VMI Class of 2016 Candidate

I just finished my file for the 4 year ROTC scholarship yesterday and am pretty relieved. Give me some feedback on what you think of my file..

PFT:
87 pushups
58 situps
6:02 Mile

Transcripts:
3.7 weighted GPA
27 ACT
1820 SAT
4 AP classes
Distinguished Foreign language diploma

EC:
Top Teen Attorney in Texas
Boys State delegate
Gold Presidential Services Award
Intern for Two Justice of The Peaces
Sales Advisor for Vector Marketing
Captain of Wrestling, Track, Powerlifting and Football Teams
Lettered in Golf, Baseball, Wrestling, Track, Football and Powerlifting
NHS delegate
STUCO officer
(a few other minor awards and involvement in community)

I was told that I "maxed out" my interview. Does that mean that I got a 200/200 or just filled every category that I could?

My #1 school for ROTC is VMI, so im ready to get on this October Review board and find out what happens! Id love to see how I stack up to others in the graduating high school class of 2012!! Thanks for the input!

Is that SAT score all three scores or just math and reading?

Its all three scores: Math 610, Reading 600, Writing 610. Math and Reading are only on a 1600 scale, whereas the cum. SAT is on a 2400 scale

The rotc services look at Math and Reading only. The 1210 score for math and reading is not a bad score at all and are probably good enough for general admission to VMI, but it may not be good enough for a scholarship, especially to VMI which is VERY competitive as it often a first choice for rotc applicants. For example, my DS had a combined math and reading score of 1400 and a weighted GPA of over 4.0 and had a first class Marine PFT (they do pull ups) and he did not get a Marine Option NROTC scholarship. He was also an Eagle Scout but didn't have your athletics, which are impressive and much more than good enough. My DS is currently a Rat at VMI on an Institute Scholar partial scholarship. ROTC has gotten *very* competitive and will only become more so as the budget tightens and the services face manpower cutbacks. My advice: Retake the SAT and get it as high as possible. Take the review course. Also improve your PFT. Your Pushups are good, the situps are light. For example, A passing grade at VMI for situps on its VFT is 60. I think the Army rotc now wants a two mile run for its PFT. Run your stats through the PFT calculator See, e.g., http://www.550cord.com/ Try and max it out. You are in a very competitive environment right now. And good luck to you!

Thanks for the advice! To clarify, I will not have to take the APFT until my first semester and matriculation at VMI. The PFT is a smaller version of the APFT that is required for the ROTC scholarship, so the calculator does not give me a score on the PFT. How does your son like VMI? I heard Lexington is beautiful in the fall/winter! I am looking forward to attending and hopefully playing football there next year.

Blake3348 said:

Thanks for the advice! To clarify, I will not have to take the APFT until my first semester and matriculation at VMI. The PFT is a smaller version of the APFT that is required for the ROTC scholarship, so the calculator does not give me a score on the PFT. How does your son like VMI? I heard Lexington is beautiful in the fall/winter! I am looking forward to attending and hopefully playing football there next year.

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Lexington is beautiful year-around, but especially so in the Fall (my favorite) and the Spring My DS has just finished Hell Week as a new Rat and has, as he says, survived, albeit a bit shell shocked at first. And he knew very well what he was getting into. They say that every Rat thinks about quitting at some point, but I know he won't because this is what he really wants: A really first class education with an outstanding academic environment and a first class military environment/training that cuts no corners and allows no excuses. Of course, he wants to be Marine Recon. I don't think he fully understands what that means (no 18 year old can) but he will learn.

My DS is looking forward to the Oath ceremony at New Market on 9/4. If the parents come down (and I will) they are excused from the Post for the afternoon, after they return from the New Market oath ceremony and the parade. He is really looking forward to that.

I think you really got to want this sort of life. It is not for everyone. If you haven't done so, I would definitely visit for an overnight and talk to the cadets. Do the same for the other schools on your short list. There are a lot of differences between the Senior Military Colleges, some subtle some not so subtle. Certainly huge differences between a SMC and regular ROtC. My DS visited them all the SMCs save for Virginia Tech but liked VMI the best, even though it is costing the most. Read "The Hard Corps, 21st Century Leadership Development" by Stewart Husted. It is all about the leadership training cadets get at VMI written by someone who knows. It is available at Amazon.com. As they say, YMMV. And good luck.

No class of 2016. Going around saying that is a great way to make yourself noticed.
Anyway, yes, you look like you will easily be admitted.
EDIT: Ah, that Army. Work on your situps, otherwise you will fail the VFT. You look like your fast but not very strong. Make sure you can do lots of pullups too.

roadhog said:

No class of 2016. Going around saying that is a great way to make yourself noticed.

