SFT over the scholarship. The non has a higher gpa, and the AFROTC board is going to give them weight for it.

This also occurs for the AFSC rated board. There is an actual site you can input your data to get your OM. From there you can figure out your chances of getting a rated slot. There 5 things you input into the equation:
1. Rank (#1-17 in a det of 17, it is the rank placement out of the size of the det going up for rated, not the entire det)
2. GPA
3. PCSM (AFOQT and TBAS scores)
4. SFT RANK (DG, top 10%, 1/3, etc)
5. PFA

Notice no SFT...no points...no points...no chance! How do you get SFT...GPA, PFA, rank.

Nowhere in there did you see scholarship or tech/non-tech, yet GPA is always in the equation.

I have seen too many cadets fall into the fallacy that if they just make the mins to keep the scholarship, even as a tech major, they have a better shot. This is a FALLACY. Techs will get a bump in points because course rigor, but at a certain point the scales will tip. They are not going to take the 2.8 CE that has no det involvement (jobs -no 1 in the list) over the cadet that is History with a 3.6 and very involved.

Commanders get that techs have a harder course curriculum, but their job is to groom future officers, and if they can't put a face to the name, it tells them that the cadet is either:
A. Not able to juggle school and ROTC
B. Is using ROTC for a scholarship

Hence, why should they rank them above the non-tech major who is involved, plus a higher gpa.

Same with scholarship vs non-scholarship tech.

Pound it into your craniums, come 1st day of ROTC this thought:

You know what they call a scholarship cadet?
Cadet!

You know what they call a non-scholarship cadet?
Cadet!

You know what they call a tech major cadet?
Cadet!

You know what they call a non-tech major cadet?
Cadet!

You are all equal. You all have to prove yourselves again. This time is under the eyes of ADAF officers day in day out in real life and not on paper from an abstract perspective!
__________________
Raising kids is part joy, part guerilla warfare - Ed Asner.

Last edited by Pima; 14th March 2011 at 04:35 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 14th March 2011
patentesq's Avatar
patentesq patentesq is offline
Parent
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 1,587
Default

Thanks for that useful information, Pima. In this day and age, it seems that the odds fresh out of college of gaining an active duty slot in any branch are MUCH, MUCH higher at a service academy than trying to go the ROTC route. My DS is very focused on ultimately going on AD, so this is something he has to consider along with everything else before choosing his commissioning path.

If my DS was pursuing the goal of simply earning a commission, then this risk posed by ROTC would be higher. But at the end of the day, if med-school-bound DS doesn't get an AD slot from college, he still has the option to go to med school first and then re-apply for a direct commission and AD slot again (the upside is that he will have less AD commitment via this route, while the downside is that it is more expensive for him).

DS sees a lot of value with being a line officer for 5 years, then separating for med school (with GI-Bill in hand), then re-entering the service of his choice (assuming the services still need doctors). I think this is his strategy if an Ed Delay isn't in the cards (serving AD for a few years will actually increase his chances to gain admission to a good med school, because the med school admissions officers value that experience). Of course, if he doesn't get very, very high grades in college, he won't have a chance at med school at all and will place his AD dreams in jeopardy. He understands that a lot is riding on his academic performance in college.

DS has a lot to think about over the next month.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 14th March 2011
lsredmond lsredmond is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 100
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pima View Post
Most likely she chose Chem and ChemE for her intended major. Just contact Maxwell. It shouldn't be a problem to change it to ChemE since she staying in a technical field. It only becomes an issue when you change from tech to non-tech.
Thank you for the information!
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 14th March 2011
lsredmond lsredmond is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 100
Default

Maxwell is telling us that Chemical Engineering is not a technical degree. Maybe we are not talking to the right person. Anyway, we asked them what kind of a degree is Chemical Engineering. Eagerly waiting for the answer.....
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 14th March 2011
sprog sprog is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Annapolis, MD
Posts: 963
Default

what is SFT? Is that what they call Camp now?
__________________
Ignorantia legis neminem excusat.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 14th March 2011
Pima's Avatar
Pima Pima is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Nokesville, VA
Posts: 10,410
Default

Summer Field Training at Maxwell. People will say I went to Maxwell1-6. This yr it is 1-5.

Rising jrs go (C200). Once completed they become a C300.

AFROTC does not call it camp, other branches may call it that, but typically AFROTC cadets call it FT or Maxwell.
__________________
Raising kids is part joy, part guerilla warfare - Ed Asner.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 14th March 2011
lsredmond lsredmond is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 100
Default

Maxwell is telling us that Chemical Engineering is a non-technical major. We must not be talking to the right person. So we asked them how an engineering major could be non-technical. Waiting for the response....
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 11:30 PM.


Arborry Hill Road Company, LLC Copyright ©2006-2014
Service Academy Forums® is a registered trademark of Arborry Hill Road Company, LLC
By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Ad Management plugin by RedTyger