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When you get the chance, can you please clarify this statement? It's an important point, but it can be pretty confusing for people who aren't familiar with the Class System and don't know terms like "ratmass" and "2012+3."

roadhog said:

I don't know whats with your situps though. If you can do 18 pullups and run a 6 minute mile, you should easily get 100 situps, at least if you do them in the Marine PFT style.

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One of the key points here is the difference between situps (the requirement for the VFT) and crunches (the USMC PFT equivalent).

The VFT requires a full situp, which uses more muscles than USMC-style crunches. While crunches test primarily core strength, situps require your leg muscles to get all the way up.

Blake3348, since it sounds like your goal is to go Army, you should focus on situps, instead of crunches. The VFT uses the same standards as the APFT for what counts as a proper situp.

When you plan your workouts, crunches can be helpful if you're trying to get your abs in shape, but focus primarily on improving your form for full situps. Doing crunches will strengthen your abs in the short term, but long term, you won't improve your ability to do situps unless you practice doing situps.

Jackie M. Briski
VMI Class of 2009

Always a rat in the ratmass of '06+3 at heart.

roadhog said:

EDIT: Ah, that Army. Work on your situps, otherwise you will fail the VFT. You look like your fast but not very strong. Make sure you can do lots of pullups too.

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His situps are good. The army ROTC scholarship pft is 1 minute of situps.

@Roadhog, I will be more conscious of the title's that I am posting a thread under, but to clarify I was simply stating that I am a "Candidate" for the VMI class that WOULD be graduating in 2016 (rats of 2012). Also, I was doing full situps and not crunches for my PFT and was docked about 5 situps because I did not go all the way down to the ground. As Packer said, I had 60 seconds to do the 58 full sit ups, what should my goal be for future reference? Thank you for the insight!

Blake- don't sweat the details with stuff like not using class of number until you are done with the Ratline. That's a VMI thing but until you are in barracks- it's pretty much a nonissue. You are for certain applying for the class of 2016. Once you get accepted- eh- then keep in mind Rats have no class - they are in fact known as a "Rat mass" and usually called by their dykes class year +3.


If you did 87/58/6.02 mile in one minute- you are looking pretty good. For VMI you will also have to take the VFT- which will include pullups. If you are a football player, you know that pullups are tougher the more body mass you have. The standards for the VFT and a 10 week prep program are listed on the VMI site:
http://www.vmi.edu/Content.aspx?id=2414

The Army PT standard is gonna change some time in the next year or so - but until then- make sure you put some miles in. If you really want to burn the 2 miles up- you need to practice at 3 or 4 miles IMHO. Also- if you haven't been doing situps then running- it's usually a bad combination the first few times you do so, (tight cuts that will slow you donw). finally- Pushups are done correctly or they don't get counted so make sure that you knock them off both fast and correctly ( 90 degree bend of elbows- back a straight plane - no butt in the air!) and situps- hands have to stay behind head

Here is a pretty good link to the current Army APFT with a training plan. http://www.apft-standards.com/

If you really want to stand out- train for the Max - not the 18-21 year old max, but the max which is shockingly the 27-31 year old standard. You will turn a few heads if you show up for your first APFT and blow it away!

If you are looking to play Football at VMI- have you contacted the coaching staff with your information yet? NCAA D1 recruiting rules are pretty arcane- so I think that the best advice I can give you is to contact the athletic department directly using the form and link below:
https://www2.vmi.edu/Forms/athletic/show.asp
Having lived in Texas for about 6 years- I've been arguing for a while that we need a few more Texas 5A or 4A HS ball players in our program. We don't much fish outside of Va/ MD/NC waters for recruits and the results kind of show that we need to cast our lines out farther. So bring some of that Lone Star State brand of ball to Lexington!

Lexington is beautiful but - while your parents will enjoy it as a quaint, rather upscale historic tourist town- as a cadet you will not appreciate it that much. It takes graduation to appreciate Lex Vegas

Good luck!

Bruno,

Thank you for the in-depth response and feedback. I am glad that I now know the correct terminology. I had a shoulder surgery that, although I am able to play with this year, I do not think I am anticipating on playing with in college. If I decide that I want to play at VMI, I will definitely walk-on. Do they allow recreational workouts in the weight room or do you have to be a part of a sport? Also, things like protein shakes, creatine, etc....are they considered to be contraband or are they permissible in barracks? I powerlift and run track, so I am expecting to participate in both of those sports at VMI. What was your experience with the "Ratline"? Does VMI have a combat shooting squad similar to the academies? I am anticipating on commissioning and want to go to Ranger School after my required service as a Platoon Leader. I know I packed several questions into one thread, but I greatly appreciate your insight and advice as I prepare for VMI. Thank you!

I stand corrected. Your PFT is really good.